Despicable behavior

[DanielWinner]

You lose all intensive if you stop to play > to trade.

Many here log in this game to have an epic battle.

You can't have "rock", "epic"... if you think for gear first, your mind is biased and the battles will be biased OR the battle does not take place... what a deception, why we play this game ?
Your realm mates in a war game need trust and brotherhood.

Trading a zone, losing a battle to win gear or something is not a normal habit in a game or in real life and I don't speak about realm pride or roleplaying; Is just about others players playing with you, they can not have any trust in you in the future.

How in future if on the chat WB, /2, /t4 you speak or give informations players will believe in you when you will say "push", they will think its a trap that guy need gear for his other toon or something like that... that all.

What if I tell you that someone's fun and epicness are at forts? So whose Fun and Epicness are more important? Why someone is allowed to have fun at keeps with unbalanced numbers which we have for 2-3 years now but some are not allowed to have fun at forts where numbers are more balanced and there is also a huge reward.

[flintboth]

war is everywhere = fun is every where

I can understand and accept certain peoples have fun in gearing but it is a war game first, that is a game who attract players first not consumers/traders.

make : gear grind > battles = farmers > warriors

Warhammer is a licence game who attract war (warriors) players here, in this topic we speak about a real difference between people login in RoR today.
There are players and farmers online today, if there was only farmers in game there will be no war.

Fortress is the new place to be for warriors and farmers, GREAT but do we have to lose all other intensive in all others maps.

And about low characters level do they have fun in fort ?
I mean it's not fair to trade a zone for them, is not fun and that don't give to them a reason to continue to play this game if they are new comers.

[Aurandilaz]

War might be everywhere, but gear is locked behind fortress grind.
So yeah, maybe its hard to explain to some people that, thanks to current fort+invader grind designs, the only way to progress your character is to throw in zones, and let enemy cap keeps. Unless said design changes and devs start to consider "maybe throwing in zones and losing on purpose is a bad game design", until then, your only way to optimize Invader medal gains is to let enemy push with minimal hindrance. Most of may not like the idea, but it doesn't change the fact that expected outcome from successful BC defence for Destro is 0 Invader progression, and from throwing in the towel, 4 Invader medals.

Obviously for some classes Invader is "lul" choice, but for some classes, say Choppa/Slayer its big gain compared to Vanq, and for classes like SW/WL/Mara/SH, it's also beneficial to have said set bonuses when it comes to maximizing stats.

And as someone above said, for some fort might be the "fun" they want to experience, and in this situation those who on purpose prevent them from gearing up, are in fact griefing them.
For others, whose "fun" is defending another T4 keep and doing it for the "realmpride", then those who prefer losing endzone and opening fort, are causing grief.


Don't hate the players who all choose how to enjoy the game - blame the system that causes people of same realm to be at each others throats due to a shitty system. Having finished Choppa Invader grind with about 50 lost forts (big thanks to the orderzerg who keeps farming/pushing them nonstop), I have no intention of pushing any other char through said shitshow, maybe by accidents Slayer might finish in year 2021 or 2022 just because how "fun" it is to leech 30k renown for showing up at right time.

[CoffeeForAll]

You lose all intensive if you stop to play > to trade.

Many here log in this game to have an epic battle.

You can't have "rock", "epic"... if you think for gear first, your mind is biased and the battles will be biased OR the battle does not take place... what a deception, why we play this game ?
Your realm mates in a war game need trust and brotherhood.

Trading a zone, losing a battle to win gear or something is not a normal habit in a game or in real life and I don't speak about realm pride or roleplaying; Is just about others players playing with you, they can not have any trust in you in the future.

How in future if on the chat WB, /2, /t4 you speak or give informations players will believe in you when you will say "push", they will think its a trap that guy need gear for his other toon or something like that... that all.

What if I tell you that someone's fun and epicness are at forts? So whose Fun and Epicness are more important? Why someone is allowed to have fun at keeps with unbalanced numbers which we have for 2-3 years now but some are not allowed to have fun at forts where numbers are more balanced and there is also a huge reward.

I won't argue that people should attempt to work towards what they enjoy the most in the game. But there is a massive difference in working for what they want, and trying to sabotage what the other people on their own realm are doing. The new end-game became the forts, but let's assume that we want new players to stick around when they see a faction try and backstab eachother for something as pintless as a few medallions or a potential gold bag. I mean, seriously.

We refused to give up the keep, and got flamed for it both during and after the defense. Should this be the new norm? Is this truly what we strive for in an RvR game? Because if all we want are the elitists, then the game will drop in numbers. Just take a look at how many players do 6v6.. it truly is impressive how many people enjoy the "high-end" gameplay.

As an example, look at that weirdo server Apoc. I suspect that it failed due to the incredibly low population and the arrogant elite players insulting every single person that doesn't do exactly as they demand.

[Jastojan]

Hello everyone,

I was in BC yesterday too and want to say my opinion. But,

first I have to say, that I am relatively new here and RoR playing about 3-4 months now (but not a MMO newbie - played WoW about 8-9 years). When I joined this game I was amazed how awesome this game is when it comes to RvR. Nice classes and spells AND huge battles. I enjoyed every open rvr and was happy like a young child (first month). Finally I found THE GAME. After few first impressions and "WOW" effect I saw some negatives too - I started as SW on order side won almost every open RvR for order and did not care about eq (but get it realy fast - and RR 50+). But when I saw Destro were losing more often than Order, so there was no challenge. I switched to Destro (I was always Horde wow player and love orcs but wanted to make a change).

And yes. Not many loses, but not many wins. The game gets a bit more challenging but who wants to lose forever? So many loses - because of - "let´em win guys" tact. I was thinking if I did good when switched to Destro. I was about to give it up and stop playing this game because of this - and what happened (almost) yesterday. And what it was? It was a perfect example. Some players in the game (and here on this topic too - oh my...) wanted to let the opponents win. Yes. And why? Because they wanted their marks for better equip. I understad that the goal of every player is not the same, but want to sacrifice the time and joy of all players for marks or 1 "better" item (for few of all players)? But the number is not important. The POINT is important. The main goal of the game is not letting the opponents win if the situation is not looking very good. I was in few battles we was about to lose but we won in the end. The main arguments for "let´em win guys" are:
1) the game doesnt look we could even win - yes, but who knows how it will end (in the end)? This is not argument for me - no1 is a seer to know what will happen? And if we turn the game to our win, oh my, what a win it can be! This is why are we playing or not?
2) Better geared players from best guilds wants their eq, because they are the main reason why are we winning - are we realy winning with "let´em win guys" tact?... I dont want to make a discussion if the afking full invader player makes bigger impact on the RvR than the playing conq or low eq player.
3) Better geared players from best guilds wants their eq - this is the only argument which I am OK with. Of course I want to have a good teammates on my side. I will give it to you If I could. Realy. But. Does the invader eq realy worth to "let´em win guys" tact and sacrifice the time and patience of all players? Will you enjoy your best eq then? Will you enjoy it when you know how you get it (that sacrifice I was talking about)? And how? Will you play to death then? Will you do everything for win THEN?
...

I dont know guys.

I was fort maybe 3 times? Many many times I won the opne zone for Order and I was fort only 2 times (I let my place to others). I dont need to have the best eq to enjoy the game. I want to have better eq of course, but it is not my objective, not for the price... (this is only me, I understand when the others need it, realy - but it is sad, that the game is in the state where many players are bound to play this "comfortable" way to get their eq when situation in the zone does not look good - this is the problem). I enjoyed every open zone so much, I didnt care about "better" eq while playing and didn care about we will lose or win until we fought well. I enjoyed the fort too, but not su much as the open zones.
I have to say that yesterdays BC deff was one of the very best games I ever played here on the server. This battle in our keep was so exciting - healers were ressing as hell and the players realy wanted to deff the keep. And we did it! This moment was why I play this game. I am not frustrated because of the final lose!

I have to say BIG THANK to all leaders, all players who decide to deff and play like hereos! THANK YOU!



I
I
I
I
This!

Urshark

Thank to all devs who are here and let us play and enjoy the game!

[peterthepan3]

You lose all intensive if you stop to play > to trade.

Many here log in this game to have an epic battle.

You can't have "rock", "epic"... if you think for gear first, your mind is biased and the battles will be biased OR the battle does not take place... what a deception, why we play this game ?
Your realm mates in a war game need trust and brotherhood.

Trading a zone, losing a battle to win gear or something is not a normal habit in a game or in real life and I don't speak about realm pride or roleplaying; Is just about others players playing with you, they can not have any trust in you in the future.

How in future if on the chat WB, /2, /t4 you speak or give informations players will believe in you when you will say "push", they will think its a trap that guy need gear for his other toon or something like that... that all.

What if I tell you that someone's fun and epicness are at forts? So whose Fun and Epicness are more important? Why someone is allowed to have fun at keeps with unbalanced numbers which we have for 2-3 years now but some are not allowed to have fun at forts where numbers are more balanced and there is also a huge reward.

I won't argue that people should attempt to work towards what they enjoy the most in the game. But there is a massive difference in working for what they want, and trying to sabotage what the other people on their own realm are doing. The new end-game became the forts, but let's assume that we want new players to stick around when they see a faction try and backstab eachother for something as pintless as a few medallions or a potential gold bag. I mean, seriously.

We refused to give up the keep, and got flamed for it both during and after the defense. Should this be the new norm? Is this truly what we strive for in an RvR game? Because if all we want are the elitists, then the game will drop in numbers. Just take a look at how many players do 6v6.. it truly is impressive how many people enjoy the "high-end" gameplay.

As an example, look at that weirdo server Apoc. I suspect that it failed due to the incredibly low population and the arrogant elite players insulting every single person that doesn't do exactly as they demand.

The whole Fort situation had nothing to do with elitism, so I don't know why you're trying to make connections where they don't exist? Pretty disingenuous, tbh.

People still do 6v6 btw, how many people are doing 24v24 over blobVblob?

Also: why is everyone so s e n s i t i v e

[zgolec666]

Is the right incentive just to make some other reward for defending? Revert gear bags back to the “only for attackers” model so that people feel the need to push forts rather than ignore final zone to get a defense?

Because if you want Invader I don’t really see the point in defending that last zone other than to battle for a reservation when its busy.

In your proposed model no one would even bother to defend fort :p

[CoffeeForAll]

What if I tell you that someone's fun and epicness are at forts? So whose Fun and Epicness are more important? Why someone is allowed to have fun at keeps with unbalanced numbers which we have for 2-3 years now but some are not allowed to have fun at forts where numbers are more balanced and there is also a huge reward.

I won't argue that people should attempt to work towards what they enjoy the most in the game. But there is a massive difference in working for what they want, and trying to sabotage what the other people on their own realm are doing. The new end-game became the forts, but let's assume that we want new players to stick around when they see a faction try and backstab eachother for something as pintless as a few medallions or a potential gold bag. I mean, seriously.

We refused to give up the keep, and got flamed for it both during and after the defense. Should this be the new norm? Is this truly what we strive for in an RvR game? Because if all we want are the elitists, then the game will drop in numbers. Just take a look at how many players do 6v6.. it truly is impressive how many people enjoy the "high-end" gameplay.

As an example, look at that weirdo server Apoc. I suspect that it failed due to the incredibly low population and the arrogant elite players insulting every single person that doesn't do exactly as they demand.

The whole Fort situation had nothing to do with elitism, so I don't know why you're trying to make connections where they don't exist? Pretty disingenuous, tbh.

People still do 6v6 btw, how many people are doing 24v24 over blobVblob?

Also: why is everyone so s e n s i t i v e

I may have worded that in a less than stellar way. My problem is not the desire to get to the forts (it should be the enemy fort people desire to go to), but the attitude that the rest of the war progression is unimportant, and all that matters is the gear. Who knows, maybe it will all change once the city sieges are released. But by then, it will be such a colossal effort to try and change the way people play the game, that I fear that everyone will want to get to the cities just as swiftly as they do the forts.

My hurt feelings are from being flamed at for doing what we are all supposed to do.. try and win absolutely everywhere. Or to stall the enemy for as long as we possibly can. Was there a reason beyond getting gear, that people wanted to go to the fort? The keeps are just as easy to defend, provided that the same amount of players are there.

[Jastojan]

Is the right incentive just to make some other reward for defending? Revert gear bags back to the “only for attackers” model so that people feel the need to push forts rather than ignore final zone to get a defense?

Because if you want Invader I don’t really see the point in defending that last zone other than to battle for a reservation when its busy.

In your proposed model no one would even bother to defend fort :p

And what about smaller "loot" like bag of potions or talisman? I think it could be worthy motivation to deff keep

[MeanMachine7519]

Oh an other post where an unstuff lowbie pug cries because end game ppl dont do mindless thing meh
FMJ (one of the few ORGANIZED and COMPETITIVE guild we have) trying to get Invader and not spending all night in BC how mean are they!
Like getting fort is crime now , if u wanna def zone DO IT but tell ppl who has spend way more time than u playing without gear goal (10 month ago End game gear was Conq/Dom) that they have to fight a zerg hours for nothing.

In the other hand i dont like either when ppl spam in /2 "Stop fighting , let them have it so we can go fort" if u dont wanna fight it's your choise but respect the others who just want to have fun in a zone.

So basically i dont see anything to get "shocked,sicken and outraged" about what happened yesterday in BC just ppl who want their end game gear.
What really make me sick these days are all those new players that tell u what to do and all the crybabies in destro spamming /ad /5 /6 because they cant detaunt a wl