[SW] General Guide

[Mystriss]

<removed to avoid conflicting opinions and any further confusion>

[Manatikik]

That's all very good but have you played on this server? You must know that the flight time of an arrow on this server is broken so it flies much more slower than it was on live, basically applying those fluffy Flame Arrows and other underperforming skills will take you a lot of time even w/o possible dodges/parries/blocks which happen quite a lot after defense changes. Also I don't know how Draw Blood with 0 points in Assault tree could help you, especially if you switch the stance right after you applied it (server will check your stats with every dot tick so it won't cause any damage w/o much strength). It's all about time management here.

Hmm I haven't noticed /that/ much flight time difference between RoR servers and live servers. Though, as far as DoT timers, longer flight time is actually beneficial to suit the purpose of overloading healers with surprise burst as one could theoretically apply both SA and Vengeance prior to their burst + finisher combo of preference. I shall endeavor to do some testing on that as I've just been rotating the two.


Good thought on DB, I will check the ticky damage logs this weekend and report back. It is true I tend to work "in the reverse" (from ranged to melee) thus Draw Blood is the last of my DoTs before vengeance/SA application.

FtW, FS, and BHA all have noticeably longer flight times. Like really noticeable.


You really should never need SA currently due to numerous factors and should take it off your action bar. DB works the way he says it does for sure and is a pretty useless skill atm too. If you're spec'd at all into Assault I would not use it ever.

[Mystriss]

I had simply wanted to offer my personal advice and insights on LA - didn't really think about the thread title here and was kind of a take it or leave it thing based on play style and what one was doing in game. However, this isn't my guide obviously, its not my thread, and apparently not my place to give advice.

I realize that a lot of folks are into cookie-cutter builds as being advised in here, and that such things are totally not my bag, so I'll just keep my mouth shut and let ya'll tell everyone exactly what to run and how to play their characters.

[Manatikik]

I had simply wanted to offer my personal advice and insights on LA - didn't really think about the thread title here and was kind of a take it or leave it thing based on play style and what one was doing in game. However, this isn't my guide obviously, its not my thread, and apparently not my place to give advice.

I realize that a lot of folks are into cookie-cutter builds as being advised in here, and that such things are totally not my bag, so I'll just keep my mouth shut and let ya'll tell everyone exactly what to run and how to play their characters.

No issues with people giving their opinions. Only issue is most of your experience is from Live (and it helped a lot of people, me included) and SW is night and day different from Live. And yes this is a general build guide for people to be introduced to SW but none of those builds are the meta end all be all builds and I know the two most active people who are giving advice in here (Dansari and myself) don't and wouldn't run these builds due to ranks, gear, and type of environment played in.


And it's not about telling people how to play their SWs but giving them the proper information so they can make their own decisions.

[dansari]

Yah there's a lot of historical context for SW given how drastically it's changed on RoR. And with that, the meta has shifted a lot. I'm certainly not one to advocate telling people how to play their class, but I do want people to know how best to play their class (since that's ultimately what the people want who come looking for advice).

[Mystriss]

Fenryl, folks, I'm just going to be blunt. I kind of realized that this thread wasn't a good place for me when you noted that "puggers" could play "any old way" implying that both they and their enemies suck. I thought if I gently pointed out the obvious bias ya'll would come around to realizing that open warband “realm” play is, not only very common for new SW’s, but actually enjoyable for a lot of players on RoR.

I do not look down on pug players in any way, I do not see them as inferior to folks who play in premades (in fact, in a number of ways, it’s the complete opposite in my opinion.) I also personally feel that this "elitist attitude" snubs a large portion of SW who would be searching for a “general guide” on the class by dismissing their need and/or desire to play decently in the “realm game” of open warband(s).

As I said though, it’s not my guide and not my thread, so I'll just keep my mouth shut in here and let ya'll do your more specialized thing.

[peterthepan3]

Fenryl, folks, I'm just going to be blunt. I kind of realized that this thread wasn't a good place for me when you noted that "puggers" could play "any old way" implying that both they and their enemies suck. I thought if I gently pointed out the obvious bias ya'll would come around to realizing that open warband “realm” play is, not only very common for new SW’s, but actually enjoyable for a lot of players on RoR.

I do not look down on pug players in any way, I do not see them as inferior to folks who play in premades (in fact, in a number of ways, it’s the complete opposite in my opinion.) I also personally feel that this "elitist attitude" snubs a large portion of SW who would be searching for a “general guide” on the class by dismissing their need and/or desire to play decently in the “realm game” of open warband(s).

As I said though, it’s not my guide and not my thread, so I'll just keep my mouth shut in here and let ya'll do your more specialized thing.

I dunno why you're taking so much personal offence from people giving cookie cutter builds that are designed to promote/facilitate to optimal play, and in regards to the pug comments? Noone is being condescending; rather, people are just saying that in such environments, any spec can work because the skill calibre is (usually) pretty low. The specs being discussed, i.e. those that you would call cookie-cutter, are designed to fend off against competent groups: such specs for SW are limited to (probably) 2 - heavy assault, or skirm.

If you wanna run a full int-spec'd SW, noone is stopping you.

[dansari]

My comments certainly weren't meant to degrade anyone's preferred playstyle. Play what and how you want, but if you are interested in learning more about what or why something is "good," I think this guide is a good starting point.

[dansari]

You really should never need SA currently due to numerous factors and should take it off your action bar. DB works the way he says it does for sure and is a pretty useless skill atm too. If you're spec'd at all into Assault I would not use it ever.

I'm trying to find a way to make SA work but I just don't see the point much... does anyone find use for this ability in assault spec? The only time I think it would be remotely useful is if you've already got two dots on a target from range, pop SA, then rapid fire, but ultimately that's really just fluff damage if you're vs competent healers and you're assault specced.

As for DB, it does have the +25% crit chance from Merc Soldier; do you use that in a regular rotation? I find myself using it if I need to overload damage on a target and they don't die to initial burst...

[Manatikik]

You really should never need SA currently due to numerous factors and should take it off your action bar. DB works the way he says it does for sure and is a pretty useless skill atm too. If you're spec'd at all into Assault I would not use it ever.

I'm trying to find a way to make SA work but I just don't see the point much... does anyone find use for this ability in assault spec? The only time I think it would be remotely useful is if you've already got two dots on a target from range, pop SA, then rapid fire, but ultimately that's really just fluff damage if you're vs competent healers and you're assault specced.

As for DB, it does have the +25% crit chance from Merc Soldier; do you use that in a regular rotation? I find myself using it if I need to overload damage on a target and they don't die to initial burst...

I dare say SA is even more useless in Assault due to double ini debuff. I only ever use it for Festerbombs and even then I'm hesitant because it slows your RF and FtW follow up. I just think it needs a rework for it to be viable in RoR honestly; it worked alright in Live because all you were was either a Festerbomb or a LS not most the time in groups.


I honestly never use DB cause it does about the same damage as SS and the plan is to use BHA SS and a SFA/takedown while closing the gap to do the real damage. So in my thought process why try to add another dot instead of a WS or BA? If I'm on a healer a well timed OS will net a lot for effective damage than a DB and if I need to add more DoTs to a DPS then their guard either didn't get punted in time for us to drop them and I should be engaging on a different target with BHA and SS. Just my thought process but if it works for you more power to you.