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Faction Balance

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havartii
Posts: 423

Faction Balance

Post#1 » Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:34 pm

So Basically RVR has become a Medallion farm. If anyone has been playing lately there are no meaningful fights (there are occasional good battles) But for the most part one side just blobs around massively outnumbering the other side. It is no contest. I really don't see how people think this is fun? But is more of a farm to quickly obtain gear sets, weapons ect. So what can we do about this? We must reduce the amount of rr and medallions per aao. This would include player kills and keep takes. Yes the original aao system was put in place to reward the outnumbered side. But when you can run around for weeks un challenged for anything in the lakes, something more needs to be done. I don't know the exact numbers of how things should work. But there needs to be something in place that will discourage everyone playing one side to farm.
Last edited by havartii on Tue Jan 07, 2020 12:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
Order: 70 AM / 76 RP/ 72 Knight/ 58 WH
Destro: 82 Sham / 79 Zealot/ 70 DoK /70 Magus /68 Mara
Many alts on both sides now ruined by new currency change

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Sulorie
Posts: 7219

Re: Fraction Balance

Post#2 » Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:48 pm

havartii wrote: Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:34 pm So Basically RVR has become a Medallion farm. If anyone has been playing lately there are no meaningful fights (there are occasional good battles) But for the most part one side just blobs around massively outnumbering the other side. It is no contest. I really don't see how people think this is fun? But is more of a farm to quickly obtain gear sets, weapons ect. So what can we do about this? We must reduce the amount of rr and medallions per aao. This would include player kills and keep takes. Yes the original aao system was put in place to reward the outnumbered side. But when you can run around for weeks un challenged for anything in the lakes, something more needs to be done. I don't know the exact numbers of how things should work. But there needs to be something in place that will discourage everyone playing one side to farm.
When you outnumber the enemy by 100% you already get zero rewards for kills.
Dying is no option.

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Shalktonin
Posts: 203

Re: Fraction Balance

Post#3 » Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:25 pm

Adding on to Sulorie there is no Guarantee that will push people to another side. Some times i just wanna faceroll the dirty folks on the other side. if i get rewards so be it the gnashing of teeth and the hate tells i get are sometimes rewards enough.
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havartii
Posts: 423

Re: Fraction Balance

Post#4 » Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:29 pm

@Sulorie not true, I was playing today conq medallions were dropping like nobody's business. Perhaps the number could be reduced from 100%? like it could scale? I'm not sure how hard that would be and there a lot of things that need to be addressed. But I think a discussion should be had, and a possible solution could come out of it. There should be rewards for taking zones , keeps ect. but should scale with aao. The harder the fight the more rewards you get. Having a leader on follow and pressing a couple buttons once and a while should not be so profitable.
Order: 70 AM / 76 RP/ 72 Knight/ 58 WH
Destro: 82 Sham / 79 Zealot/ 70 DoK /70 Magus /68 Mara
Many alts on both sides now ruined by new currency change

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Manatikik
Posts: 1249

Re: Fraction Balance

Post#5 » Tue Jan 07, 2020 12:33 am

So the easiest way to balance fractions is to find a common denominator of the bottom numbers (so like 1/3 and 1/2 its 2/6 and 3/6) and then even out the top half of the fraction.


Hope this helps!
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Wam
Posts: 803

Re: Faction Balance

Post#6 » Tue Jan 07, 2020 4:14 am

havartii wrote: Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:34 pm So Basically RVR has become a Medallion farm. If anyone has been playing lately there are no meaningful fights (there are occasional good battles) But for the most part one side just blobs around massively outnumbering the other side. It is no contest. I really don't see how people think this is fun? But is more of a farm to quickly obtain gear sets, weapons ect. So what can we do about this? We must reduce the amount of rr and medallions per aao. This would include player kills and keep takes. Yes the original aao system was put in place to reward the outnumbered side. But when you can run around for weeks un challenged for anything in the lakes, something more needs to be done. I don't know the exact numbers of how things should work. But there needs to be something in place that will discourage everyone playing one side to farm.
When hasn't it been a medallion farm? was that way on live too...

been that way here too especially since conq farm and all the rest years ago

From 6 man's on both sides...

Phalanx, TUP, NRM and others on destro

CNTK, Bitterstones, Beavers on order

and even the best pug leaders like GDY and King Ocara, Erihon...

Atleast the final blow = reward was changed to most damage done to prevent that drama over kill stealing...

Getting medallions means you are fighting and killing... to me that is playing the game, instead of afk standing on bo

as for orvr being zergy its been that way along time, but its always the other side doing it... never your own side, because its just a "event" or alliance co-ordination if you do it... but other side are hand holders even though they run alone and barely communicate :oops:

as for faction balance... Destro OP! Order OP! Grass is always greener (both sides have things the other want)... It would help if people played to their strengths before any reasonable unbiased discussion could be had on balance (which isn't going to happen on these forums with everyones tinted glasses)... as for numbers both sides population fluctuates.

They've made progression alot more obtainable and less korean MMO over the years... you should be happy with current system compared to there old system where i am sure many people would complain again :lol:

So what is the problem? people will always play destro because order tanks are ugly, and some people will want to be the "good guys"...

the main issue is mostly fortress based but that is a bigger issue and more complex and dev's have been tweaking and working on ways to fix and refine it... but its hard almost impossible for them to change player mentality... they cannot stop weak (or tactical depending how you look at it #realmpride2020) of players throwing zones then countering just for end game gear progression... it simply is what it is. Not ideal or enjoyable gameplay but a stop gap. Fortresses effect orvr, and effect inner community relations and toxicity where people point fingers and blame one another... but again that is player mentality problem of zero accountability and easier to pass the buck.

If things get really bad and desperate, maybe we will work on our order lowbies and try balance the scales... but again swings and roundabouts it goes back and forth day to day hour to hour... and with system to prevent cheesing the system doing such things requires more precision 8-)
Wamizzle Guild Leader [TUP]
Wamizzle Guild Leader [The Unlikely Plan]

havartii
Posts: 423

Re: Faction Balance

Post#7 » Tue Jan 07, 2020 5:05 am

Yea I do remember it being similar at times on live. I also remember we had leaders on the underdog side who would be able to avoid the blob and farm aao. I haven't seen much of that at all on this server. If you consider 3 warbands running over 1 for medallions is how the game should be played? Well our ideas are very different. Take away player kill rewards completely in that much of an over pop. I don't think that would be enough, I'm really not sure of the answer. I'm sure once Destro fully gears out a couple of toons or gets bored, they will switch to their order alts and then it will start on order side. I have tried the farm but I just fall asleep It is ultra boring. So I guess we will just have to accept that underdog side is just going to play Scenario's and log in for Forts? Sad
Order: 70 AM / 76 RP/ 72 Knight/ 58 WH
Destro: 82 Sham / 79 Zealot/ 70 DoK /70 Magus /68 Mara
Many alts on both sides now ruined by new currency change

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Wam
Posts: 803

Re: Faction Balance

Post#8 » Tue Jan 07, 2020 5:26 am

havartii wrote: Tue Jan 07, 2020 5:05 am Yea I do remember it being similar at times on live. I also remember we had leaders on the underdog side who would be able to avoid the blob and farm aao. I haven't seen much of that at all on this server. If you consider 3 warbands running over 1 for medallions is how the game should be played? Well our ideas are very different. Take away player kill rewards completely in that much of an over pop. I don't think that would be enough, I'm really not sure of the answer. I'm sure once Destro fully gears out a couple of toons or gets bored, they will switch to their order alts and then it will start on order side. I have tried the farm but I just fall asleep It is ultra boring. So I guess we will just have to accept that underdog side is just going to play Scenario's and log in for forts?
which timezone do you usually play?

The game is very simple, if you join pugs you are not going to see much advanced plays on underdog (you lucky to get one healer per a party and guards that guard and use hold the line properly)... only GDY/Ocara and Erihon really did that from my experience... a couple of others too but not quite to the same more advanced level, and thats because these leaders was semi organised + above and usually had a stable core of people wanting to join them because they got results and tried...

Some others try too but they are not as strict on setups / following... so the synergy and discipline is pretty all over the place (its a pug, rng is what you get, people playing when eating, on the phone, distracted by family... watching netflix...) its going to be super slack / casual unless a leader stomps their authority over it and builds a reputation and style over time...

If you want more skirmish tactics you really should join a 6 man, this sounds exactly like the style you want for Guerrilla warfare...

some leaders on both sides have a different philosophy to you and its war... by any means necessary they don't care about holding back on numbers(win at all costs)... and also there is only so much you can do to a point at times because its ORVR anything goes... many variables not all in your control. So that is why you see the style you dislike strongly, it is very zergy and thats why changes was made which atleast gives underdog a punchers chance to defend itself instead of just get meatwall grinded by mass with 0 chance.

Also with the system change awhile back from bo locking (its removed some of that Guerrilla warfare style on larger scale... where king ocara use to wait and ambush in the alpines (KV) and Gdy doing Black Cragg tricks, that was just experienced players reading the map and setting up ambush... now its more free for all get to two stars siege keep... so less tactics needed and more reactionary / zerg all to the action...

instead of get bored try find a guild of people in a similar mindset to you, looking for Guerrilla warfare on the underdog setting traps and doing what you can with the numbers you have. It will be very rare to get Guerrilla warfare experience from pugs these days in current system, not impossible just highly unlikely and more common to 6 man groups built for kiting larger numbers.
Wamizzle Guild Leader [TUP]
Wamizzle Guild Leader [The Unlikely Plan]

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Alfa1986
Posts: 542

Re: Faction Balance

Post#9 » Tue Jan 07, 2020 8:45 am

Yesterday in the middle zones (not pre fort's) I wanted to switch to order, but I remembered that I have the main characters on destro, also I don’t have a second account, so I didn’t do that).

when the fort happened, all order ppl why refused to protect the fort from the elves, and therefore we took an absolutely empty fort. after tbat most people couldn’t get into the second fort; they simply teleported in the maw.
15th orks on a dead elf's chest
yo ho ho and a bottle of rum

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hammerhead
Posts: 308

Re: Faction Balance

Post#10 » Tue Jan 07, 2020 9:11 am

Alfa1986 wrote: Tue Jan 07, 2020 8:45 am Yesterday in the middle zones (not pre fort's) I wanted to switch to order, but I remembered that I have the main characters on destro, also I don’t have a second account, so I didn’t do that).

when the fort happened, all order ppl why refused to protect the fort from the elves, and therefore we took an absolutely empty fort. after tbat most people couldn’t get into the second fort; they simply teleported in the maw.
A whole warband with a reservation was thrown into Аltdorf while trying to get into the fort. Neither warreport nor teleports sent people to defend. I am one of the 5 or 6 defenders who ran to the fort on foot and was killed at the entrance to the lord. A waste of time. This is what developers need to pay attention to.
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