WE/WH Elixirs Cooldowns

[Hastykrasty]

IMO
EoIP/SoD = 30 secs
EoB/VHS = completly rework ..new thread to talk about it
EoC/SoM = 40 or 45 secs ...

I agree with this, and I think that also the majority does.

VHS/EoB need a total buff, I like a 50% reflection of income damage (and make it undefendable or unmitigable, one of the two or both, dunno). Another idea that came into my mind is: what if for the next x-seconds all the damage that you deal is corporeal/elemental/spiritual ? with a 30s CD could be nice for group interaction (just brainstorming here).

[Penril]

No future rework. Make a proposition regarding EoB. If it will fit a format and won't be trolling attempt then I am sure Penril will move it to discussion.
Especially that this thread will be locked soon for review as 2 weeks has passed.

No. That would be on monday.

[Miszczu5647]

Great. We have few days more.
Do we focuse on EoB or trying to discuss all elixirs one more time? For me it should be group buff worthy of 60sec cooldown. With 7 sec duration.
After long consideration I must say that group speed buff (Tesq edition) starts to look promising. As it is aoe it shouldn't be more than 25%. So it could be countered by snares. Also we need to talk if it would be blessing or enchantment. Maybe enchantment (more reasons to use BG and BO but on order side it makes KotBS and SM needed).

[Penril]

I would say focus on EoB. Krima's CDs look acceptable (though I was told by Torque that he probably won't touch the CDs anyway so... meh).

My personal rework for EoB: Just increase the damage. Same with similar Choppa/Slayer skills.

[Aurandilaz]

Pretty sure most of people so far have left their comments regarding Elixir CDs, up to Devs how they want to fix them into becoming part of WE/WH combat rotations instead of hovering there at moral range with 60 sec CDs.

So maybe spend last days figuring how to turn EOB/VHS into something useful?

Another idea;
Group wide buff of 20% dodge and 20% speed for 7 seconds. You can use it by yourself to get minor advantage, or give whole group some benefit from having brought a WE/WH to the setup.
If it had greater values I would have harder time justifying giving it a 30 sec CD.

[Penril]

I really doubt it will be turned into a group-utility skill. We have had discussions in the past about how to give WE/WH spots in warbands or a spot in RvR, and the answer was: they already have a role in RvR. They are good for small scale, BO harassment, ganking, etc.

At most, I could see EoB turning into something that benefits another class indirectly (but mainly the WE). Ideally, this class should be Choppa cause let's face it: WE + Choppa don't really have much synergies between them; a Choppa always prefers Maras. Changing EoB into something that synergizes with Choppa would open up a new setup that not many people run/like.

The tricky part is: how would you change EoB so it benefits WE and Choppa but not Mara? One possibility would be something like:

"For the next 7 seconds, any time an enemy strikes you, you will deal X damage back to them. In addition, all *physical DoTs do +Y% more damage".


*I have no clue if it is possible to separate magical from physical DoTs. If so, this would benefit Choppa's single target damage (Bleed em Out, Throat Slasha) mora than Mara (Rend) while also increasing WE's (Envenomed Blade, Wracking Pains) which also happen to be in the same tree as EoB.

[Tesq]

I would say focus on EoB. Krima's CDs look acceptable (though I was told by Torque that he probably won't touch the CDs anyway so... meh).

My personal rework for EoB: Just increase the damage. Same with similar Choppa/Slayer skills.

even if you increase the dmg what that will achive?

1-ICD preven the skill to be used aoe
2-ICD prevent from hit who you want, for istance even if foussed a tank full HP may every time get the dmg instead of the dd you wanna make some retailation to.

this is not reliable enough even reciving a dmg boost to spent a 1-4 mp on it (let aside crazy dmg increase), also the problem of taking this route is again force the ppl to not take you down which became another time a chain in rotation with other def skill. Cuz if it does enough dmg to stop an assist then it get even better than the avoidance buff due best scenario being you kill a target thx to it or save yourself anyway if he stop focussing you.....it goes far extremism that way, very very bad as now or very very good as in that possible situation.

After long consideration I must say that group speed buff (Tesq edition) starts to look promising. As it is aoe it shouldn't be more than 25%. So it could be countered by snares. Also we need to talk if it would be blessing or enchantment. Maybe enchantment (more reasons to use BG and BO but on order side it makes KotBS and SM needed).

if that is even an option they will take into consideration the speed buff should not promote kite, it dosen't matter the speed % imo is mandatory for something like this that it break on skill use as it should be used for engage/disengage totally , not half measure ....like tank off sovereign for exemple; not allow focussing or healing while kite. Also for all group mean forcing all the group to exploit it alltogheter which limit a lot your options basically the opposite we had with RD (with every party memebr be able to circle it) also it dosent prevent snare effects on you so while it may be good the limitation + snare on you may still make it challenging it to use and not an easy press to escape button. (anyway no bless or ench, just pure buff, it would break on use, last few and have few % of speed proc, be bale to remove it is lame).

[Atropik]

The tricky part is: how would you change EoB so it benefits WE and Choppa but not Mara?

Thats pretty simple, leave EoB and rework Repel Blaspemy/Pierce Armor into armor debuff, as it was designed once.

[Penril]

The tricky part is: how would you change EoB so it benefits WE and Choppa but not Mara?

Thats pretty simple, leave EoB and rework Repel Blaspemy/Pierce Armor into armor debuff, as it was designed once.

That also benefits Mara. Mara could run a different spec that does not include the armor debuff, and you would see more WE+Mara setups (which are already more popular than WE+Choppa, I think).

Spoiler:

I would say focus on EoB. Krima's CDs look acceptable (though I was told by Torque that he probably won't touch the CDs anyway so... meh).

My personal rework for EoB: Just increase the damage. Same with similar Choppa/Slayer skills.

even if you increase the dmg what that will achive?

1-ICD preven the skill to be used aoe
2-ICD prevent from hit who you want, for istance even if foussed a tank full HP may every time get the dmg instead of the dd you wanna make some retailation to.

this is not reliable enough even reciving a dmg boost to spent a 1-4 mp on it (let aside crazy dmg increase), also the problem of taking this route is again force the ppl to not take you down which became another time a chain in rotation with other def skill. Cuz if it does enough dmg to stop an assist then it get even better than the avoidance buff due best scenario being you kill a target thx to it or save yourself anyway if he stop focussing you.....it goes far extremism that way, very very bad as now or very very good as in that possible situation.

Maybe not reliable for group play, but would be a great buff for solo ganking. Which I believe is what these classes are meant to do. Anyway it was just an example.

[Atropik]

That also benefits Mara. Mara could run a different spec that does not include the armor debuff,

Like what? 2-3 mara + 1-3 we, famous "no healdebuff onboard squad", i tried once and found lack of joy there xdd

and you would see more WE+Mara setups (which are already more popular than WE+Choppa, I think).

Thats mostly choppa weakness.