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Archtype Morales: Magical DPS

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Ramasee
Posts: 457

Archtype Morales: Magical DPS

Post#1 » Fri Aug 10, 2018 3:38 pm

I figured with the discussion around redesigning morales, perhaps we should start at the archtype level and balance the archtypes. Then we can look at the 7 "unique" morales each class has after that. We'd also want to split up the discussion between the 5 archtypes (yes 5). My suggestions for each category try to balance many of things brought up in the other thread, but as always lets discuss!

This is the bright wizard, magus, and sorceror section of archtypal morale balances. All classes that have a direct damage morale (m1-m3) in this category would need to have it redesigned. All DPS classes now have some form of a 1200 damage AoE M3, damage happens after 3s to allow for morale counterplay. MRDpS have the smallest radius because of the fire/forget and ranged nature of the morale.

Class Specific M1: Looked at individually
Mage Bolt: Same
Misdirection: Same

Class Specific M2: Looked at individually
Focused Mind: Same
Scintilating Energy: Moved to M2, Staggers target enemy for 9s. (Damage removed)

Class Specific M3: Looked at individually
Siphon Power: (Redesign) Target one enemy with 65ft, debuff that enemy and all enemies with 20ft. They take 1200 damage at the end of debuff.

Mastery Specific M4: Looked at individually
Unleash the Winds: Knocks all enemies back within 30ft and dealing 1200 damage. Now ignores immunity but still causes it.

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dansari
Posts: 2524

Re: Archtype Morales: Magical DPS

Post#2 » Fri Aug 10, 2018 4:31 pm

Opening. Let's just discuss the archetype morales rather than delving into any class specific morales yet.
<Salt Factory>

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Arbich
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Posts: 788

Re: Archtype Morales: Magical DPS

Post#3 » Fri Aug 10, 2018 4:43 pm

Why moving Scintilating Energy (a nice and situational useful ability even without damage) to m2? This is a huge nerf.
The removal (or lowering) of the damage might be ok, but when you move it to m2 it has to compete with focused mind.
Focused mind is arguably one of the most overpowered morales (especially as m2), but crucial for balance reasons for the vast amount of snares and rootes and the very limited counter abilities for rdps/healers. So it shouldn´t be changed, but almost every rdps/healer will take it over any other morale (BW morale bombing squads excluded).

Same goes for your healer morale proposals btw.
Arbich-BW/Xanthippe-WP/Schnipsel-AM

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Tesq
Posts: 5704

Re: Archtype Morales: Magical DPS

Post#4 » Fri Aug 10, 2018 4:51 pm

magical dmg dps which have m2 and m4 are jsut sorc/bw/magus: of this

bw/magus have off moral 2
sorc def m2 (mirrored with engi)

the core m4 is the same for all, here aswell idk what discuss about, the only archtype stuff is m4 here since st morales dont really gona make problems in orvr. then there is all caster m2 focussed mind...and offensive magical caster in orvr dont cast , they use channeling mostly.

SE: is a st stag so is basically pick stag or 1200 dmg when you used it and is ok
focussed mind: hardly used in rvr by sorc/bw/magus for offensive purpose most likely anti snare
core m4: it punt so anything that dont punt like ista 1200 m2 are better since they dont spread targets from your aoe and is unlikely that these m4 are creating problems into the game.
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Ramasee
Posts: 457

Re: Archtype Morales: Magical DPS

Post#5 » Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:14 pm

Moved Scintilating Energy to M2 in order to make the warband oriented AoE 1200 slotted in the M3 like it is for all the proposals. This also has the benefit of a competitive alternative to focused mind being place in M2 forcing you to choose between slotting the two.

Nerf? Probably, but pretty much all archtypes are proposed nerf that way. Of course it does buff those classes that didn't have AoE damage morales at all.

Tesq yes the BW and Magus have offensive class-based M2s. These would have to be redesigned, many class morales would have to be looked at (perhaps made more flavorful even). But we need to balance archtypes first for this issue before class morales.

SE is a fine morale as it is, not arguing against that, moved for the reason I listed above.

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adamthelc
Posts: 832

Re: Archtype Morales: Magical DPS

Post#6 » Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:42 pm

I would favor giving AoE damage morales a cast time and making them PBAoE instead of making them a time bomb effect. Seems way to easy to counter especially with your proposed tank morales.

A bunch of casters coordinate to load up for you siphon power a single tank notices how long until it goes off. Pops a M4 and trivializes the whole thing.


And making it be PBAoE instead of a castable AoE is because there would be no risk and less counterplay as a castable AoE even with a cast time. I really think if you made things like Ruin and Destruction have a 3 sec cast time instead of being instant, it would solve a lot of complaints.

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Arbich
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Posts: 788

Re: Archtype Morales: Magical DPS

Post#7 » Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:26 pm

Ramasee wrote: Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:14 pm Moved Scintilating Energy to M2 in order to make the warband oriented AoE 1200 slotted in the M3 like it is for all the proposals. This also has the benefit of a competitive alternative to focused mind being place in M2 forcing you to choose between slotting the two.
There is no real choise. When you have both slotted (M2 and M3), its a situational decision which one you take, but when you must decide in advance (when both are M2), almost everyone will take focused mind, because it is generally far superior.

About AE damage morales there is still the question, if they are good or bad. Some say they are required to break the zerg, others say that they are cancer and other ways to break the zerg/overcome a funnel should be developed. Still don´t know what the dev think about this.

The BW M2 ruin and destruction could be changed to like it was in the past (5sec stagger, could be lowered to 4sec). Was OP at that time, cause stagger weren´t break on damage, but would be ok now. Add a little bit damage to it (300?) to make stacking this morale over a broader area more difficult and problem solved :D
Arbich-BW/Xanthippe-WP/Schnipsel-AM

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peterthepan3
Posts: 6509

Re: Archtype Morales: Magical DPS

Post#8 » Sun Sep 02, 2018 1:33 pm

Going to close for now. Thanks for all of your contributions.
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