[Partially implemented] Anger drives me swap with feeding on pain (swap only)

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Bozzax
Posts: 1883

Re: Anger drives me swap with feeding on pain (swap only)

Post#21 » Fri Oct 28, 2016 8:23 pm

Well a 200 ap 33% uptime 50% damage reduction while doing nothing usefull for 10s that is usless vs slayers vs a 0 ap 50% uptime passive 22,5-45%* damage reduction + some fluff physical.

* even more in some cases

Hmmm wonder what is a 13pts ability
A reasonable RvR system that could make the majority happy http://imgur.com/HL6cgl7

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Gobtar
Posts: 787

Re: Anger drives me swap with feeding on pain (swap only)

Post#22 » Fri Oct 28, 2016 8:46 pm

If we are discussing the Loathing tree in general, then None-Shall-pass IMO should be a 13 ability.

My reasoning is not based on it's current form but what it should do; I believe the None Shall Pass should have it's CD reduced to 0 seconds.

Can't Hit Me / WoDS both have 0 CD and can be argued to be more effective. The BG as mentioned earlier does not have anyway to stack his block to the levels of a BO so even with the block channel it will always be second rate...Personally I would have preffered a mirror to WoDS given the BG's two handed nature.

Issues with this: BGs heavily rely on a block trigger to guarantee a block, this ability allows this to happen. Alternately, and this would grant the BG something unique, give None Shall Pass the immovable buff while channeling and leave the CD in place.
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Tesq
Posts: 4442

Re: Anger drives me swap with feeding on pain (swap only)

Post#23 » Sat Oct 29, 2016 8:54 am

The Bo channeling due the fact that boost block with no CD have a 60% snare, which is something SM one don't.
BG can cleanse slayer rampage, tough ye BG have the worst of all panic button while Kobs get the best.

to be fair both kobs armor buff (also give + ap regen ....), and damages redution are both self buff, now we could argument about the armor buff of bg being the sum of both those kobs skill but as i said before damage reduction >>>>> crit reduction , maybe to put the channeling on 13 pt it could be made istant cast/self buff like the kobs one since it have 10 sec duration over 30 sec of CD.
So it would have s+b required and 30 sec of CD fell ok as condition for a good damage reduction skill.

p.s. i'm comparing the kobs and bg because they had being relased togheter and they have a bit of cross mirror
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Nazgul--> ambitious but rubbish, cit Blast :D

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Bozzax
Posts: 1883

Re: Anger drives me swap with feeding on pain (swap only)

Post#24 » Sat Oct 29, 2016 10:01 am

Compare uptime and negative effects

50% on 33% uptime, less damage (16,5% on average*)
15-45% average(135% vs BWs) with 50% uptime (order generally have very high crits) (likely~15-25% or more on average*)

Armor self buffs are 99% irrelevant and no the channel block imo shouldn't be made stronger.
Spoiler:
(off topic: BO channel is pretty gimp and SM channel is op as hell since you can kite with 50/50% avoidance, 100% uptime. Ye ye I know interrupts/disables but meh!)
* I know you will say vigilance is better and yes it is but don't forget BG has MB + FF as well.

Imo there are 2 ways to go
1. Vig/FoF at 5pts
2. Vig/FoF at 13pts

Since I play a BG as well (BO, BG, Chosen) I sure hope they go with your suggestion :)
A reasonable RvR system that could make the majority happy http://imgur.com/HL6cgl7

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Tesq
Posts: 4442

Re: Anger drives me swap with feeding on pain (swap only)

Post#25 » Thu Nov 03, 2016 10:12 pm

well this may be a good occasion to bring this on the table, malekith bulwark would be a good opportunit to be able to have all destru tank to be able to raise destru magic defense if it would apply to all the party members. May be a good proposal for another thread to make all destru tank more equal to that side too even if would probably make all too too much copy paste.

since @pen merged @ten thread with mine i gona point out too that as said in my previously post none shall pass is underperforming. As explaied above FoF is not really a good panic button and since kobs have 2 self cast ability then Nsp may be made a self cast exatly like the kobs damage reduction, since it's a channeling and it's not spamable like BO/SM ones an interrup screw it for 30 sec. Going with all the discussio i do think that

13pt pot None shall pass --also made self buff
11pt feeding on pain
9 aoe snare
7 parry tactic
5 force of fury
3 same


this would make viable bg in 3 way:

1) as CC tank due to the same acces to aoe cc like other tanks
2) as 2h def/debuff tank due to parry tactic and force of fury + be able to take 2h crit debuff
3) as def tank due have finally a real panic button
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Nazgul--> ambitious but rubbish, cit Blast :D

Esperflame
Posts: 103

Re: Anger drives me swap with feeding on pain (swap only)

Post#26 » Thu Nov 03, 2016 11:01 pm

Personally I think None Shall Pass should be the 13 skill and you shift the other 2 skills down. I also think Feeding on Pain and Anger Drives Me need to be swapped. It's very painful having to wait forever to get any form of avoidance through tactics when all the other tanks are running around with theirs.
Karnak (Ironbreaker), Hadebrandt (KotBS), Quigon (Swordmaster), Rakthraka (Black Orc), Thulza (Chosen), Braerithryn (Blackguard)

"Yeah, I play all the tanks. I've got beef!"

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Azarael
Posts: 5349

Re: Anger drives me swap with feeding on pain (swap only)

Post#27 » Thu Nov 03, 2016 11:42 pm

The tree has been reordered. Check the patch notes.

This topic should be reopened for further discussion in a week or so.

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