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[Implementation Feedback] Patch Sept 18 2018

After feedback has reached it's viable limit, it will retire here to keep the main section clean and tidy.

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kweedko
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Re: [Implementation Feedback] Patch Sept 18 2018

Post#71 » Wed Sep 19, 2018 5:51 pm

Lileldys wrote:
Wed Sep 19, 2018 4:53 pm

Go read the tooltip damage for both skills and come back.

Envenomed blade - 1438 per global
Agonizing Wound - 617 per global

You still going to say Torment is higher DPS? Lol.
Did i told someting about WE or their builds? They got brews in differnt trees than WH and even their finisher diffrent. So back off.

Troment ignores armor, have higer base damage, plced in tree which you anyway invest for critdmg. Now WH got aoe stun, who in theri minds gonna spec in middle tree.

Without invesing a point in trees
Torment - 370 and armor ignore
Ferver - 240 and 630 9 sec dot
Razor strike - 413 and aoe

Lets calc
first 3 secs next 9 secs
Tromernt 1100 3330 (remember that you have to invest in torment tree so real base dmg will be higer anyway) (4430 unmitigated)
Ferver 720 1890 from dot - and you cant spam cause dot never tick that way so let asume that you spam torment 3300 (5910 total)
RS 1239 3717 (4956 total same mitigation as ferver)


So you tying to tell me that 954 dmg worth it its **** 1 hit difference assuming the mitigations it's even lower?
So crits is double - then with torment if it always crit i kill 6k hp target within 9 secs(6600 dmg), and within ferver in 9 sec you dmg 1140 ferver hit + 1890 ferver dot(2 tics) + 4440 torment(7470 total) - which show us that torment does more than 50% of this dmg assuming the armor dmg from ferver gonna be even less.(RS - for that time in 3 tragets 7434 each)

Actuall numbers gonna be much higer, but you can see the tendency, and admiring that first tick of dot gonna be after 2 sec you probably kill the target with torment in that time before its even start ticking. 8-)
DDZEALOTFTW!

And remember No FUN allowed in ROR.

Save the DDZEALOTs proposal viewtopic.php?f=95&t=28103&p=318980#p318980 8-)

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Lileldys
Posts: 623

Re: [Implementation Feedback] Patch Sept 18 2018

Post#72 » Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:37 pm

kweedko wrote:
Wed Sep 19, 2018 5:51 pm
Lileldys wrote:
Wed Sep 19, 2018 4:53 pm

Go read the tooltip damage for both skills and come back.

Envenomed blade - 1438 per global
Agonizing Wound - 617 per global

You still going to say Torment is higher DPS? Lol.
Did i told someting about WE or their builds? They got brews in differnt trees than WH and even their finisher diffrent. So back off.

Troment ignores armor, have higer base damage, plced in tree which you anyway invest for critdmg. Now WH got aoe stun, who in theri minds gonna spec in middle tree.

Without invesing a point in trees
Torment - 370 and armor ignore
Ferver - 240 and 630 9 sec dot
Razor strike - 413 and aoe

Lets calc
first 3 secs next 9 secs
Tromernt 1100 3330 (remember that you have to invest in torment tree so real base dmg will be higer anyway) (4430 unmitigated)
Ferver 720 1890 from dot - and you cant spam cause dot never tick that way so let asume that you spam torment 3300 (5910 total)
RS 1239 3717 (4956 total same mitigation as ferver)


So you tying to tell me that 954 dmg worth it its **** 1 hit difference assuming the mitigations it's even lower?
So crits is double - then with torment if it always crit i kill 6k hp target within 9 secs(6600 dmg), and within ferver in 9 sec you dmg 1140 ferver hit + 1890 ferver dot(2 tics) + 4440 torment(7470 total) - which show us that torment does more than 50% of this dmg assuming the armor dmg from ferver gonna be even less.(RS - for that time in 3 tragets 7434 each)

Actuall numbers gonna be much higer, but you can see the tendency, and admiring that first tick of dot gonna be after 2 sec you probably kill the target with torment in that time before its even start ticking. 8-)
You need to learn about damage stacking. Spamming AW/Torment won't get a kill in a 6v6. Looks like your argument is from a solo player, which is going to be mostly ignored.

Firstly, EB/Fervor hit every 1.5s not every 3.

Taking tooltip values from a 0/9/13pt spec WE, 990 Str:

WP 1638 total in 7 hits - 234 per 3 second tick
EB 336 Application - 170 per 1.5 second tick per stack
AW - 596 per hit
Sac Stab - 996 w 5pts
Puncture - 1162 w 5pts

15 second fight
Opener+WP @ 0s - 1170 damage by 15s
EB @ 1.1s - 336+170+170 till next EB
AW @ 2.2s - 596
Sac [email protected] - 996
EB @ 4.4 - 336+340 till next EB
[email protected] 5.5 - 596
[email protected] 6.6 - 336+510+510+510+510+510 (5 ticks for 7.5s takes to 14.1 till re-application)
[email protected] 7.7 - 596
[email protected] - 596
[email protected] - 1162
[email protected] - 596
[email protected] - 596
[email protected] - 596
[email protected] - 596
Total 12334

15s just spamming AW
Opener+AW @0s - 596
AW @ 1.1s - 596
AW @ 2.2s - 596
[email protected] 996
[email protected] 4.4s - 596
[email protected] 5.5s - 596
[email protected] 6.6s - 596
[email protected] 7.7s - 596
[email protected] 8.8s - 596
[email protected] - 1162
[email protected] 11s - 596
[email protected] 12.1s - 596
[email protected] 13.2s - 596
[email protected] 14.3s - 596
Total 9310

Before you claim you AW/Torment hits for armour ignoring, try it in 6v6, you'll soon see the amount of snares, CCs and focus on you means you'll rarely get to their rear.
Using EB/Ferver is easily a 30% dps increase in a fight.
Who Cares? - Pjsalt

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catholicism198
Posts: 918

Re: [Implementation Feedback] Patch Sept 18 2018

Post#73 » Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:49 pm

geezereur wrote:
Wed Sep 19, 2018 1:08 am
I like this direction you guys are going for, is it possible to revert Slayer and Choppa changes as well the bad ones?
Wtf are you talking about? Both classes received good fixes. ID was nerfed because it's a powerful single target ability in what is an ae mastery.

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kweedko
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Posts: 518

Re: [Implementation Feedback] Patch Sept 18 2018

Post#74 » Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:59 pm

Lileldys wrote:
Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:37 pm

You need to learn about damage stacking. Spamming AW/Torment won't get a kill in a 6v6. Looks like your argument is from a solo player, which is going to be mostly ignored.

Firstly, EB/Fervor hit every 1.5s not every 3.

Taking tooltip values from a 0/9/13pt spec WE, 990 Str:

WP 1638 total in 7 hits - 234 per 3 second tick
EB 336 Application - 170 per 1.5 second tick per stack
AW - 596 per hit
Sac Stab - 996 w 5pts
Puncture - 1162 w 5pts

15 second fight
Opener+WP @ 0s - 1170 damage by 15s
EB @ 1.1s - 336+170+170 till next EB
AW @ 2.2s - 596
Sac [email protected] - 996
EB @ 4.4 - 336+340 till next EB
[email protected] 5.5 - 596
[email protected] 6.6 - 336+510+510+510+510+510 (5 ticks for 7.5s takes to 14.1 till re-application)
[email protected] 7.7 - 596
[email protected] - 596
[email protected] - 1162
[email protected] - 596
[email protected] - 596
[email protected] - 596
[email protected] - 596
Total 12334

15s just spamming AW
Opener+AW @0s - 596
AW @ 1.1s - 596
AW @ 2.2s - 596
SacSta[email protected] 996
[email protected] 4.4s - 596
[email protected] 5.5s - 596
[email protected] 6.6s - 596
[email protected] 7.7s - 596
[email protected] 8.8s - 596
[email protected] - 1162
[email protected] 11s - 596
[email protected] 12.1s - 596
[email protected] 13.2s - 596
[email protected] 14.3s - 596
Total 9310

Before you claim you AW/Torment hits for armour ignoring, try it in 6v6, you'll soon see the amount of snares, CCs and focus on you means you'll rarely get to their rear.
Using EB/Ferver is easily a 30% dps increase in a fight.
Why you stabing AW in front? when you can Slice - i bet even not investing a point it still beter dps?
Why you go in 6 vs 6 with selheal finisher instead of witchbrew for burst? And heal debuf?
Why are we talking about 6 vs 6 it's rvr game 6 vs 6 it's a pretended thing which edge lords invented?
How you couldn't understend tha WH dont have Wracking Pains and have different finishers? (And Bal not the best one for small fights or killing hard target)
DDZEALOTFTW!

And remember No FUN allowed in ROR.

Save the DDZEALOTs proposal viewtopic.php?f=95&t=28103&p=318980#p318980 8-)

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Lileldys
Posts: 623

Re: [Implementation Feedback] Patch Sept 18 2018

Post#75 » Wed Sep 19, 2018 7:13 pm

kweedko wrote:
Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:59 pm
Why you stabing AW in front? when you can Slice - i bet even not investing a point it still beter dps.
Why you go in 6 vs 6 with selheal finisher instead of witchbrew for burst? And heal debuf?
Slice in 0/9/13 is 592 damage and 5 more AP, why use??
This is raw DPS. Sac Stab is stronger than WB for overall DPS because of 50% AA haste. Again, healdebuff doesn't effect the pure dps output as its sameish damage as AW.

With this spec about 15% damage is from AW. 25% from autos, 30% from EB, rest is finishers/kisses ect.
Image

I've never gotten WB over 2.3k DPS on the dummies even when I tried to NerfedButtons it, where SacStab is very easy to get 2.5k with some decent management.
This is on training dummies, so sure the numbers change if you get some backstabs, but it's rare in most 6v6 fights to be able to free cast backstabs.

I enjoy this DoT playstyle much more, Actually has some management and awareness of debuffs and timings, just a shame so much damage can now be cleansed instantly, seeing that 1 cleanse clears all 3 stacks.
Who Cares? - Pjsalt

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Lileldys
Posts: 623

Re: [Implementation Feedback] Patch Sept 18 2018

Post#76 » Wed Sep 19, 2018 7:24 pm

kweedko wrote:
Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:59 pm
Why are we talking about 6 vs 6 it's rvr game 6 vs 6 it's a pretended thing which edge lords invented?
How you couldn't understend tha WH dont have Wracking Pains and have different finishers? (And Bal not the best one for small fights or killing hard target)
Another post cause you edited some more.

The devs have said they will only look at solo at extreme cases like Torque-era Guardian WL.

Sure, its not all about 6v6, but its the "highest skill cap" content on the server, so it should be considered. Hell WE sucks in 24 man, 0 reason to take, WH atleast has Dragongun to spread it's healdebuff bullets while WE cannot do that cause ICD added to WE Kisses.

You have seeker's blade, has really good damage. BAL is insanely good and is pretty much the only viable finisher as BAL First instant tick = EW damage. Then you get 3 following 1k+ ticks. How is it bad?
Who Cares? - Pjsalt

Atropik
Legacy RR80
Posts: 491

Re: [Implementation Feedback] Patch Sept 18 2018

Post#77 » Wed Sep 19, 2018 8:45 pm

Lileldys wrote:
Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:37 pm
Spamming AW/Torment won't get a kill in a 6v6.
Well, for me it always did xd
Nicelook | Obey

Lemonmor
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Implementation Feedback Patch Sept 18 2018

Post#78 » Wed Sep 19, 2018 8:58 pm

Im fairly sure we just got a small piece of that localization / translation patch. Thus, I wouldnt be surprised is verbiage is even more inconsistent than usual.

At least until we get the full patch.

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vanbuinen77
Posts: 44

Re: [Implementation Feedback] Patch Sept 18 2018

Post#79 » Wed Sep 19, 2018 9:35 pm

Since sh have squig armor converting their ranged stats to melee stats.

Is there any way doks/wps can get the same thing but for converting healing stats to melee stats so we can use all of our sets instead of being stuck with doing only scens to get sets that are viable?
Neferata-Dok
Archeron-Chosen
Checkpoint-Mara
Ouchmyfoot-Squigherder
Greeniemeanie-Shaman
Doomedagain-Slayer
Dogcatcher-White Lion
Breakthis-Ironbreaker

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danny262
Posts: 62

Re: [Implementation Feedback] Patch Sept 18 2018

Post#80 » Wed Sep 19, 2018 11:44 pm

dansari wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 3:31 pm

“Could we comment on SW changes in the future”
Not entirely. It’s on our radar, but specs have not been hashed out fully yet. Sorry for the political-type answer, but for the purpose of being transparent, yet conservative on how much I can promise what is to come, I feel that approach is necessary. We will likely dedicate more time to WL at the moment, but we realize that SW needs further tuning.
Would that be in terms of reshaping mechanics or fixing specific issues (low dps, survivability, hybrids)?

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