Whats going on with Destro?

[emiliorv]

Mirrored changes make same impact in both factions?? just asking for a friend.

[wargrimnir]

Mirrored changes make same impact in both factions?? just asking for a friend.

Whoa there buddy, easy. You're gonna pull something reaching that hard.

[kmark101]

I think destro became worse because finally the dps healer plague reached their ranks. Nowadays I see tons of healer classes trying to dps (especially shamans and doks), compared to previously where every destro SC team had 5+ nonstop spamming healing healers. Welcome to Orders problem of last 3 years.

[Oglaf]

I think destro became worse because finally the dps healer plague reached their ranks. Nowadays I see tons of healer classes trying to dps (especially shamans and doks), compared to previously where every destro SC team had 5+ nonstop spamming healing healers. Welcome to Orders problem of last 3 years.

Everyone wants to be a killin' machine on Destruction it seems.

[zij83]

This ebbs and flows. There was a long period where Destro whooped ass constantly. Yall need should check out this post on city tracker from a while back

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=39836

I was wondering if anyone was going to bring up that post that shows destro with a 70% win rate in cities. My how the tables turn tables.

That data is from back in July, not sure it's relevant to the current discussion.

[Martok]

No, I will just quit. No guild. Guilds want geared lvl 40's. Cant afford decent armor, surely cannot afford 98g for a fkn +11 talisman.

You must be attempting to level a Destruction toon.

However the ailments you describe are not universal. Within our circle low level gear, potions, and talismans such as you describe are just given away, as are many pair of rare boots and gloves which drop here and there. I mean you may have to ask for what you specifically need but most of us have no problem helping out.

If you want to stay with the game and are on Destro, look up a guild named Vlos Veldrin. They take in newbies on a regular basis, as, I am sure, do some other Destruction guilds. If on Order, look up Salt Factory and/or VVG.

P.S. Anyone who would put a plus eleven talisman on the AH for 98 gold is just a ****.

[Dondabon]

I was wondering if anyone was going to bring up that post that shows destro with a 70% win rate in cities. My how the tables turn tables.

The tables didn't just turn, they were turned by someone eh. Just a wag, earlier destro nerf and order buff following the posting of that information, but standby for fort stats.

Destro nerf and order buff right? I like how those are just really vaguely stated, and the last guy who tried to list changes to make his point brought up stuff from 9 months ago, not the past three. Why can't you guys accept that your leadership has vanished and the ability to be successful is largely based around coordinating your allies? Did anyone keep note of the dates/weeks when this change happened? Maybe you really should read through the old post on all the reasons why, allegedly, order was failing and the suggestions they were provided to do something about it.

Here's a narrative supporting list of changes that were not mirrored to both sides. Please note there are no Order nerfs or Destro buffs listed because that wouldn't be appropriate for this thread. Some real gamebreaking stuff here.

Spoiler:

This is largely true, but do you think that the fact that almost all leaders vanished in last 2 months is coincidence?
I made more detailed comment in other threat, but tldr is that destro leaders rerolled to order/took a break cos moral was dumped by constant small changes in favor of order. So, hardcore players (leaders and most active/geared ppl) in large number choose to go where they can win/stop playing till something changes.

Your post confirms this narrative of inconsistent changes in last 2 months - there is a lot of small changes all favoring one side. This is not enough to break balance totally, but it is to break moral. And moral broke balance.

[wargrimnir]

The tables didn't just turn, they were turned by someone eh. Just a wag, earlier destro nerf and order buff following the posting of that information, but standby for fort stats.

Destro nerf and order buff right? I like how those are just really vaguely stated, and the last guy who tried to list changes to make his point brought up stuff from 9 months ago, not the past three. Why can't you guys accept that your leadership has vanished and the ability to be successful is largely based around coordinating your allies? Did anyone keep note of the dates/weeks when this change happened? Maybe you really should read through the old post on all the reasons why, allegedly, order was failing and the suggestions they were provided to do something about it.

Here's a narrative supporting list of changes that were not mirrored to both sides. Please note there are no Order nerfs or Destro buffs listed because that wouldn't be appropriate for this thread. Some real gamebreaking stuff here.

Spoiler:

This is largely true, but do you think that the fact that almost all leaders vanished in last 2 months is coincidence?
I made more detailed comment in other threat, but tldr is that destro leaders rerolled to order/took a break cos moral was dumped by constant small changes in favor of order. So, hardcore players (leaders and most active/geared ppl) in large number choose to go where they can win/stop playing till something changes.

Your post confirms this narrative of inconsistent changes in last 2 months - there is a lot of small changes all favoring one side. This is not enough to break balance totally, but it is to break moral. And moral broke balance.

My post intentionally left out any destro buffs or order nerfs, which are also a thing, to illustrate the worst case scenario where IF the only thing that happened in a vacuum, were the changes listed. Attempting to show the very small impact that recent balance changes under this specific narrative being spread (destro nerfs and order buffs are responsible), while the reality being a shift of populations and leadership cause overall RvR outcomes to change. The post from July that was initially shared was to reflect that population shifts happen and dominance by one side or the other are inevitable, and yes your assumption that morale among the playerbase is accurate, there are other reasons for it. Notable, the "git gud, organize" retort shared by Destro caused Order to indeed git gud, and the resulting Destro losses hit extra hard on the morale of their base as going from winning all the time (due to population primarily) to losing more frequently, causes the base of players who are here to win to either quit, or follow the tide and switch sides.

A bit more nuanced than "devs biased changes cause my faction to collapse". It didn't. These things are a cycle, and it happens over and over. Balance and development rarely interfere because large changes that might actually, quickly, affect realm populations would be far more damaging than letting the shifts play out and go down their natural course.

[nuadarstark]

Destro leaders did not reroll Order, stop with that nonsense. Everyone has been playing both sides for a while. TUP started on Order, went Destro, came back to Order and now they're on the side that has less pop, same about NGE. A lot of other destro guilds (Ere we go, Absolution, WoM) have also been hopping back and forth depending on the situation. Sliver of PnP went Order full time but that's about it for the real changes. FMJ is still a juggernaut, VII is still one of the most capable WBs in pushes when they ahve their guild events on.

A lot of the leads just stopped playing, as did many Order leaders (one of the only hardcore pure Order guilds has literally exploded twice in last 6 months)...it's that simple. We just had better luck cultivating a lot more leaders and organised guilds since the start of the summer.

Stop being delusional about this, there is no conspiracy of HC leaders/guild deciding where they move depending on the skewed balance. Especially since a lot of those leaders themselves has spent last 8 months saying ho much they want to break the zerg, have quality fights against organised and good enemy and all of that.

[zij83]

Destro nerf and order buff right? I like how those are just really vaguely stated, and the last guy who tried to list changes to make his point brought up stuff from 9 months ago, not the past three. Why can't you guys accept that your leadership has vanished and the ability to be successful is largely based around coordinating your allies? Did anyone keep note of the dates/weeks when this change happened? Maybe you really should read through the old post on all the reasons why, allegedly, order was failing and the suggestions they were provided to do something about it.

Here's a narrative supporting list of changes that were not mirrored to both sides. Please note there are no Order nerfs or Destro buffs listed because that wouldn't be appropriate for this thread. Some real gamebreaking stuff here.

Spoiler:

This is largely true, but do you think that the fact that almost all leaders vanished in last 2 months is coincidence?
I made more detailed comment in other threat, but tldr is that destro leaders rerolled to order/took a break cos moral was dumped by constant small changes in favor of order. So, hardcore players (leaders and most active/geared ppl) in large number choose to go where they can win/stop playing till something changes.

Your post confirms this narrative of inconsistent changes in last 2 months - there is a lot of small changes all favoring one side. This is not enough to break balance totally, but it is to break moral. And moral broke balance.

My post intentionally left out any destro buffs or order nerfs, which are also a thing, to illustrate the worst case scenario where IF the only thing that happened in a vacuum, were the changes listed. Attempting to show the very small impact that recent balance changes under this specific narrative being spread (destro nerfs and order buffs are responsible), while the reality being a shift of populations and leadership cause overall RvR outcomes to change. The post from July that was initially shared was to reflect that population shifts happen and dominance by one side or the other are inevitable, and yes your assumption that morale among the playerbase is accurate, there are other reasons for it. Notable, the "git gud, organize" retort shared by Destro caused Order to indeed git gud, and the resulting Destro losses hit extra hard on the morale of their base as going from winning all the time (due to population primarily) to losing more frequently, causes the base of players who are here to win to either quit, or follow the tide and switch sides.

A bit more nuanced than "devs biased changes cause my faction to collapse". It didn't. These things are a cycle, and it happens over and over. Balance and development rarely interfere because large changes that might actually, quickly, affect realm populations would be far more damaging than letting the shifts play out and go down their natural course.

I don't see anyone asking for large changes, people are looking for acknowledgement of an ever growing problem from the development team. People want to be reassured that the team is going to do something to address the ever growing migration of destro players from the game. Many of my friends that used to be on this game every day are now playing other games because the general feeling is "we aren't heard so may as well do something else." Personally, I want this to end before we are all playing Peacehammer.