Invader Set Feedback

[DanielWinner]

Here will be a thread for all the feedback on Invader sets so devs could monitor it properly.

All other threads will be shut down so if you have something to say, please, post it here and follow the format below.

How to structure your feedback:
Reply to the three questions posted below before proceeding to share your thoughts.

1. Do you play the class/archetype that uses the set you want to talk about?

2. What perspective do you speak from (solo (ganking, pugging in WB), organized WB or small scale player) ?
What is your experience with the class in question?

3. Your feedback:
- Why set/set bonus is bad/overperforming;
- How it should be fixed/changed (real solution/alternative).

Please keep your feedback restricted to one comment. If you have more to add, then simply edit your post instead of making a new one.

All the posts which will ignore this structure, derail the thread, troll and etc will be deleted/moderated and users may get warnings for such actions.

You are allowed to move your feedback here (following the structure) if you've already posted it in other threads.

Last thing: this is not a discussion so you post only your feedback and don't criticize/comment on opinions/views of the other users so no replies with quotes -- only devs are allowed to do this if they would like you to elaborate/explain/make something clear then you can start a dialog with them here.


Good luck!

[Egoish]

Zealot - rr73. Solo gank, 6 man heal, org wb heal and dps gameplay.
Invader is a useless set for any level of gameplay, prior to changes it could have replaced redeye in a solo or wb dps setup but now it hardly competes with multi set stacking to reach int cap.
For healing gameplay at any level it does not have enough crit to compete with even ruin or anni gear since you need to be procing blessing in any organised environment, 10ft range bonus is the only interesting feature but a proc you get from subj knife combined with lack of crit is unusable. I also have a RP with lower rr but same applies in the mirror. 1/10 wouldn't even set mix

Sorc/Bw - rr50ish. Both played primarily in org wb play as needed, occasionally play as st in roam or sc.
Not a poor set but not sure i would use it over OS+Sent for aoe play or Vanq+Gen for st play, it's real negative is the fact it's a 7pc set taking up more opportunity cost in gear slots and it doesn't really compete with the crit and stats available with full vanq and gen or the int/mp stack from mixing jewels. 6/10, is usable but doesn't seem like BiS.

Chosen rr50 (kotbs levelling in double xp). Mostly def tank org wb play with a rare bit of roaming.
Tank invader seems to be best invader, stats are good, has block, 7pc proc looks solid for wb play (i'd just use domi+subj with jewel mix for proper 6man if i did it more often). The real reason invader seems better for def tanks imo is that they mostly use ravack cloak, gunbad jewel, gen block piece and i suppose sent ring + tali if they have it or replace with a gen stats piece. The fact that tanks have a strong mixed jewelry set already means that they lose the least incorporating a 7pc set. 9/10 good set, would use.

In conclusion - some sets and boni are weaker than others, this is compounded by an absolute lack of weapon and jewelry options which could be used to round out characters.

Irrelevant

Spoiler:

Gunbad jewels were a step in the right direction, sent inf ring was a massive step backwards as something so obviously bis not only needs nerfing but the upkeep is saddening for anyone who plays more than 1 or 2 chars.

The weapon situation is truely sad in RoR with the options being SC2 or some different version of Subj with a different name.

My feedback would be to keep in mind a classes core mechanics when planning sets and build accordingly (Z/RP non heal crit healing set, lol),

Irrelevant too

Spoiler:

and i would rebuild some of the lair encounters to hold useful items. Outside of ravack cloak, gutslime staff and fleshrender jewels are any of the lairs worth doing outside of appearance items? Can't they drop appearance items and r40 epic jewelry which is comparable to gunbad? Can't we have different weapon options drop in city? Can't even the fort purple bags have a new weapon option in there, even the same dps as subj with different stats/procs. Maybe even jewelry in blue bags?

Structure was messy, had to moderate it to make a bit more readable.

[Collateral]

Not a proper place for this question indeed, you may wait for an answer in the Patch Notes.

Spoiler:

Sorry for not following the format, but I just have a question I will repeat from the patch notes (since I won't get full invader for at least half a year).

Why do all the tanks have the same 7p bonus?

You went for some flavour I guess with other classes, but not with tanks. I think it's kinda boring they are the same. Ideally speaking in a wb setting, you want 2 different tanks per group. So it's a bit of a waste that they have the same proc, and won't be bringing anything truly unique in the sense of set procs to the wb groups. Also, not all tanks rely so heavily on block (really the only ones are bo and ib(?) I would say).

Spoiler:

Again sorry if this is not the proper place to post this.

[Morgon]

AM - DPS Spec.

The Invader is ...another Healset..again. For casual Gamer it is in EndContent easier to get rvr sets then in SC.. so it would be nice, if both playstiles can get sets in SC / RvR. I love to play pvp with dps spec and have the Conq and Vanq Set full... the SC sets are very difficult to get cause of playtime of friends and grps.. solo SC.. looking into yearst to get 2000 currency marks.

The Invader is for DPS Archmages in comparison to DPS Classes like Sorc or SquigH a push into face... lot of Crit and DPS Boost in combination with 10ft increase will be make the strong difference in 1vs1 and grp fight so that you could have to play heal.

Before the Invader was balanced cause the invader set had a lack of Wounds and Toughness compared to Dominator and Opressor for RDPS Classes. So you had to dicide more dmg + range and less HP / Resistance.

So hope you find a compromise.. not all Sets need to be better then the set before. Try to look for different playstiles or Trees to improve different types of classes and play and design the sets.

Thanks for work and asking for opinions.


cu on battlefield

[oaliaen]

1. Do you play the class/archetype that uses the set you want to talk about?
-->Choppa rr83

2. What perspective do you speak from (solo (ganking, pugging in WB), organized WB or small scale player) ?
What is your experience with the class in question?
--> Extensive experience on pug / organized WBs and solo queue scenario

3. Your feedback:
- Why set/set bonus is bad/overperforming;
-->Auto Attack damage have no utility in this case, cuse we lose much potential on the set.
- How it should be fixed/changed (real solution/alternative).
--> 5th and 6th bonus --> ( it should have: Increase your Auto attack Speed by X ( make it stackable whit "Get stuck In" in 5th bonus.) And "Blood Frenzy": (Proc) Attack with both weapons, striking 3 enemies at once and Bleedin them for X value.

[Egoish]

Next user who ignores the initial post will get a warning.

Spoiler:

I'm stunned that you think the rest of itemisation has no impact on the viability of end game sets, especially 7pc ones which remove the ability to wear full gen.

Invader would be better and wouldn't need as much work if there were ways to make up for it's shortcomings. Oh well, we provide our feedback but i know that doesn't neccessarily mean it will be acted on.

[TheRipe]

1. Do you play the class/archetype that uses the set you want to talk about?

>Choppa rr86

2. What perspective do you speak from (solo (ganking, pugging in WB), organized WB or small scale player)?
What is your experience with the class in question?

-Highly experienced in all kind of situations (warbands, roam party/ganking, solo scenarios)

3. Your feedback:
- Why set/set bonus is bad/overperforming;

>Choppas does not have much use for some stats like toughness, initiative, having these stats in the set means losing other potential and more usefull stats.
(I don't mean that initiative is "useless", it's just something choppas usually won't stack)

- How it should be fixed/changed (real solution/alternative);
>Instead of giving initiative and couple toughness, armor set should focus more on most common stats of choppas like strength, weapon skill, wounds and parry which focus on close combat and slightly on survivability that is needed everywhere.

[Cimba]

1. Do you play the class/archetype that uses the set you want to talk about?
Slayer RR76

2. What perspective do you speak from (solo (ganking, pugging in WB), organized WB or small scale player) ?
Lots of 6 man play (6vs6, 6vsX) and unforuntely a lot of solo and duo pugging. Less in organized WB play.

3. Your feedback:
- Why set/set bonus is bad/overperforming;

• The item bonuses and the set bonuses dont seem to align very well. For example individual items feature bonuses such as moral gain, dodge, disrupt, and parry strike through which are arguably more beneficial in large scale encounters. And they soak up a lot of stat points.
  On the other hand two set bonuses are allocated to boosting auto attacks which I would argue are far less important in large scale fights.
• Lack of critical hit rate and weapon skill bonus. I know its awfully boring to put these bonuses on the sets again and again but they are the bread and butter of the slayer/choppa.
• The 7 piece bonus has the potential to be a) mediocre or b) batshit crazy depending on how its implemented. I dont know the exact formula on the armor penetration but I did some speculation in the patch notes. viewtopic.php?f=42&t=30702&start=30#p348050

- How it should be fixed/changed (real solution/alternative).
First of all pick a topic/use case for the set and then streamline it towardsit. If you want it to be about auto attack boosting than get rid of dodge/disrupt/moral gain/parry strikethrough and put some more auto attack speed/crit/weapon skill on it.
If its supposed to be about large scale fights than get rid of the auto attack stuff and put something on that work in WB environments (Cant help you with that one unfortunately).

[abodam]

1. Do you play the class/archetype that uses the set you want to talk about?
78rr Magus

2. What perspective do you speak from (solo (ganking, pugging in WB), organized WB or small scale player) ?
What is your experience with the class in question?

Solo, group 6vx,6v6, warband play

3. Your feedback:

If we take a look at Invader as RvR focused set - Magus role would be riftbot or aoe dot damage.
Considering this most of the bonuses are ok-ish for this application, but the 7th piece does not fit at all due to ST nature of Havoc.
I would suggest removing the Havoc requirement on the Ini debuff or moving it to Changing or Daemonology (or both) would enable Magus to be the pull/support with debuffing main bomb damage due to AoE initiative debuff.

Magus has plenty of offensive options on other sets for single target burst.

[wonshot]

1. Do you play the class/archetype that uses the set you want to talk about?
Brightwizard rr 81 on RoR. BW rr 80 Vanilla AoR
2. What perspective do you speak from (solo (ganking, pugging in WB), organized WB or small scale player) ?
What is your experience with the class in question?
Organized guildwarband, Realm-Warfare, pug scs
3. Your feedback:
- Why set/set bonus is bad/overperforming;
- How it should be fixed/changed (real solution/alternative).

The core issue:
Sorc/BW 7piece invader imballance in terms of way of getting the proc in largescale (AoE)
- Sorc have Icespikes with 0 cooldown and 65feet range. (spamable)
- BW have Detonate with 10sec cooldown, 100feet range but 20feet wide. (distruptable on maintarget and no spread=no proc, not spamable, requires 1additional GCD due to ignite have to be on the target first so double the chance of getting distrupted)

Basicly for a proc you want asap(!) Sorc have it easier to fish for their proc while building their classmechanic as they are clashing in the open fieldfights, while BW might have a slight advantage in prebuilding in a lordroom defens, but LoS might cancel out this advantage 9/10 times. Overall the proc is something you want up with alot of uptime, to make up for what else you might be sacrificing in terms of gear mixes, if you dont benefit from the 7th piece you might aswel slot an other item from an other set for its individual stat combination or a 2piece bonus combination along with it.

Tier set progression issue:
As long as Onslaught have the 4th piece "Boost V" proc, every future set have to compare with this proc since mainstats are easy to softcap anyways. So pre Invader 4piece onslaught + Conq boots + belt was still a better damage output setup, over the two newer sets despite they were higher tier with more armor/stats on them. (issue here is onslaught having an overtuned dps value that raw stats couldnt make up for)
The critchance/critdamage proc needs to be either continuously added on sets for them to compete with Onslaught, or it needs to be taken off onslaught and the sets can go into the Vanq direction of just having 4% damage as an end-setbonus

Scenario spec singletarget Boilingblood /WoP routation with Invader:
Sorc/BW have alot of snap burst with their spells hitting simultanious, doing your routation on a target and hoping that one of the dots proc your 7piece in neither fun for you as a caster, or for the target you are about to burst. It makes the class even less relyable in terms of premade rdps I would assume, so I cant see what sort of role this proc is trying to fulfill on invader for sorc/BW. It is currently imballanced between the two realms in terms of largescale, and for pugging it just adds to the problem of random oneshots. 6v6 I cant really tell, but my first impression is that this is not too desireable over other classes.

Solution suggestions:
- Easiest fix would be to change the 7piece proc around a core abiltiy, or an other specline based of what the devs want the set to fulfil. will it be a singletarget set, go left tree. if you want it to be largescale(since forts/invader is largescale) go right masterytree.
- Core abilties that could replace the proc requirements: Rain of fire + pit of shades, Surging pain + Scorched earth etc.
- For the sake of easier set tiers, replace onslaught and invader "boost" procs with flat damage like on Vanq
- In an attempt to tacle the overpowered class mechanic of Sorc/BW add the 7piece setbonus as a damage boost when the player is staying in combustion range between 50 - 90. That will spiece up the gameplay so these classes no longer just sit at max classmechanic and get outhealed for a massive bonus, it will add more deepth to the class' and potential for good players to stand out more for succesfully jungling their class mechanic better.