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Why were melee squig herders overbuffed again?

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Fai
Posts: 8

Re: Why were melee squig herders overbuffed again?

Post#11 » Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:56 am

teiloh wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:55 am
poisonedshotz wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 4:11 pm
It feels you guys soemtimes dont learn, white lions are horrible overpowered once again.

- Crazy Survival
- Stupid ammount of AoE damage
- Crazy ammount of utility, non inmunity CC options
- Best Mobility in game.
- Best damging Morale in game.


Feels like someone really wants white lion to be the top class in the whole game and do good in every part of the game.
1. Inocorrect, WL does not have the armor and mobility of a SH, nor does it have the damage reducers and CC
2. Inocorrect. Big Bouncin as a core ability costs almost half as much as Whirling Axe on a 5s shorter (8s) timer has a higher tooltip value
3. Inocorrect. WL has next to no utility, no non-immunity CC options, and all of its CC options are inferior to Squig's. SH has game's best AOE knockback, CD builder, a stun, a pet disarm, PBAE snare/self KB, damage reduction and ranged silence outside of Squig mode. It also has an excellent M2 snare, ranged single snare, etc.
4. Inocorrect. SH gives up very little to go with 0 CD pounce (whereas a ton of WL abilities/tactics are 100% nullified). SH has Run Away! and RUN AWAY! as well as a self-punt and a 75% move speed buff in Bouncin'.
5. Inocorrect. WL M4s aren't great and their builder gives 10 morale/s and has a penalty, whereas SH gives 65/s and has no penalty.
when i read your post i get the impression that you know the skills on paper, but you only have theoretical knowledge.
i suggest you play a msh yourself and then we can talk again.
posted by someone that plays wl and msh...

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teiloh
Posts: 270

Re: Why were melee squig herders overbuffed again?

Post#12 » Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:15 pm

Fai wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:56 am
teiloh wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:55 am
poisonedshotz wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 4:11 pm
It feels you guys soemtimes dont learn, white lions are horrible overpowered once again.

- Crazy Survival
- Stupid ammount of AoE damage
- Crazy ammount of utility, non inmunity CC options
- Best Mobility in game.
- Best damging Morale in game.


Feels like someone really wants white lion to be the top class in the whole game and do good in every part of the game.
1. Inocorrect, WL does not have the armor and mobility of a SH, nor does it have the damage reducers and CC
2. Inocorrect. Big Bouncin as a core ability costs almost half as much as Whirling Axe on a 5s shorter (8s) timer has a higher tooltip value
3. Inocorrect. WL has next to no utility, no non-immunity CC options, and all of its CC options are inferior to Squig's. SH has game's best AOE knockback, CD builder, a stun, a pet disarm, PBAE snare/self KB, damage reduction and ranged silence outside of Squig mode. It also has an excellent M2 snare, ranged single snare, etc.
4. Inocorrect. SH gives up very little to go with 0 CD pounce (whereas a ton of WL abilities/tactics are 100% nullified). SH has Run Away! and RUN AWAY! as well as a self-punt and a 75% move speed buff in Bouncin'.
5. Inocorrect. WL M4s aren't great and their builder gives 10 morale/s and has a penalty, whereas SH gives 65/s and has no penalty.
when i read your post i get the impression that you know the skills on paper, but you only have theoretical knowledge.
i suggest you play a msh yourself and then we can talk again.
posted by someone that plays wl and msh...
I played a SH (incl Melee) to 70 back when RPs were near impossible to get. They're only buffed here. You're denying that Squigs have more CC, mobility, AOE DPS and armor?

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Kaelang
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Posts: 872

Re: Why were melee squig herders overbuffed again?

Post#13 » Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:26 pm

Grock wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 8:21 am
Why do you people always derail every balance discussion into "order this destro that" whining?

Just because something is broken on one side doesn't justify another thing being broken on the other side. They both deserve to be tweaked/nerfed.
It's not necessarily that people are finding a reason to disagree, it's that the OP has no valid points to work on.
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Jinxypie
Posts: 185

Re: Why were melee squig herders overbuffed again?

Post#14 » Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:36 pm

teiloh wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 7:55 am

I played a SH (incl Melee) to 70 back when RPs were near impossible to get. They're only buffed here. You're denying that Squigs have more CC, mobility, AOE DPS and armor?
They do so what?
DoK RR80+, Chosen RR80+, Choppa RR70+, WP RR65+

Sofong
Posts: 124

Re: Why were melee squig herders overbuffed again?

Post#15 » Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:46 pm

Msh single target burst still nowhere near WL

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Acidic
Posts: 1640
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Re: Why were melee squig herders overbuffed again?

Post#16 » Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:51 pm

Grock wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 8:21 am
Why do you people always derail every balance discussion into "order this destro that" whining?

Just because something is broken on one side doesn't justify another thing being broken on the other side. They both deserve to be tweaked/nerfed.
Well just look at the thread on riposte, broken, acknowledged as broken by dev but at the same time considered by dev as in the meata so can not be fixed. This type of logic from devs leads to nothing being off the table when discussing a skill.

Jastojan
Posts: 126

Re: Why were melee squig herders overbuffed again?

Post#17 » Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:24 pm

Grock wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 8:21 am
Why do you people always derail every balance discussion into "order this destro that" whining?

Just because something is broken on one side doesn't justify another thing being broken on the other side. They both deserve to be tweaked/nerfed.
I agree. I do not like it too, but this topic is example of overreacting "oneside point of view" topic where the opposite (the destro) players could worry that the complaints about SH would be heard. But there is something more than only SH. It is WL.

I do not think both (WL and SH) should be nerfed. As much as I hate the mobility, utility and single target dmg burst of WL, I accept it and try to find ways to beat them with tools I have. If you think that both should be nerfed, what about to buff some other classes instead of nerfing WL/sh? It is always hard to see your class to be nerfed.

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adamthelc
Posts: 827

Re: Why were melee squig herders overbuffed again?

Post#18 » Sun Apr 05, 2020 4:16 pm

They probably went overboard on the mobility and survivability. You could say the same the same thing about mSW. SH definitely has more mobility, but they probably didnt need to add a bunch of instant gap closers to a game that wasnt designed around a bunch of instant gap closer.

They needed to have decent damage to be viable, they didnt really get any new utility and that type of M4 is balanced between factions.

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Drys
Posts: 94

Re: Why were melee squig herders overbuffed again?

Post#19 » Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:09 pm

Because of precisely how this thread is turning out -- it's "Nerf SH" and "SH OP"....but don't touch WL. WL is fine as is. Actually WL needs buff.

When people stop making whine threads just because a some class killed them, and actually want to talk about overall skill tweaks on both sides, then these threads will probably stop being derailed.
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normanis
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Re: Why were melee squig herders overbuffed again?

Post#20 » Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:25 pm

basicly those clases who was changed from what they be in old game, need nerf. (asw,msquig and guardian lion is reverted (already))

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