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Mighty soul alternatives? Chosen and Kotbs imblance

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Zadorck
Posts: 34

Re: Mighty soul alternatives? Chosen and Kotbs imblance

Post#21 » Sun Oct 25, 2020 6:59 pm

Alucard2010 wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 4:38 am
No reason to play a 2h knight in this current state. Zero. In any capacity, in any setting. S&B will be your new role in all settings.

Pre-MS Nerf:
1v1 - Generally lost to anything range since no gap closers, WEs were even battles (esp. if they got to initiate), Chosen 50/50, BO/BGs I won most of these fights, and choppas were easy stomps. Couldn't kill any healer, not enough burst, period.

6v6 - Meme build in SCs, Viable in ranked if your team was applying good pressure and the aggressor, otherwise it was difficult to apply the trifecta of dps pressure, guard swap, and utility (punts/snares/challenges) simultaneously if you were on the back foot. Not to mention it made life hell on your healers due to the increased 15% inc dmg and no focused mending tactic.

Cities - This is where I enjoyed the build most and think it fit into the game the best providing a fun alternative to an otherwise stale aura bot class. It paired well in the ST focus group as you could provide meaningful pressure to armor/toughness stacked healers w/ your ST dps. Couldn't be a part of the main melee aoe blob as knight parry wasn't enough mitigation (it's much lower than chosen's) and you would melt to AOE.

Forts/Keeps - meh, we stand around like most other 2h tanks in these and are always sub-optimal to full S&B tanks for HTL/pushes

Post-MS Nerf:
1v1 - Range same thing - no gap closer, you will die. WEs should still end up about even since their mostly beating themselves to death on suns blessing. Lose to all other tanks due to high mitigation of physical and knights inability to get meaning str/WS stats (no daemonclaw, no oppressing swing w/ conversion of myrm fury to elemental), Probably still stomp choppas if taunting channeling heal from choppa correctly.

6v6 - SCs: S&B guard mitigation (block/parry) + Focused Mending + Dirty tricks > 2h 10% overpowering swings crit buff + 2h parry guard mitigation
Don't even bother queuing in ranked since you have to have some amount of tank pressure there, knights wont have that any longer, and S&B is pure garbage in ranked due to 20s punt timer (instead of 10s from 2h).

Cities - High stacking of Armor/Toughness on healers makes the ST group no longer viable for the Knight since you hit like a wet noodle w/ full physical dmg now and you're better off taking WW SM and IB to buff your dps. Also still can't run 2h knights in the aoe bomb groups as you're just flat out BETTER in S&B for mitigation + focused mending + dirty tricks (5% crit r for group).

Forts/Keeps - meh, we stand around like most other 2h tanks in these and are always sub-optimal to full S&B tanks for HTL/pushes

These changes took the for "Fun" build away from the knight to meme in SCs and have some other niche in cities besides S&B guard aura bot.

-Beernpretzels 84 KOTBS Full BIS 2H Knight
(Removed)
Sadly there are many other cases like you (both side).
Either chosen or kotbs (and i got both of them bis) needed that tactic being removed because of their dmg being way too much as a tank.
Maybe it'll finally learn somes to stick to their dps guard, doing proper punt, challenges etc..
You know, playing tank as it should. ;)
Last edited by GamesBond on Sun Oct 25, 2020 7:04 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: Please don't bash others performance cause it'll surely end up in locking the thread due to extensive drama.

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Alucard2010
Posts: 50

Re: Mighty soul alternatives? Chosen and Kotbs imblance

Post#22 » Sun Oct 25, 2020 11:05 pm

Zadorck wrote:
Sun Oct 25, 2020 6:59 pm
Alucard2010 wrote:
Sat Oct 24, 2020 4:38 am
No reason to play a 2h knight in this current state. Zero. In any capacity, in any setting. S&B will be your new role in all settings.

Pre-MS Nerf:
1v1 - Generally lost to anything range since no gap closers, WEs were even battles (esp. if they got to initiate), Chosen 50/50, BO/BGs I won most of these fights, and choppas were easy stomps. Couldn't kill any healer, not enough burst, period.

6v6 - Meme build in SCs, Viable in ranked if your team was applying good pressure and the aggressor, otherwise it was difficult to apply the trifecta of dps pressure, guard swap, and utility (punts/snares/challenges) simultaneously if you were on the back foot. Not to mention it made life hell on your healers due to the increased 15% inc dmg and no focused mending tactic.

Cities - This is where I enjoyed the build most and think it fit into the game the best providing a fun alternative to an otherwise stale aura bot class. It paired well in the ST focus group as you could provide meaningful pressure to armor/toughness stacked healers w/ your ST dps. Couldn't be a part of the main melee aoe blob as knight parry wasn't enough mitigation (it's much lower than chosen's) and you would melt to AOE.

Forts/Keeps - meh, we stand around like most other 2h tanks in these and are always sub-optimal to full S&B tanks for HTL/pushes

Post-MS Nerf:
1v1 - Range same thing - no gap closer, you will die. WEs should still end up about even since their mostly beating themselves to death on suns blessing. Lose to all other tanks due to high mitigation of physical and knights inability to get meaning str/WS stats (no daemonclaw, no oppressing swing w/ conversion of myrm fury to elemental), Probably still stomp choppas if taunting channeling heal from choppa correctly.

6v6 - SCs: S&B guard mitigation (block/parry) + Focused Mending + Dirty tricks > 2h 10% overpowering swings crit buff + 2h parry guard mitigation
Don't even bother queuing in ranked since you have to have some amount of tank pressure there, knights wont have that any longer, and S&B is pure garbage in ranked due to 20s punt timer (instead of 10s from 2h).

Cities - High stacking of Armor/Toughness on healers makes the ST group no longer viable for the Knight since you hit like a wet noodle w/ full physical dmg now and you're better off taking WW SM and IB to buff your dps. Also still can't run 2h knights in the aoe bomb groups as you're just flat out BETTER in S&B for mitigation + focused mending + dirty tricks (5% crit r for group).

Forts/Keeps - meh, we stand around like most other 2h tanks in these and are always sub-optimal to full S&B tanks for HTL/pushes

These changes took the for "Fun" build away from the knight to meme in SCs and have some other niche in cities besides S&B guard aura bot.

-Beernpretzels 84 KOTBS Full BIS 2H Knight
(Removed)
Sadly there are many other cases like you (both side).
Either chosen or kotbs (and i got both of them bis) needed that tactic being removed because of their dmg being way too much as a tank.
Maybe it'll finally learn somes to stick to their dps guard, doing proper punt, challenges etc..
You know, playing tank as it should. ;)
Not sure what snarky commentary you had to provide about my gameplay, but obviously was worthy of removal.

Two things can be true at once. 1- Tanks can guard and assist their guard with utility. 2- Tanks can assist their guard with what was once meaningful dmg. This is a higher skill cap than some tanks are able to play at, but that’s where you could see the difference in effective tanks and non effective tanks. This nerf just lowers the skill cap for KOTBS back to an aura bot and should be played using S&B now.

nuadarstark
Posts: 215

Re: Mighty soul alternatives? Chosen and Kotbs imblance

Post#23 » Mon Oct 26, 2020 8:30 am

I love the mention of cities where "2h KotBS was good in ST groups". No, you were still there just as an aura/punt bot as even a 2h SM in dominator could outdps a sov geared 2h KotBS. The damage was always wet noodle level, now you at least have absolutely no reason not to be S&B.
Raid boss Salv WP Guernios - rr83, full Sov
DPS SnB SM Valianoris - rr81, full Sov

Alucard2010
Posts: 50

Re: Mighty soul alternatives? Chosen and Kotbs imblance

Post#24 » Mon Oct 26, 2020 12:30 pm

nuadarstark wrote:
Mon Oct 26, 2020 8:30 am
I love the mention of cities where "2h KotBS was good in ST groups". No, you were still there just as an aura/punt bot as even a 2h SM in dominator could outdps a sov geared 2h KotBS. The damage was always wet noodle level, now you at least have absolutely no reason not to be S&B.
Ugh - another condescending and ill informed post. Ok, here is some proof for you that it CAN be and was effective. Damage is on par with my ST groups (2xWH) dps. It was not “wet noodle” and it helped secure kills. This was a meaningful role in the city and it was a FUN niche spec - it couldn't be played in the vast majority of the game with the same effectiveness NOR was it advisable to do so as other specs/builds are just flat out better. I don’t know How organized this destro group was, but they were 2/2/2 comp’d

Image

Ghostwalker
Posts: 51

Re: Mighty soul alternatives? Chosen and Kotbs imblance

Post#25 » Fri Oct 30, 2020 3:18 am

GamesBond wrote:
Fri Oct 23, 2020 11:52 pm
MoltenCoreMoshpit wrote:
Fri Oct 23, 2020 11:28 pm
the original design of mythic is being lost over time to constant meddling. Uncapped aoe was not in live and it has a major impact on how the game is played
« A » Return of Reckoning is NOT Warhammer Online: Age of Reckoning.

Spoiler:
We are not Mythic, nor are we EA or GOA, or any other company that ran the game during it's live period. We do not have the server resources, codebase, or databases from the live service that was previously run by them. This is a volunteer, free to all, fan-based project, to recreate a game that closed down forever in 2013. While we are incredibly huge and dedicated fans of Warhammer Online, and played throughout all of it's years, we will never be the same as what came before us.
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ToU: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=13607
I look around and see a lot of mythic assets etc.. don't you? ;D

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