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3 simple changes that would make Heal Archmage from Good to Great

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Caduceus
Posts: 235

Re: 3 simple changes that would make Heal Archmage from Good to Great

Post#61 » Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:43 am

havartii wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:30 am


When your dps struggles to get a guard never mind it having to be an SM it just so easy I know. Not to mention most of them are dps so guarding a squishy AM is not high on their list of priorities. Not that hard LOL


Guard swapping is a basic staple of proper tanking.
"I watched a snail crawl along the edge of a straight razor. That's my dream; that's my nightmare. Crawling, slithering, along the edge of a straight razor... and surviving." - Colonel Walter E. Kurtz

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detrap
Posts: 269
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Re: 3 simple changes that would make Heal Archmage from Good to Great

Post#62 » Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:56 am

havartii wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:30 am
detrap wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:59 am
havartii wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:26 am


This detrap guy triggers me, like it's just so easy to find a dedicated SM to spam Whispering Winds for you and guard you so you can compete with other healers. Even within your own guild and discord it's rare.. But he makes it seem like there is thousands of them just waiting to buff you and your doing it all wrong. :evil:
Not that hard when a warband is being formed to request to be paired with a WW SM, discord is a bonus.
When your dps struggles to get a guard never mind it having to be an SM it just so easy I know. Not to mention most of them are dps so guarding a squishy AM is not high on their list of priorities. Not that hard LOL
what is the difference between an AM and guard switching to help a rp out? Sounds like you pug a lot :/
Knight - WP - Engie - BW

taquete
Posts: 20

Re: 3 simple changes that would make Heal Archmage from Good to Great

Post#63 » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:24 pm

AM class has a mechanic that in order to give its healing spec some sense they need to pick up EoV that is not in the healing tree (13pt vaul tree). And in order for them to be on par with other healers, they depend on SMs WW spam to reduce EoVs cooldown.

This is what needs reworking.

No class should depend on other classes to be "on par", other classes abilities should be a bonus, and as such they should buff the teammates instead of "putting them on par" of others. Depending on others to be "on par" is stupid, and implying that it doesn't need reworking is just ill intended

Caduceus
Posts: 235

Re: 3 simple changes that would make Heal Archmage from Good to Great

Post#64 » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:45 pm

taquete wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:24 pm


AM class has a mechanic that in order to give its healing spec some sense they need to pick up EoV that is not in the healing tree (13pt vaul tree). And in order for them to be on par with other healers, they depend on SMs WW spam to reduce EoVs cooldown.


This is what needs reworking.

This has been brought up multiple times, but the idea that AM absolutely has to get EoV is, in my experience, unsubstantiated. I've played my AM in Isha spec for the majority of the time, including in very decent warbands, and never had any problems making myself useful. (For the record, Isha spec gives you lifesavers that no other class can even come close to; something that is not shown on damage boards in city)

taquete wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:24 pm


No class should depend on other classes to be "on par", other classes abilities should be a bonus, and as such they should buff the teammates instead of "putting them on par" of others. Depending on others to be "on par" is stupid, and implying that it doesn't need reworking is just ill intended


Well, this argument is just all over the place.

Should DPS classes be able to function without healers and tanks? What about Sorcs and BW who are extremely dependent on their team? Should those classes be buffed as well?

RoR is a teamgame, and in a teamgame one is rewarded for finding synergy between classes. Also for the record, Vaul/FotG specced AM/Shaman can dominate healing boards, and they don't even need to fluff heal like WP.
"I watched a snail crawl along the edge of a straight razor. That's my dream; that's my nightmare. Crawling, slithering, along the edge of a straight razor... and surviving." - Colonel Walter E. Kurtz

taquete
Posts: 20

Re: 3 simple changes that would make Heal Archmage from Good to Great

Post#65 » Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:14 pm

Caduceus wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:45 pm
taquete wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:24 pm


AM class has a mechanic that in order to give its healing spec some sense they need to pick up EoV that is not in the healing tree (13pt vaul tree). And in order for them to be on par with other healers, they depend on SMs WW spam to reduce EoVs cooldown.


This is what needs reworking.

This has been brought up multiple times, but the idea that AM absolutely has to get EoV is, in my experience, unsubstantiated. I've played my AM in Isha spec for the majority of the time, including in very decent warbands, and never had any problems making myself useful. (For the record, Isha spec gives you lifesavers that no other class can even come close to; something that is not shown on damage boards in city)

taquete wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:24 pm


No class should depend on other classes to be "on par", other classes abilities should be a bonus, and as such they should buff the teammates instead of "putting them on par" of others. Depending on others to be "on par" is stupid, and implying that it doesn't need reworking is just ill intended


Well, this argument is just all over the place.

Should DPS classes be able to function without healers and tanks? What about Sorcs and BW who are extremely dependent on their team? Should those classes be buffed as well?

RoR is a teamgame, and in a teamgame one is rewarded for finding synergy between classes. Also for the record, Vaul/FotG specced AM/Shaman can dominate healing boards, and they don't even need to fluff heal like WP.
What? Really? Have you even read what i wrote? Well i guess you are just ill intended.

Opethian
Posts: 21

Re: 3 simple changes that would make Heal Archmage from Good to Great

Post#66 » Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:51 pm

While he's not wrong about it being a team game and synergies are important, he is ignoring that in order to perform adequately an Archmage must have a swordmaster and without it a Runepriest or Warrior Priest will easily, easily out-heal them. Even with one it's still fairly easy to outheal an Archmage.

Caduceus
Posts: 235

Re: 3 simple changes that would make Heal Archmage from Good to Great

Post#67 » Wed Feb 24, 2021 7:02 am

Opethian wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:51 pm


he is ignoring that in order to perform adequately an Archmage must have a swordmaster and without it a Runepriest or Warrior Priest will easily, easily out-heal them. Even with one it's still fairly easy to outheal an Archmage.


No, he is not.

Caduceus wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:45 pm


This has been brought up multiple times, but the idea that AM absolutely has to get EoV is, in my experience, unsubstantiated. I've played my AM in Isha spec for the majority of the time, including in very decent warbands, and never had any problems making myself useful. (For the record, Isha spec gives you lifesavers that no other class can even come close to; something that is not shown on damage boards in city)

"I watched a snail crawl along the edge of a straight razor. That's my dream; that's my nightmare. Crawling, slithering, along the edge of a straight razor... and surviving." - Colonel Walter E. Kurtz

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Ysaran
Posts: 1084

Re: 3 simple changes that would make Heal Archmage from Good to Great

Post#68 » Wed Feb 24, 2021 7:25 am

taquete wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:24 pm
AM class has a mechanic that in order to give its healing spec some sense they need to pick up EoV that is not in the healing tree (13pt vaul tree). And in order for them to be on par with other healers, they depend on SMs WW spam to reduce EoVs cooldown.

This is what needs reworking.

No class should depend on other classes to be "on par", other classes abilities should be a bonus, and as such they should buff the teammates instead of "putting them on par" of others. Depending on others to be "on par" is stupid, and implying that it doesn't need reworking is just ill intended
But that's not true. In order to play the mechanic you need both EoV and an SM with WW and I agree that this is silly. But you don't need EoV or WW to be on par. You are ALREADY on par with RP/WP. WW+EoV let you outheal other healer, but you don't need both to be as useful as an RP or WP. For example in small scale you don't use EoV but you spec for Funnel Essence. But also in WB you bring a lot of usefull tools that other healers just don't have. But if you only worry is top the healing chart maybe this isn't the class for you.


Opethian wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:51 pm
While he's not wrong about it being a team game and synergies are important, he is ignoring that in order to perform adequately an Archmage must have a swordmaster and without it a Runepriest or Warrior Priest will easily, easily out-heal them. Even with one it's still fairly easy to outheal an Archmage.
If you get outhealed by RP/WP while having WW half of the time you are doing something wrong mate. I repeat myself: you don't need an SM to earn a spot in any party/WB
NOCTURNE
Zputakatarro-Choppa rr83
Zputadenti-Shaman rr77
Ysaran-Blackguard rr60

and then WP, AM, IB, Slayer and SH

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havartii
Posts: 323

Re: 3 simple changes that would make Heal Archmage from Good to Great

Post#69 » Wed Feb 24, 2021 8:16 am

Having EoV and FoG so high up in a damage tree is just a cruel joke.

Opethian
Posts: 21

Re: 3 simple changes that would make Heal Archmage from Good to Great

Post#70 » Wed Feb 24, 2021 12:48 pm

Opethian wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:51 pm
While he's not wrong about it being a team game and synergies are important, he is ignoring that in order to perform adequately an Archmage must have a swordmaster and without it a Runepriest or Warrior Priest will easily, easily out-heal them. Even with one it's still fairly easy to outheal an Archmage.
Ysaran wrote:If you get outhealed by RP/WP while having WW half of the time you are doing something wrong mate. I repeat myself: you don't need an SM to earn a spot in any party/WB
I don't play an Archmage. My observations come from healing alongside them and in all but one instance have outhealed them easily even when they have an optimal setup in their favour. I'm not flexing, they just have the odds stacked against them and need to be buffed.

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