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Fix Broadhead Arrows to match other DoTs

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Structured class balance suggestions belong in the Balance Proposal subforum. Class-related discussion in this section are considered as ongoing debates and ARE NOT reviewed for balance changes.
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mryay
Posts: 111

Re: Fix Broadhead Arrows to match other DoTs

Post#21 » Wed May 19, 2021 7:07 pm

Foomy44 wrote: Wed May 19, 2021 6:05 pm
Adelmar wrote: Wed May 19, 2021 12:54 pm Also, allow BHA to be used in assault stance because there was no reason in my mind to take that away
I assume this was taken away due to the AoE BHA tactic. The downside of the tactic is 65 foot range, meaning they wanted it to be a riskier play style. Staying in double armor stance the entire time you're spamming ranged aoe kinda doesn't play into the risky playstyle thing, and is probably a bit too effective RDPS for what is supposed to be a mostly melee stance. I would definitely prefer it if the tactic is what removed the ability to use BHA in assault stance instead of taking it away for everyone.
When you look at the detail, it does not really make sense.
  • If we consider that the SW has a guard, then there is no difference with a bombing BW or a Slayer
  • If we consider that the SW has a guard (or not), the being in assault for AoE damage is clearly not efficient (loss of AoE skills, trade of %crit bonus for WS), better stay in Skimirsh, the see the previous point
  • If we consider that the SW has no guard, then being in assault will make a 3-sec difference while being in Skirmish range, because the double armor only makes a noticeable difference when you reach the 4k armor threshold. It will not save you from debuff armor and magical damage. Furthermore (again the details matter), SW usually slot in "Instintive Aim" tactic for the +Bal +WS +Strenght bonus, but the debuff toughness make a noticeable difference
I believe it was to tone down the burst of single target aSW. It was a mistake imho. Still I would gladly get some input from the devs.
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RoR: SW 82, AM Heal RR51
AoR: SW R87, BW/R60+, SM/40+, AM/R50+, WL/R60+, Slayer R40+, DoK/SH/Sorcerer R40+ (+others)

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Evilspinnre
Posts: 368

Re: Fix Broadhead Arrows to match other DoTs

Post#22 » Wed May 19, 2021 9:16 pm

Of all the issues in the game at the moment, this is not one of them.
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Albane
Posts: 20

Re: Fix Broadhead Arrows to match other DoTs

Post#23 » Fri May 21, 2021 1:45 am

Evilspinnre wrote: Wed May 19, 2021 9:16 pm Of all the issues in the game at the moment, this is not one of them.
I disagree. As does the fact that Order now wins more than 80% of all forts.

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agemennon675
Posts: 506

Re: Fix Broadhead Arrows to match other DoTs

Post#24 » Fri May 21, 2021 2:04 am

Albane wrote: Fri May 21, 2021 1:45 am
Evilspinnre wrote: Wed May 19, 2021 9:16 pm Of all the issues in the game at the moment, this is not one of them.
I disagree. As does the fact that Order now wins more than 80% of all forts.
Do you really think order wins forts more due to SW ? A class that does physical dmg dot with no spammable aoe cone attack ? Wait until you see what a rampaging SL, BW, WL, non def spec Engineer aoe can do, I love seeing SWs against me in a fight, they tickle with 50dmg per tick attacks
Destruction: 40-BG / 40-DoK / 40-Chosen / 37-Mara / 37/Sorc / 36-SH / 36-Choppa / 24-Shaman / 16-WE
Order: 40-SW / 40-SM / 40-WP / 40-WL / 39-Kotbs / 38-BW / 33-AM / 22-WH / 16-RP / 12-Slayer

Delegator
Posts: 48

Re: Fix Broadhead Arrows to match other DoTs

Post#25 » Wed May 26, 2021 3:13 am

agemennon675 wrote: Fri May 21, 2021 2:04 am
Albane wrote: Fri May 21, 2021 1:45 am
Evilspinnre wrote: Wed May 19, 2021 9:16 pm Of all the issues in the game at the moment, this is not one of them.
I disagree. As does the fact that Order now wins more than 80% of all forts.
Do you really think order wins forts more due to SW ? A class that does physical dmg dot with no spammable aoe cone attack ? Wait until you see what a rampaging SL, BW, WL, non def spec Engineer aoe can do, I love seeing SWs against me in a fight, they tickle with 50dmg per tick attacks
Three stacks of Broadhead Arrow plus two separate cones each on a 5s cooldown is about as spammable cone AE as you get. I'm glad you think it tickles, but for the most part they do significant damage.

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agemennon675
Posts: 506

Re: Fix Broadhead Arrows to match other DoTs

Post#26 » Wed May 26, 2021 1:54 pm

Delegator wrote: Wed May 26, 2021 3:13 am
agemennon675 wrote: Fri May 21, 2021 2:04 am
Albane wrote: Fri May 21, 2021 1:45 am

I disagree. As does the fact that Order now wins more than 80% of all forts.
Do you really think order wins forts more due to SW ? A class that does physical dmg dot with no spammable aoe cone attack ? Wait until you see what a rampaging SL, BW, WL, non def spec Engineer aoe can do, I love seeing SWs against me in a fight, they tickle with 50dmg per tick attacks
Three stacks of Broadhead Arrow plus two separate cones each on a 5s cooldown is about as spammable cone AE as you get. I'm glad you think it tickles, but for the most part they do significant damage.
Yes, they are all physical dmg and everyone stack lots of armor.
Destruction: 40-BG / 40-DoK / 40-Chosen / 37-Mara / 37/Sorc / 36-SH / 36-Choppa / 24-Shaman / 16-WE
Order: 40-SW / 40-SM / 40-WP / 40-WL / 39-Kotbs / 38-BW / 33-AM / 22-WH / 16-RP / 12-Slayer

Albane
Posts: 20

Re: Fix Broadhead Arrows to match other DoTs

Post#27 » Wed May 26, 2021 7:23 pm

agemennon675 wrote: Wed May 26, 2021 1:54 pm
Delegator wrote: Wed May 26, 2021 3:13 am
agemennon675 wrote: Fri May 21, 2021 2:04 am

Do you really think order wins forts more due to SW ? A class that does physical dmg dot with no spammable aoe cone attack ? Wait until you see what a rampaging SL, BW, WL, non def spec Engineer aoe can do, I love seeing SWs against me in a fight, they tickle with 50dmg per tick attacks
Three stacks of Broadhead Arrow plus two separate cones each on a 5s cooldown is about as spammable cone AE as you get. I'm glad you think it tickles, but for the most part they do significant damage.
Yes, they are all physical dmg and everyone stack lots of armor.
Each stack ticks for 500-1000 damage with 3-5 stacks on every player near a door in a Fort or Keep.

Because of BHA and only BHA, Destro has changed to dry push tactics to make sure they aren't pushing a Fort/Keep room with everyone at less than 50% life before they hit the other classes damage.

Delegator
Posts: 48

Re: Fix Broadhead Arrows to match other DoTs

Post#28 » Wed May 26, 2021 7:29 pm

They are physical damage, in the line where there is the tactic to increase armor penetration by 25%. Combined with the decrease in armor talisman values, yeah they can hit hard. If they don't hit you hard then I'm happy for you, but permit me to be skeptical.

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agemennon675
Posts: 506

Re: Fix Broadhead Arrows to match other DoTs

Post#29 » Wed May 26, 2021 8:03 pm

By all means you are free to be skeptical, but make sure to prove your points where in an organised enviroment BHA doing that much dmg to a guarded target with screenshots. I personally have no problem figthing against a cleansable physical dmg dot thats all.
Destruction: 40-BG / 40-DoK / 40-Chosen / 37-Mara / 37/Sorc / 36-SH / 36-Choppa / 24-Shaman / 16-WE
Order: 40-SW / 40-SM / 40-WP / 40-WL / 39-Kotbs / 38-BW / 33-AM / 22-WH / 16-RP / 12-Slayer

Keula
Posts: 93

Re: Fix Broadhead Arrows to match other DoTs

Post#30 » Thu May 27, 2021 8:11 am

agemennon675 wrote: Wed May 26, 2021 8:03 pm By all means you are free to be skeptical, but make sure to prove your points where in an organised enviroment BHA doing that much dmg to a guarded target with screenshots. I personally have no problem figthing against a cleansable physical dmg dot thats all.
Have you tried healing on destro when attacking a fort that order actually defends? The outside of lord room pressure is massive and you don't have time to cleanse the acid bombs, BHA:s and whatnot and now with no BO CD reducer its only every 5 secs anyways. Also not every person who is attacking fort is in full sov with armor talis so BHA adds to the critical mass of killing pugs outside before the charge even happens leaving the X organized destro warbands pushing alone.
Alteredheal 85 DOK
Azerrad 79 Sorc
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