Resetting keep timer by hitting siege weapons

[Aethilmar]

This is a stupid loophole (one person can reset a defense timer) that people expect GM's to "do something about", but we probably won't unless we're specifically online and observing this behavior in the moment and we see something actually exploitative being done. The last couple instances that we investigated over this behavior it was people sitting around AFK at a keep while one guy stealthed in and reset the timer by hitting a siege weapon. No one was on the walls or near the posterns to prevent it.

Defend your keep properly or move on without the defense tick. There's a main gate and two posterns where stealthers can get in. Stacking initiative and posting up at these locations will help detect them. Stealth doesn't block mines/daemons from going off. Stealth doesn't prevent PvP collision.

The loophole is unlikely to be changed any time soon as development focus is elsewhere, and to some degree if you're barely paying attention to a defense, it's not much of a defense anyway.

You are not representing the issue honestly.You have already "properly" defended the keep by beating back the enemy in the first place. Now you have to sit around for about 9 minutes spamming enough AOE at three entrances in the hopes you can insta-gib a stealther coming through?

And even if you do guard the entrances AND sit by the siege and defend it there is absolutely nothing you can to do stop a stealther who is determined to tag the siege with one hit from resetting the whole thing. It doesn't take a certain amount of damage to reset off of siege it just takes any damage. I have literally punted away WH from siege as soon as they showed up but they were still able to tag it enough to reset things.

The absolute simplest solution is to despawn the outer siege once inner is down.

[Kaeldrick]

Spoiler:

Does this include the 2 videos I submitted to a GM who was in game at the time while I was streaming and notifying this GM as it happened multiple times ??

And I also have when someone logged out of game knowing attackers would lose near a siege then 8 min later logged in swung once to hit equipment as he was punted off the wall.

Indeed, any player can logoff/login and reset timers. When he's offline : no collision and no stealth detection can apply but appearently it's allowed, from what head GM is saying there.

Correct me if I am wrong but you can guard the lord room and add traps no? All it takes is one hit and the intruder cannot logout anymore without being instantly killed. They will surely be able to tag the lord once cause nobody would have been ready, but afterwards it should be defendable. It's not like they're hacking, they're just playing the system and it doesn't happen often. After all nobody can log out safely while in combat, and nobody can login safely at the same spot if there were defenders available (considering that logging in puts the character in the world while the player is still on the loading screen).

The team does not incentivize such actions so it's not really 'approved', it's just not against any obvious rule to safely log out and log in.

If only it concerned Lord then yes, there's no way to escape if the position is defended. Here, the reset of defence timer comes from one single hit on a siege weapon on outer walls, it's not the 2% hp you have to take from Lord to reset it. By the way, timer reset from hitting a siege weapon is in direct contradiction with the rule on Lord's hp (does that still exist?... that's completely absurd if it does).

[GamesBond]

If only it concerned Lord then yes, there's no way to escape if the position is defended. Here, the reset of defence timer comes from one single hit on a siege weapon on outer walls, it's not the 2% hp you have to take from Lord to reset it. By the way, timer reset from hitting a siege weapon is in direct contradiction with the rule on Lord's hp (does that still exist?... that's completely absurd if it does).

Its a daily issue once it was discovered almost 2 weeks ago.

I see, thanks for the details. I will do my best to get some attention on this issue internally but I know that Dalen and Max are both extremely busy with the game - I even have some stuff pending with them - so I'll update the thread when there's something new being taken care of. Sorry for the inconvenience.

[wargrimnir]

You are not representing the issue honestly.You have already "properly" defended the keep by beating back the enemy in the first place. Now you have to sit around for about 9 minutes spamming enough AOE at three entrances in the hopes you can insta-gib a stealther coming through?

And even if you do guard the entrances AND sit by the siege and defend it there is absolutely nothing you can to do stop a stealther who is determined to tag the siege with one hit from resetting the whole thing. It doesn't take a certain amount of damage to reset off of siege it just takes any damage. I have literally punted away WH from siege as soon as they showed up but they were still able to tag it enough to reset things.

The absolute simplest solution is to despawn the outer siege once inner is down.

I'm not the person to ask then. Attacking siege weapons resets the timer, play around it and hope something changes in the future.

If someone is doing something exploitative, that's where a GM can step in. But we have a high bar for evidence to take action on something like this because it's explicitly accounted for in how the keep defense works. 10 minutes without siege weapons on the outer wall or the lord being touched while the main gate is down. That's how a defense works.

Again, I don't disagree with the sentiment here. It's a bad requirement for the defense that doesn't make much sense in the spirit of what a keep defense is, but I don't make changes like that.

[Fenris78]

Issue is it's simply impossible to defend outer walls against solo stealthed WH/WE. You can take one landmine and be stunned, but nothing can prevent you to go straigth to the cannon and use any opener on it.

One hit is enough to reset timer.

You simply cannot block stairs (there are many ways to avoid being stuck into people, even some keeps like Caledor allow access to walls without stairs), you cannot save keep even with everyone watching, since stealth check is random and you can go undetected by pretty much everyone.
And unless its a tank with pretty good reflexes that can detect you, reach you and punt you out of the keep, there is simply no way of killing a stealthed player before he can reach cannon to reset.

Suggestion :
Make cannons more resilient to damage, and/or only allow reset upon cannon destruction.
This way, you need a coordinated force to do that (you have to spend a more significant amount of time to destroy one cannon), and you only allow a number of resets equal to remaining cannons (since they wont respawn).

Now you have a good balance for strategic resets, without being too easy, or too frequent.

[ravezaar]

ppl seem to abuse this by logging out then few min later log back in again and charging Siege, cant one solution be like Objectives when u log off near them and back in again u port to WC. Cant it be same for Fort ? or will this be to much for the crash Situation, when u crash in a Fort u wanna spawn back there. idk

[meatcpu]

Maybe the weapons can be moved to prevent this. We should test it in a zone by moving the weapons outside the keep after the siege. Maybe there's something we can change about our defenses that mitigates this.