What I think Return of Reckoning is getting wrong... (lately)

[wargrimnir]

Most of the players here are +30 and many with kids, super casual gamers.

This is by all accounts a rather hardcore RvR game that relies heavily on coordinated groups to be successful. I've never had much "super casual" vibe from anyone that sticks around long term. What super casuals are going to flock to however is the latest MMO to be released so they can feel like part of a big something without having to invest all that icky hardcore time and socialization with peers. Like every major MMO launch they will peak insanely high, and hundreds of thousands will bleed off over the first couple months destroying established guilds in the process, the majority of those will disintegrate or the leaders will merge with other leaders, cause guild drama and push out more people in the process. MMO's are really problematic when they're not built up and sustained for the long term. Funny thing innit. Casuals ruin MMO's, don't let them convince you otherwise.

I’m a super casual, and I still play here. No plans on “flocking” to anything new. I don’t have time to learn a whole new game/system. I think the assessment that RoR has quite a few and appeals to casuals, because it’s a game you can pick up and put down at will, is a sound assessment. But what do I know? I’m just a filthy, MMO ruining super casual…

Are you trying to make yourself mad? I wouldn't consider you super casual if you're playing ROR regularly as it's a particularly hardcore RVR game. Casuals ruin MMOs particularly because they don't stick around after the initial hype of a game dies down. You however are playing a game that's been dead longer than it's been alive and still coming back for more. Maybe you're not as casual as you think.

[ufthakk]

This is by all accounts a rather hardcore RvR game that relies heavily on coordinated groups to be successful. I've never had much "super casual" vibe from anyone that sticks around long term. What super casuals are going to flock to however is the latest MMO to be released so they can feel like part of a big something without having to invest all that icky hardcore time and socialization with peers. Like every major MMO launch they will peak insanely high, and hundreds of thousands will bleed off over the first couple months destroying established guilds in the process, the majority of those will disintegrate or the leaders will merge with other leaders, cause guild drama and push out more people in the process. MMO's are really problematic when they're not built up and sustained for the long term. Funny thing innit. Casuals ruin MMO's, don't let them convince you otherwise.

I’m a super casual, and I still play here. No plans on “flocking” to anything new. I don’t have time to learn a whole new game/system. I think the assessment that RoR has quite a few and appeals to casuals, because it’s a game you can pick up and put down at will, is a sound assessment. But what do I know? I’m just a filthy, MMO ruining super casual…

Are you trying to make yourself mad? I wouldn't consider you super casual if you're playing ROR regularly as it's a particularly hardcore RVR game. Casuals ruin MMOs particularly because they don't stick around after the initial hype of a game dies down. You however are playing a game that's been dead longer than it's been alive and still coming back for more. Maybe you're not as casual as you think.

You are a real casual, don't let him convince you otherwise.

[Strakar]

As others have said, I think the definition of casual needs to be understood. You can still be casual yet understand game mechanics and be a decent player. I'd contend most casuals here have MMO experience and anyone truly new to the genre won't stick here.

Any game that thinks its hardcore base will sustain it is doomed to fail. Eve online is maybe one exception I can think of. More mainstream MMOs are successful because they can cater to both. RoR doesn't have to worry about financial motivation, which helps.

Honestly it feels like RoR has done several things to make it more casual friendly. it's new players that need more support, not casuals.

I'd like to hear the take on Ranked play. Ranked is a good example of what happens when you try to cater to the hardcores alone, it's a dead game mode without a change to appeal to anyone less than the super elite.

[mynban]

I think failed ranked experiment alone is proof that RoR player is not the hardcore playerbase it was assumed. It died off so fast in season2, it can be considered stillbirth.

Biggest problem with RoR (every aspect of it) is that it promotes uneven fights.

- oRvR is nothing but zerging and PvDoor (once in a blood moon, double tailed comet prophesied good fights dont change the fact that 99% it is just pvdoor).
- SCs are somewhat fun until a premade comes in, and other side stops queueing after a few 500-20 scores. People simply stop queueing, it is that simple.
- Cities are mainly based on dodge the queue logic. Anyone claims otherwise is lying to themselves otherwise instances would start pairing before the last 5 min. But they never do.
- Ranked.. lol.

RoR, if it is to survive (average player count in oceana prime time is 250 now. It was over 500 when i started playing), it needs to figure out how to promote even fights, not one sided stomp fests.

Imagine if LoL allowed 6v4 games, giving option to join either side and told people with team of 4 that only victory is rewarded. It would die off so fast. The reason it is strong after all that time is; it promises an even match regardless of how good or bad you are. /2cents

[abezverkhiy]

Look I don't understand what do you want RvR to be like? What's wrong with keep sieges? I would say 7 of 10 are fun regardless of the outcome. Of course you should be doing something to get this fun not just stare at the door. As a WH I am busy inside, as any other class I am busy around posterns. If one of the sides does nothing but waits for the doors to fall then only aao 200% can help them.

In my opinion RvR is way better presented than scens.

And as for the completely equal play... You never get it here even if numbers are equal. They classes are not mirrors to start with. This is not Mortal Combat where both can choose Subzero and bash each other with same abilities.

[DaWolf]

Casuals ruin MMO's, don't let them convince you otherwise.

How can you spit on a part of your playerbase?
I'm a casual player, excuse me, I have a job ! And yet I'm still on RoR.
What will end up happening is that the casuals will really leave and you will stay between hardcore, at 200 max... Ah there will be quality for sure and we can see that right now people are all very happy to play at 200.

[wargrimnir]

Casuals ruin MMO's, don't let them convince you otherwise.

How can you spit on a part of your playerbase?
I'm a casual player, excuse me, I have a job ! And yet I'm still on RoR.
What will end up happening is that the casuals will really leave and you will stay between hardcore, at 200 max... Ah there will be quality for sure and we can see that right now people are all very happy to play at 200.

Some people want to be spit on I guess. Your definition of casual is different than the point I was making.

[DaWolf]

I don't particularly want to be spit on, but if I do a quick search on a search engine, I open the first link and look for a definition of casual and I find this:

https://www.esportstalk.com/blog/casual ... core-7492/

Casual vs Hardcore – “Casual”

The term casual refers to someone who “casually” plays the game and typically is a person who has other responsibilities in their life and cannot always put games first. In the past, it was used to describe players who weren’t on the same level as the hardcore people since they couldn’t usually devote the necessary time needed.

Those once “hardcore” people still play but have additional responsibilities such as work, family, and so on to prevent them from playing as much as they may want. That doesn’t change the fact they are skilled players who have been there and done that with a gaming environment that doesn’t require “hardcore” play to be the best.

Yet, they are tossed into the same category as the players who do not care and the term casual is more closely associated with a noob in today’s world rather than what these players actually are.

The casuals that I am talking about are those that do not have a lot of time in their day for games, so they use time management skills to ensure success. These players are not novices when it comes to the gaming world because they come in ready to go, and yet they are treated like second-class citizens much of the time.

Exactly what I think I am.
But no worries, if it's just a different definition of the term.
Let's leave it at that. I have a gobbo to exp

[Helwer]

True stories here but instead of talking about who is casual and who is not, there should be options to keep players in the game.
For me it is really hard to see the progress after Vanquisher. I have several chars on that level, but only one almost 70. And it is not that funny that i will have to get Invader first before i can get Royals and build my Sov/Warlord Gear - most probably without PvE-gear. That is okay, cause you rarely find good groups to run PvE fast. But the progress after Vanquisher is for some reason and classes/paystyles demotivating. So why not decrease Warlord or offer new sets as offensive and defensive as the Sovereign from a lower Level. With my 2h-BG i need to farm Invader to skip it finally or run PvE as hell, which is not possible and wanted. Maybe there is one option to fix the gear-gap by offering a second invader-set and without making Elite-Players unhappy. Or add an even higher SC-Set after Oppressor with 7 pieces. And just in case - yes i know BG is a tank and so on, have def-equipment as well. For glas-canon slayers it's looking even more challenging than for tanks or healer.
Hope we find some good idea to help. Thanks.

[ufthakk]

Pve is not for everyone. But if u take that route, how long does is take with lockouts ?
1 Month?