Recent Topics

Ads

GCD and AP proposal

We want to hear your thoughts and ideas.
Forum rules
Before posting on this forum, be sure to read the Terms of Use

Structured class balance suggestions belong in the Balance Proposal subforum. Class-related discussion in this section are considered as ongoing debates and ARE NOT reviewed for balance changes.
User avatar
Gravord
Posts: 400
Contact:

GCD and AP proposal

Post#1 » Fri May 20, 2022 5:25 pm

Recent change to gcd duration to match live value and accordingly to grant correct stat multiplier to instant abilities caused a bit of slow down of the gameplay. It's no doubt important to have coherent and matching values in the game code for abilities, but the new gameplay pace, slower by 0.35s, feels definitely too sluggish and I would very much prefer to see RoR combat more dynamic. Combined with longer delay to kick in ap regen, characters exhaust all their ap pool extremely fast, causing further downtimes in combat, before ap drains are even applied.

Id propose 2 possible solutions to gcd:
- Shorten gcd to 1.25s - It would make almost equal pace of combat as we are used to over last years in RoR, stat multiplier adjustment to 125 would cause minimal difference in dmg/heal output of instant abilities compared to what we have now and before the latest patch. Skill cooldowns would be logical multiplication of gcd (5s, 10s, etc) allowing more fluid rotations. 8gcds over 10s period.
- Shorten gcd to 1s - would speed up combat further, faster than ever before. There would be a slightly more noticeable drop of value of instant ability dmg and heals with their 150 value stat multiplier reduced to 100, but pace and possible amount of skills applied over time would fully compensate for that. 10gcds over 10s period.

Furthermore tick rate of hots and dots could be adjusted on various skills to match length of gcd (be it 1.25s or 1s) or double the value of gcd (could vary between skills), to speed up combat as well. Current 3s wait time between skill application and first tick is way too delayed for modern mmo gameplay pace.

As for ap choke, I'd propose for ap regen items to fully work per second (or global if it's not equal to 1s) at all times, even if there are skills used during gcd. It would add value to ap items. If that turns out to be too good by stacking certain items, ap cap could be set (for example 10AP/s/gcd).

Ads
User avatar
ritual
Posts: 18

Re: GCD and AP proposal

Post#2 » Fri May 20, 2022 6:38 pm

most mmo that i played with 1.5 sec gcd has in their mechanic a lot of off-gcd skils, which should be used in between gcd skills, it made the combat live enough, but in who mechanics it looks just stuttering and terrible, and that's how it was on Mythic servers
i dont think that we need recreate worst things from official server.
1s gcd and lower multiplier sounds quite interesting for me, but to be honest i dont think that we need any gcd changes
Last edited by ritual on Fri May 20, 2022 6:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

ReBiff
Suspended
Posts: 41

Re: GCD and AP proposal

Post#3 » Fri May 20, 2022 6:46 pm

I would love to see a 1second GCD timer or better yet a 1.25 with alot of skills being off gcd (like punts, guards, select single target absorbs, certain dps execute abilities, detaunt etc.) as it is atm 1.5 is way too sluggish for a game that has no off gcd abilities. especially for a game focused around RVR/PVP

Sulorie
Posts: 7219

Re: GCD and AP proposal

Post#4 » Fri May 20, 2022 6:53 pm

Does ap regen kicks in later now with the gcd adjustment? I can say I notice the lower ap regen.
The gcd adjustment itself is a non-issue for me. Chaining skills works since the hotfix and neither with melee nor with range dps chars I have noticed misbehavior during rotations.

Let's imagine we were never meant to use so many skills in a certain time frame. The result might be lower dps but at the same time we have less healing as well. If anything one could tweak stat scaling or buff durations to compensate for the slightly slower ability cadence.
The difference in gcd isn't big and people only notice it, because we were experiencing the short gcd for many many years - old habits and such.
On live it was like 1,4 or 1,5 sec and nobody here would be bothered, if the servers still existed, because you would know nothing else.

PS: Make potions off-gcd pls :P
Dying is no option.

eldriyth
Posts: 35

Re: GCD and AP proposal

Post#5 » Fri May 20, 2022 7:04 pm

Gravord wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 5:25 pm Recent change to gcd duration to match live value and accordingly to grant correct stat multiplier to instant abilities caused a bit of slow down of the gameplay. It's no doubt important to have coherent and matching values in the game code for abilities, but the new gameplay pace, slower by 0.35s, feels definitely too sluggish and I would very much prefer to see RoR combat more dynamic. Combined with longer delay to kick in ap regen, characters exhaust all their ap pool extremely fast, causing further downtimes in combat, before ap drains are even applied.

Id propose 2 possible solutions to gcd:
- Shorten gcd to 1.25s - It would make almost equal pace of combat as we are used to over last years in RoR, stat multiplier adjustment to 125 would cause minimal difference in dmg/heal output of instant abilities compared to what we have now and before the latest patch. Skill cooldowns would be logical multiplication of gcd (5s, 10s, etc) allowing more fluid rotations. 8gcds over 10s period.
- Shorten gcd to 1s - would speed up combat further, faster than ever before. There would be a slightly more noticeable drop of value of instant ability dmg and heals with their 150 value stat multiplier reduced to 100, but pace and possible amount of skills applied over time would fully compensate for that. 10gcds over 10s period.

Furthermore tick rate of hots and dots could be adjusted on various skills to match length of gcd (be it 1.25s or 1s) or double the value of gcd (could vary between skills), to speed up combat as well. Current 3s wait time between skill application and first tick is way too delayed for modern mmo gameplay pace.

As for ap choke, I'd propose for ap regen items to fully work per second (or global if it's not equal to 1s) at all times, even if there are skills used during gcd. It would add value to ap items. If that turns out to be too good by stacking certain items, ap cap could be set (for example 10AP/s/gcd).
It feels fine and melee classes got the nerfs they have needed since launch not being able to instant spam every 1.15 seconds while casters wait 1.5 to 2 seconds to deal sometimes less damage. The game hasn't felt this balanced ever honestly.

User avatar
Gravord
Posts: 400
Contact:

Re: GCD and AP proposal

Post#6 » Fri May 20, 2022 10:23 pm

Sulorie wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 6:53 pm Does ap regen kicks in later now with the gcd adjustment? I can say I notice the lower ap regen.
The gcd adjustment itself is a non-issue for me. Chaining skills works since the hotfix and neither with melee nor with range dps chars I have noticed misbehavior during rotations.

Let's imagine we were never meant to use so many skills in a certain time frame. The result might be lower dps but at the same time we have less healing as well. If anything one could tweak stat scaling or buff durations to compensate for the slightly slower ability cadence.
The difference in gcd isn't big and people only notice it, because we were experiencing the short gcd for many many years - old habits and such.
On live it was like 1,4 or 1,5 sec and nobody here would be bothered, if the servers still existed, because you would know nothing else.

PS: Make potions off-gcd pls :P
Yes, it waits longer to kick in ap regen.

User avatar
Evilspinnre
Posts: 366

Re: GCD and AP proposal

Post#7 » Sat May 21, 2022 12:22 am

Sulorie wrote: Fri May 20, 2022 6:53 pm Does ap regen kicks in later now with the gcd adjustment? I can say I notice the lower ap regen.
Ap regen would kick in a certain amount of time after GCD/channel ended. Now that GCD is 1.5s, you have to wait longer to get the tick because you are waiting longer for the GCD.
Evilspinnre - Nightmare/Daydream - Xrealmers Anonymous
80+ AM, WL, WP, BW, SL, SM, 50+ RP, SW, IB
80+ BG, Sorc, WE, Mara, Choppa, SH, 60+ Zeal, Shaman, Blork
https://www.youtube.com/user/EvilspinnrePvP
https://www.twitch.tv/evilspinnrepvp

User avatar
magictaquito
Posts: 19
Contact:

Re: GCD and AP proposal

Post#8 » Sat May 21, 2022 4:58 am

Gravord's suggestions are much more attractive compared to the current changes to gcd and ap regen.
[Gobbo Club] Guild Master
Brokensafety - RR84 Squig Herder
Fart - RR6x Black Orc
Healyfingas - RR6x Shaman
Imbigga - RR5x Choppa

Ads
geezereur
Posts: 620

Re: GCD and AP proposal

Post#9 » Sat May 21, 2022 8:07 am

Great proposal +1 on this.

User avatar
Fenris78
Posts: 787

Re: GCD and AP proposal

Post#10 » Sat May 21, 2022 8:11 am

GCD are fine as they are now, we just need to adapt a bit to the slower pace of combat.
Disallowing too high dps is not a bad thing in the end. I dont think game should be faster than we previously had, with some nasty timestamps of 3-4s some classes could instakill someone with little assist.


The AP regen is very bothering to me, and makes the game uber frustrating, being constantly AP starved after 6-7 instant skills in a row, wich is about one sequence rotation on many dps and tanks.

I'm not against having to wait for AP tick, but I think AP per second bonuses (from items) should work exactly like HP per 4s bonuses vs natural health regeneration, ticking every second no matter what.

You will have "natural regen" with a waiting time doing nothing (and getting out of combat for natural HP regen as usual), and a "Natural AP regen" ticking after a little break out of any action.

Then, every other regeneration bonus should work constantly in the background ; AP per second ticking every second, HP regen ticking every 4s, and possible buffs from skills/tactics inbetween, on their specific paces.

It currently makes no sense HP regen bonuses are working constantly, but AP bonuses dont, but for some reason other AP regen (skills and tactics procs notably) are applying constantly.
It will increase the value from AP regen items, while still requiring some sacrifices in order to stack mass amounts.
Max "reasonable" stackable on my runi was about 26 AP/s, but it needed legendary talisman (7 AP/s), Reverence staff (6 AP/s), 2 rings of the ravener (6 AP/s), and sov/warlord mix (7 AP/s).

It could need some items balancing, if we consider those kind of amounts are too much, but I still think "AP per second" should tick no matter what (unless ofc specific conditions like Sneak or Flee states).
Last edited by Fenris78 on Sat May 21, 2022 11:24 am, edited 3 times in total.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google Adsense [Bot], Ysaran and 31 guests