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RvR campaign - forts - citiese: We need a change!

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Garamore
Posts: 397

Re: RvR campaign - forts - citiese: We need a change!

Post#11 » Wed Aug 03, 2022 3:08 pm

Bags for the winners just makes the winners stronger and the looser weaker. We saw it on live when order got sov and destro didnt (destro city was bugged). Server went from balanced to faceroll in 2 weeks. If you put that in anyone with both order and destro chars will go to the winning side outside of a few guilds who run rvr events.
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Farrul
Posts: 282

Re: RvR campaign - forts - citiese: We need a change!

Post#12 » Wed Aug 03, 2022 3:27 pm

The main issue with city sieges is that they always felt anticlimactic due to being instances, how someone thought the conclusion of a large scale conflict(rvr) should end in instanced scenarios is a real mystery.

City sieges nowdays just feel like something embarassing the devs want to hide away(i dont blame them).

The real solution might not even be technically possible to implement, but it's obvious that the conclusion to a grand rvr campaign need to be a huge rvr siege battle, i.e Altdorf and IC the final and most battle intense RvR zones in the game with a boss more challenging than just taking a T4 keep/fort. Everyone should participate not just 40s.

Of course realistically the map layout might not be good enough for this lacking sufficent space, still a last stand funnel inside the Altdorf Keep area holding the tides of destruction at bay would be epic to participate in, a real city siege/end game and not some lame instance with far too few players to ever be a worthy conclusion to the rvr campaign.

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Kpi
Posts: 517

Re: RvR campaign - forts - citiese: We need a change!

Post#13 » Wed Aug 03, 2022 5:12 pm

Garamore wrote: Wed Aug 03, 2022 3:08 pm Bags for the winners just makes the winners stronger and the looser weaker. We saw it on live when order got sov and destro didnt (destro city was bugged). Server went from balanced to faceroll in 2 weeks. If you put that in anyone with both order and destro chars will go to the winning side outside of a few guilds who run rvr events.
The players must have any motivation to win zones. There are not sieges because people fear to give free bags to opposite realm, and if the reward for victory is the same that for lost there is not motivation to siege nothing. Is very bored see all the time the same WBs in the same places doing the same all the time. And this must end as soon as possible.
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Asderas27
Posts: 190

Re: RvR campaign - forts - citiese: We need a change!

Post#14 » Wed Aug 03, 2022 5:36 pm

Kpi wrote: Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:40 am City rewards should not be raised. RVR rewards must be lowered and zerg mode must be killed by GMs as soon as possible.

But I totally agree with the post. The campaign needs to be fixed so that the game doesn't die due to boredom of the players.

A good idea for improve the RVR campaign can be only RVR Zone winners roll gold and purple bags (and of course, Defense bag must be removed). So we will see more sieges
That is such a terrible idea lmao.
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Dabbart
Posts: 2248

Re: RvR campaign - forts - citiese: We need a change!

Post#15 » Wed Aug 03, 2022 5:57 pm

Nice OP TS. "better to raid the enemy city than to defend your own one." is a major point imo.

Not sure I agree with your ideas though;

Added rewards are only as effective as a carrot until the reward is achieved. Then one needs to add more, or else the carrot no longer exists. However, I am always in favor of adding more flavor/cosmetic items.

Realm based rewards/penalties have a snowballing effect that War has suffered numerous times, through numerous iterations. On a 2realm PvP game, one needs to be super careful with these. Also, you can just Xrealm...

I love the Resource carrier idea. Wouldn't need to replace current system either, just as an addition.

Here's my random ORvR idea;

Expansion of Guild/Alliance Claiming and make every t4 zone open Permanently. There is no need to "push" the campaign anymore really. So open up the entire ORvR map. Allow them to Claim any T4 keep that their realm owns. The keep stays claimed until the they the keep is taken by the enemy. Add more cosmetic/defensive choices to each keep, keep "zone lock" rewards but don't lock the zone, and allow for the ranking up of your WC to max of 2* in order to spawn a ram/siege.

Keep t2/3 as rotating unlocked zones with the same mechanics as now. Let people fight wherever they want over whatever they want.

Make Forts scheduled fights, 1 every 6-12hrs randomly. Keep city as it is, with attack/defending determined via Fort wins. BUT as OP stated, there needs to be a reason to WANT to attack the enemy City instead of Defending. Defending is noticeably easier, so why would one choose to attack if the rewards depend on winning, not which side you're on. I don't have an answer for this issue other than Live's answer, where you had to attack the enemy city to unlock certain gear rewards.
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jshort
Posts: 51

Re: RvR campaign - forts - citiese: We need a change!

Post#16 » Wed Aug 03, 2022 7:54 pm

Dabbart wrote: Wed Aug 03, 2022 5:57 pm Nice OP TS. "better to raid the enemy city than to defend your own one." is a major point imo.

Not sure I agree with your ideas though;

Added rewards are only as effective as a carrot until the reward is achieved. Then one needs to add more, or else the carrot no longer exists. However, I am always in favor of adding more flavor/cosmetic items.

Realm based rewards/penalties have a snowballing effect that War has suffered numerous times, through numerous iterations. On a 2realm PvP game, one needs to be super careful with these. Also, you can just Xrealm...

Thats why i would make this rewards only last for max of 7 days. So you want a faster mount? Well go and attack the enemy city and win and you might own one for a week. These items should only give you a small bonus compared to permanant gear and you would only get it in a bag. Maybe only in purple and gold as a choice, either the item or crests. So lets imagine you get a crazy number of 8 city instances. In total you might have 50 to 80 players you can choose this gear for the time of 7 days. So even if they are now 5% stronger (which i think is way too high) it would not break the game.

I like the idea of opening more zones.

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Scottx125
Posts: 965

Re: RvR campaign - forts - citiese: We need a change!

Post#17 » Wed Aug 03, 2022 9:19 pm

I agree more meaning has to be put into the RvR campaign in the form of a rework. But I don't support any higher gear items or rewards that augment player strength further. We're already at what I consider the acceptable limits of power creep. I'd only support new weapon skins and new mounts (but not at higher speeds or dismount chances, only skins).

What do I think needs to be done? Zergs need to be discouraged. How I'm not sure. There are many ideas but I'm not sure which would work best.

Zone pushes need to feel more impactful to the overall campaign and somehow influence a city as it no longer really matters. Keep sieges too need to be revamped IMO so attackers can do more to influence what happens during a siege and defenders need a way to respond. Most of the time everyone just stands there AoEing till the doors down.

It's not about giving people more rewards. It's about making the content that is there more fun and dynamic to play.
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malark
Posts: 58

Re: RvR campaign - forts - citiese: We need a change!

Post#18 » Thu Aug 04, 2022 11:07 am

giving some people access to faster mounts is not great in my opinion
I mean, it's already bad enough if you see a pack of players and run
Giving some rr100 sweaty an even faster mount just tops off that feeling of inbalance
You should be able to assume if you are running from someone that they won't just be able to run you down because their mount is faster

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Aethilmar
Posts: 636

Re: RvR campaign - forts - citiese: We need a change!

Post#19 » Thu Aug 04, 2022 5:17 pm

The premise of this post is flawed. The core of the game (at least the PvP side) has always been around fights (hopefully interesting ones).

The zone campaign, the forts, the city, the SCs are all just mechanics to encourage some form of fighting between the players.

The proposal, as written, does not provide that incentive. It is, very much, written from a PVE perspective of obtaining loot instead of encouraging interactions.

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Asderas27
Posts: 190

Re: RvR campaign - forts - citiese: We need a change!

Post#20 » Fri Aug 05, 2022 6:22 am

malark wrote: Thu Aug 04, 2022 11:07 am giving some people access to faster mounts is not great in my opinion
I mean, it's already bad enough if you see a pack of players and run
Giving some rr100 sweaty an even faster mount just tops off that feeling of inbalance
You should be able to assume if you are running from someone that they won't just be able to run you down because their mount is faster
You know there is only 1 rr100 player on server right ?
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