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Patch Notes 06/07/2018

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Theseus
Posts: 526

Re: Patch Notes 06/07/2018

Post#181 » Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:03 pm

saupreusse wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:58 pm
simtex wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:36 am
saupreusse wrote: Sat Jul 07, 2018 12:34 pm

Im sure the next changes will be the opposite of "not good" with such valuable, high quality feedback! The precision with which you described the problem and tried to explain to us is unsurpassed! Wonderful!
Necroing an old post, but do we live in the same world? play the same game?

I dont recognize this game i used to love so much anymore, my advice(not like people yourself acctually give a ****) stop trying to reinvent the wheel.
Let me quote one of the conditions you have accepted the moment you created an account:
"If you suffer from [...] the inability to criticise changes directly, instead complaining about changes having been made per se because you didn't want the original game to change at all, no matter how (appealing to tradition), then you are not welcome here."
So don't behave like you've been treated unfair. You should have read what you've signed up for...
Since when does anyone ever read the fine print, old friend?^^
Andyrion Ulthenair
Arphyrion Soulblade

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bossabe
Posts: 51

Re: Patch Notes 06/07/2018

Post#182 » Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:24 pm

just make that 2 secs charge instant and give WH/WE instant stealth , thank you

Foomy44
Posts: 572

Re: Patch Notes 06/07/2018

Post#183 » Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:00 pm

Spoiler:
Teckillah wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 10:22 am I can see a lot of ppl, talking about this rework, they seems happy.
Well Squig amored now can,

- Tank more than a regular tank also with a guard unkillable
- 3 ability to mobility
-- Pounce( damage in aoe, also he can spam everytime " cd 10 wut ? " )
-- knock back in aoe
-- Self Knocked back ( slow 40 % )
- A rush 10 sec( 75 % movespeed ) ( knock back without immunity )
- A snare
- Tactic to increase defence (disrupt, evade parry 15 % )
- Earthquake damage in aoe
- Debuff CD aoe ( 5 sec for 10 sec )
- THE SQUIG PET, less damage taken by AOE ? realy ? ( It funny because you don't put that on WL but you prefer nerf healing group for the pet and give the reduce aoe damage only for the Squig armored ;) )

- Also when someone grab a squig/ squig armored, He can just self knocked back and no one can catch him, or he can ponce 3 or 4 time in row. ( the fact to be able to self knocked back in the air was removed from the SW ;) )

Seriously isn't a bit overkill ? This is serious or just a nigtmare ?
More op than a tank, more even than the OP guardian WL.
Balance will come soon or better to let this like that ?
4 or 6 Squig armored per SC, complelty stupid and impossible to win.
Think about that ...
- Tank more than a regular tank also with a guard unkillable
Nope, if you'd like to share the character sheet of any of your geared tanks I'll gladly compare with my geared tank SH and you can explain how my SH is tankier with no block and lower defensive stats. I have a geared tank we could compare to if you don't have one, but somehow he is tankier than my SH even though he runs a 2h and multiple offensive tactics so I must be doing something wrong somewhere. Guardian WL can build tanky too without any risk of losing half his armor from his pet dying and the spec also deals more damage for building tanky unlike SH, clearly OP right?

- Pounce( damage in aoe, also he can spam everytime " cd 10 wut ? " )
Does not do AoE damage. It has a 10sec CD and WL gets the exact same tactic to lower it to 0 seconds. WL pounce also has a 35% movespeed boost attached and no stance requirement making it clearly better.

- Tactic to increase defence (disrupt, evade parry 15 % )
That's actually a tactic to make a 10sec CD defendable attack proc those stats for you. You are not running around with those stats up 24/7. I very often get burst down before I'm able to proc it while in backlines making it a wasted tactic slot that fight (when I even run it which isn't very often atm because of how unreliable it is for me with low str).

- THE SQUIG PET, less damage taken by AOE ? realy ? ( It funny because you don't put that on WL but you prefer nerf healing group for the pet and give the reduce aoe damage only for the Squig armored ;) )
They actually did test this on WL for a time just like they are testing it on SH pet now. It was significantly stronger as well since it canceled all aoe damage that was not directly targeted on them, not just some of it (while also not being tied to a stance). I'm sure you were crying NERF WL then too cuz of how obviously broken and unfair that is.

- Also when someone grab a squig/ squig armored, He can just self knocked back and no one can catch him, or he can ponce 3 or 4 time in row. ( the fact to be able to self knocked back in the air was removed from the SW ;) )
Self punt works exactly the same as the SW one, including not being able to use it midair, can you stop making stuff up now? Pounce requires enemy targets, you can't pounce away 4 times in a row unless you are pouncing a chain of enemies which means you didn't pounce away from all the enemies, and order has no CD pounce too so how does our's make us unfairly uncatchable?

4-6 SH per SC? How terrible, that's really unfair since never in the history of this server have that many WLs been in the same SC at the same time.
https://imgur.com/a/jpYRCOY
(thank god they were mostly bad and underleveled)


more OP even than the OP guardian WL.
Spoiler:
Image
Guess I should make a list of everything a WL can do now and fill it with lies and exaggeration to counter your list better?
Last edited by Foomy44 on Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:33 pm, edited 4 times in total.
Destro: Chompy, ShroomStew, TrollBlood, DoomBeast, DoomDoctor, DoomDisk, Doomshadow, FunkFoot, Bloodwell
Order: Stormwall, Mistfall, CatNap, BoomRune, Bangman

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Arbich
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Re: Patch Notes 06/07/2018

Post#184 » Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:46 pm

Foomy44 wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:00 pm
Guess I should make a list of everything a WL can do now and fill it with lies and exaggeration to counter your list better?
Question is, if the WL is really balanced. You also added the SW in your comparison, when it suits you.
I think the damage of melee squig is just still ok, given the vast amount of utility he has. But I think the cooldown for calling your horned squig should be increased, as the SH has different pets and to make targeting the pet a more worthwhile option.
Arbich-BW/Xanthippe-WP/Schnipsel-AM

Foomy44
Posts: 572

Re: Patch Notes 06/07/2018

Post#185 » Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:23 pm

Spoiler:
Arbich wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:46 pm Question is, if the WL is really balanced. You also added the SW in your comparison, when it suits you.
I think the damage of melee squig is just still ok, given the vast amount of utility he has. But I think the cooldown for calling your horned squig should be increased, as the SH has different pets and to make targeting the pet a more worthwhile option.
Destro has been arguing for months that WL is stupid OP in small scale, bitching about WLs is a daily occurrence and I pretty much stopped playing most of my squishy toons 100% because of WLs. They are still here and still incredibly strong so apparently having a bunch of tools that make you extremely strong in small scale on 1 class and able to shut down most RDPS solo is considered balanced. WL still beats SH in small scale in my experience so them being better at large scale should be expected IMO. Not saying everything is perfectly balanced as is but a lot of order seem to be ignoring the power level of WLs when complaining about SHs now and I don't recall most of them complaining about WLs since the guardian rework so it seems pretty biased.

SW is a valid comparison because there are no perfect mirrors and plenty of moves and mechanics are shared with SW
viewtopic.php?f=71&t=27277&start=30#p309221
How am I supposed to defend SH self punt without bringing up the exact mirror ability SW has? WL gets plenty of stuff SH doesn't get that I'm not even bothering to mention so I don't consider bringing up mirror abilities an unfair comparison.
Last edited by Foomy44 on Wed Jul 11, 2018 10:15 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Destro: Chompy, ShroomStew, TrollBlood, DoomBeast, DoomDoctor, DoomDisk, Doomshadow, FunkFoot, Bloodwell
Order: Stormwall, Mistfall, CatNap, BoomRune, Bangman

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Arbich
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Re: Patch Notes 06/07/2018

Post#186 » Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:31 pm

Foomy44 wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:23 pm
Spoiler:
Arbich wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:46 pm Question is, if the WL is really balanced. You also added the SW in your comparison, when it suits you.
I think the damage of melee squig is just still ok, given the vast amount of utility he has. But I think the cooldown for calling your horned squig should be increased, as the SH has different pets and to make targeting the pet a more worthwhile option.
Destro has been arguing for months that WL is stupid OP in small scale, bitching about WL's is a daily occurrence and I pretty much stopped playing most of my squishy toons 100% because of WLs. They are still here and still incredibly strong so apparently having a bunch of tools that make you extremely strong in small scale on 1 class and able to shut down most RDPS solo is considered balanced. WL still beats SH in small scale in my experience so them being better at large scale should be expected.

SW is a valid comparison because there are no perfect mirrors and plenty of moves and mechanics are shared with SW
viewtopic.php?f=71&t=27277&start=30#p309221
How am I supposed to defend SH self punt without bringing up the exact mirror ability SW has?
Someone claimed SH is OP. You respond with a comparison between SH and WL (maybe the OP order toon ). And for the ability the WL actually don´t have, you also bring up the SW. Your comparison was correct, but I don´t think you debunk the claim that SH is op now. That was your goal, wasn´t it?
Arbich-BW/Xanthippe-WP/Schnipsel-AM

Foomy44
Posts: 572

Re: Patch Notes 06/07/2018

Post#187 » Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:38 pm

Spoiler:
Arbich wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:31 pm
Foomy44 wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:23 pm
Spoiler:
Arbich wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:46 pm Question is, if the WL is really balanced. You also added the SW in your comparison, when it suits you.
I think the damage of melee squig is just still ok, given the vast amount of utility he has. But I think the cooldown for calling your horned squig should be increased, as the SH has different pets and to make targeting the pet a more worthwhile option.
Destro has been arguing for months that WL is stupid OP in small scale, bitching about WL's is a daily occurrence and I pretty much stopped playing most of my squishy toons 100% because of WLs. They are still here and still incredibly strong so apparently having a bunch of tools that make you extremely strong in small scale on 1 class and able to shut down most RDPS solo is considered balanced. WL still beats SH in small scale in my experience so them being better at large scale should be expected.

SW is a valid comparison because there are no perfect mirrors and plenty of moves and mechanics are shared with SW
viewtopic.php?f=71&t=27277&start=30#p309221
How am I supposed to defend SH self punt without bringing up the exact mirror ability SW has?
Someone claimed SH is OP. You respond with a comparison between SH and WL (maybe the OP order toon ). And for the ability the WL actually don´t have, you also bring up the SW. Your comparison was correct, but I don´t think you debunk the claim that SH is op now. That was your goal, wasn´t it?
These classes don't exist in a vacuum and the game is not balanced around 1v1, balance proposals don't even allow you to discuss fights smaller than 6v6. When I'm am discussing the capabilities of destro I tend to bring up the capabilities of order. My goal was mostly to correct a lot of the misinformation in that post and put some context to some of the stuff being claimed to be OP. I honestly don't know if it's balanced or not. When I play my guardian WL I feel pretty stupidly OP most of the time, when I play my SH I feel close to that now, so I guess that's balance right?

AoE CD debuff might be too strong (easy to land) on a class with access to no CD pounce. If that got moved to another class though I would hope for compensation, especially considering indigestion with no debuff would still cost a mastery point.

Patch notes clearly state values are subject to change, if people really feel SH is unfairly OP atm compared to anything order has and can provide some decent arguments start making balance proposals, would be a lot more useful and hopefully more accurate than a lot of the posts I'm seeing here.
Destro: Chompy, ShroomStew, TrollBlood, DoomBeast, DoomDoctor, DoomDisk, Doomshadow, FunkFoot, Bloodwell
Order: Stormwall, Mistfall, CatNap, BoomRune, Bangman

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Acidic
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Re: Patch Notes 06/07/2018

Post#188 » Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:40 pm

Well the very worst can be that order see that when we talk about balance Destro tend to be more open minded than the discussions on WL and other obviously unbalanced crap that they defend to the hilt

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dansari
Posts: 2524

Re: Patch Notes 06/07/2018

Post#189 » Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:45 pm

Acidic wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:40 pm Well the very worst can be that order see that when we talk about balance Destro tend to be more open minded than the discussions on WL and other obviously unbalanced crap that they defend to the hilt
Lol. Slaughtering in 1v1 or 1v3ing pugs vs an armored, relatively good burst damage, uncatchable, versatile class with spot in group and warband without changing specs. seemsgood.gif. I fully expect SH to be tweaked just like WL was, but please spare the holier than thou attitude regarding balance.
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Acidic
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Re: Patch Notes 06/07/2018

Post#190 » Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:58 pm

dansari wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:45 pm
Acidic wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 9:40 pm Well the very worst can be that order see that when we talk about balance Destro tend to be more open minded than the discussions on WL and other obviously unbalanced crap that they defend to the hilt
Lol. Slaughtering in 1v1 or 1v3ing pugs vs an armored, relatively good burst damage, uncatchable, versatile class with spot in group and warband without changing specs. seemsgood.gif. I fully expect SH to be tweaked just like WL was, but please spare the holier than thou attitude regarding balance.
Read what I wrote, I fully expect a balance I also fully expect SW and WL lovers to cry as usual.
The point is that what I wrote was that there is a less dramatic defense most of the Destro. My point was specifically to remind order fan bots that when looking at this they should remember what it feels like to be on the other side.
Easy to use “lol” to try seem smart but as your tag is a balance moderator you probably should be a bit more thoughtful. Did I defend SH ? Did I say it was ok ?
No.
did order cry like f..k when any mentioned order issues WL, ...., yes
Anyway trying hardest not to be rude but hard after so long with order ignoring blatantly op skills

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