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Patch Notes 23/03/2019

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Nidwin
Posts: 642

Re: Patch Notes 23/03/2019

Post#451 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:09 pm

peterthepan3 wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:17 pm
Nidwin wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:06 pm
Zod24 wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 11:37 am


Spoken like someone who really has no idea about what a 50-25 reduction means for 2h tanking in general. What is 'abuse double 2h cross guarded tanks gameplay'? You hitting on cross guarded tanks as a Witch Elf?
You're such a tease. I just hope that mom's going to tell you a nice story tonight when you dig in.

The issue with 2H tanks is that they're still mitigating like tanks. So what we are having here are 2 not so loldps 2H tanks cross guarding each other and reducing a crapload of damage thrown at them to noise.

Conq 3.3k armor and I doubt, except Chinesehero maybe, that 2h tanks are running around with 6.5k wounds and 250 toughness.
My WE's explode in 3-4 gcd when two 2H not so loldps focus them. Best case scenario for my WE's.

Cry me a river Zod24 and I think you know what you can do for my part. :twisted:
Why are people peddling this myth?

You lose out on Block
You lose out on Hold the Line

You keep your Heavy Armour - that's true - but you are nowhere near as good as a SnB is for deflecting damage from teammates onto yourself, nor can you stay afloat half as well when pressured.

If you see two tanks crossguarding each other, then you should get your tanks to utilise timed punts on one of them, so that you can deliver your WE burst the moment their Guard is no longer effective (if you don't believe a 2h tank can be blown up easily, I implore you to ask some of the WEs like Nicelook or Teinhala for their thoughts on the matter).
Yes Peter, 1 2H tank implodes fast but that's not the issue. I'm also thinking it's not that you don't understand what I write, but you do NOT want to.

And again you're using an aspect of the "gambler's fallacy", "falacy of authority" while cherry picking and going out of context.

Cross guarded 2h tanks don't act like tanks but as mdps and go straight for the squishies and/or healers, when possible. That's fine and all good and well, except that they mitigate like tanks while beating the crap out of what they're hitting. Now that change to 75-25 with guard isn't going to change much anyway but it's at least something.
Nidwinqq used teabag Magus [Hysteria]

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Nekkma
Posts: 378

Re: Patch Notes 23/03/2019

Post#452 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:13 pm

Nidwin wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:06 pm

The issue with 2H tanks is that they're still mitigating like tanks. So what we are having here are 2 not so loldps 2H tanks cross guarding each other and reducing a crapload of damage thrown at them to noise.

Conq 3.3k armor and I doubt, except Chinesehero maybe, that 2h tanks are running around with 6.5k wounds and 250 toughness.
My WE's explode in 3-4 gcd when two 2H not so loldps focus them. Best case scenario for my WE's.
The issue in that situation is that you lack guard and healing. This is in no way related to 2handed tanks.
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Telen
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Re: Patch Notes 23/03/2019

Post#453 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:14 pm

One of the better changes on ror is 2h being able to avoid guard damage. There always needed to be some drawback over snb. So what do ppl prefer? Lower guard or can’t risk guard.
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SmackdownNinja
Posts: 72

Re: Patch Notes 23/03/2019

Post#454 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:23 pm

Nidwin wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:09 pm
peterthepan3 wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:17 pm
Nidwin wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:06 pm


You're such a tease. I just hope that mom's going to tell you a nice story tonight when you dig in.

The issue with 2H tanks is that they're still mitigating like tanks. So what we are having here are 2 not so loldps 2H tanks cross guarding each other and reducing a crapload of damage thrown at them to noise.

Conq 3.3k armor and I doubt, except Chinesehero maybe, that 2h tanks are running around with 6.5k wounds and 250 toughness.
My WE's explode in 3-4 gcd when two 2H not so loldps focus them. Best case scenario for my WE's.

Cry me a river Zod24 and I think you know what you can do for my part. :twisted:
Why are people peddling this myth?

You lose out on Block
You lose out on Hold the Line

You keep your Heavy Armour - that's true - but you are nowhere near as good as a SnB is for deflecting damage from teammates onto yourself, nor can you stay afloat half as well when pressured.

If you see two tanks crossguarding each other, then you should get your tanks to utilise timed punts on one of them, so that you can deliver your WE burst the moment their Guard is no longer effective (if you don't believe a 2h tank can be blown up easily, I implore you to ask some of the WEs like Nicelook or Teinhala for their thoughts on the matter).
Yes Peter, 1 2H tank implodes fast but that's not the issue. I'm also thinking it's not that you don't understand what I write, but you do NOT want to.

And again you're using an aspect of the "gambler's fallacy", "falacy of authority" while cherry picking and going out of context.

Cross guarded 2h tanks don't act like tanks but as mdps and go straight for the squishies and/or healers, when possible. That's fine and all good and well, except that they mitigate like tanks while beating the crap out of what they're hitting. Now that change to 75-25 with guard isn't going to change much anyway but it's at least something.
There is no way a 2h tank will reach the same damage as a dps class. Also if those two tanks are cross guarding each other while attacking healers, which also probably used detaunt lol, what is happening to their group? Their dps and healers are unguarded and they won’t be able to fulfill their roles properly. Look at the bigger picture man, they are just causing their team harm in the end and they accomplish nothing.
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Tobias26
Posts: 70

Re: Patch Notes 23/03/2019

Post#455 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:28 pm

Spoiler:
SmackdownNinja wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:23 pm
Nidwin wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:09 pm
peterthepan3 wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:17 pm


Why are people peddling this myth?

You lose out on Block
You lose out on Hold the Line

You keep your Heavy Armour - that's true - but you are nowhere near as good as a SnB is for deflecting damage from teammates onto yourself, nor can you stay afloat half as well when pressured.

If you see two tanks crossguarding each other, then you should get your tanks to utilise timed punts on one of them, so that you can deliver your WE burst the moment their Guard is no longer effective (if you don't believe a 2h tank can be blown up easily, I implore you to ask some of the WEs like Nicelook or Teinhala for their thoughts on the matter).
Yes Peter, 1 2H tank implodes fast but that's not the issue. I'm also thinking it's not that you don't understand what I write, but you do NOT want to.

And again you're using an aspect of the "gambler's fallacy", "falacy of authority" while cherry picking and going out of context.

Cross guarded 2h tanks don't act like tanks but as mdps and go straight for the squishies and/or healers, when possible. That's fine and all good and well, except that they mitigate like tanks while beating the crap out of what they're hitting. Now that change to 75-25 with guard isn't going to change much anyway but it's at least something.
There is no way a 2h tank will reach the same damage as a dps class. Also if those two tanks are cross guarding each other while attacking healers, which also probably used detaunt lol, what is happening to their group? Their dps and healers are unguarded and they won’t be able to fulfill their roles properly. Look at the bigger picture man, they are just causing their team harm in the end and they accomplish nothing.
Not to mention, the healer would press one button and continue to heal his team without paying attention to these two harmless idiots.
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peterthepan3
Posts: 6509

Re: Patch Notes 23/03/2019

Post#456 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:32 pm

Nidwin wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:09 pm
peterthepan3 wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:17 pm
Nidwin wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:06 pm


You're such a tease. I just hope that mom's going to tell you a nice story tonight when you dig in.

The issue with 2H tanks is that they're still mitigating like tanks. So what we are having here are 2 not so loldps 2H tanks cross guarding each other and reducing a crapload of damage thrown at them to noise.

Conq 3.3k armor and I doubt, except Chinesehero maybe, that 2h tanks are running around with 6.5k wounds and 250 toughness.
My WE's explode in 3-4 gcd when two 2H not so loldps focus them. Best case scenario for my WE's.

Cry me a river Zod24 and I think you know what you can do for my part. :twisted:
Why are people peddling this myth?

You lose out on Block
You lose out on Hold the Line

You keep your Heavy Armour - that's true - but you are nowhere near as good as a SnB is for deflecting damage from teammates onto yourself, nor can you stay afloat half as well when pressured.

If you see two tanks crossguarding each other, then you should get your tanks to utilise timed punts on one of them, so that you can deliver your WE burst the moment their Guard is no longer effective (if you don't believe a 2h tank can be blown up easily, I implore you to ask some of the WEs like Nicelook or Teinhala for their thoughts on the matter).
Yes Peter, 1 2H tank implodes fast but that's not the issue. I'm also thinking it's not that you don't understand what I write, but you do NOT want to.

And again you're using an aspect of the "gambler's fallacy", "falacy of authority" while cherry picking and going out of context.

Cross guarded 2h tanks don't act like tanks but as mdps and go straight for the squishies and/or healers, when possible. That's fine and all good and well, except that they mitigate like tanks while beating the crap out of what they're hitting. Now that change to 75-25 with guard isn't going to change much anyway but it's at least something.
1 2h IB & a SNB WP will last much longer than 2 2h tanks.

Of course they mitigate like tanks: they are tanks. Their damage is negligible if you use a detaunt.

I don't understand the point you're trying to make, that 2 x 2h SMs can guard eachother and kill unorganised players?
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Drysill
Posts: 33

Re: Patch Notes 23/03/2019

Post#457 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:36 pm

marisco wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 9:48 am
Drysill wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 9:08 am
I hear ‘I play 2h but its only on defensive role and bla bla bla’… Who are you trying to convince?? Some 5-y old?? You play 2h for the extra dps. If you want extra dps and extra offensive utility, you need to sacrifice some defensive for that, its only fair, just like the other off-spec classes.
LOL. Have ever you played a 2h tank? If you want to actually pull some meaningful damage you gotta slot offensive talis alongside using the scenario sets. That already reduces your defenses. That's the tradeoff in itself. If you go full strenght you melt like paper.

A defensive slotted 2h tank does barely any more damage than a snb tank. There's a whole thread here viewtopic.php?f=8&t=30944 crunching the numbers. I suggest you either read that up or, dunno, play a tank before running your mouth like that.

The majority of people go 2h because of the utility in small-scale engagements, not because they wanna do dps.
FYI, I do play a tank so you need to be more polite with ppl you know nothing about, kid.

This is not a real tradeoff since skills like Taunt, Challenge, Guard and Heavy armor are independent from attributes/rr points. Moreover, you really don’t melt like paper with 400-500 toughness (see below), 700 resistance (see below again) and 4k armor, unless 1 enemy WB walks over you… so try harder..

Utility you say??? The +45% dps of the weapon is collateral I guess and what can you do??? you have to take it.
Hilarius…
Tobias26 wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:30 pm
Drysill wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 12:17 pm

Yes i agree, as long as you give DPS class ALL tank skills/abilities as well.
Give my WL all typical abilities of a tank class, including Taunt, Challenge, 1k toughness, 0,7k resistance, Heavy Armor, 100f Punt and bla bla bla...
Deal?
I should have known you were playing for WL... If you are trying to achieve at least any dps from your tank - you will have no more than 400-500 toughness. Resistance have the tank not differ from resistance another class - 700 resistance is obtained with aura, which can act on your WL also, as and on my tank. With focused offence tactic, the tank has no more armor than your WL. Punch - no problem, just with remove your Fetch. Taunt - no problem, it will replace your Primal Fury. Deal?
Firstly, I play all types DPS, Healer and Tank.
Secondly, what happen to 1st deal? It backfired on you so now you ask for something else???
Thirdly, exactly what you say.. Double the toughness, double the resistance (keep other’s influence out) but NOT half the strength, NOT half the crit%...

You want Double the defenses and Equal the offenses… let me think about it…………NO

All I say is there is a need to be a real tradeoff between offence and defense, to be fair for all.. the more you get in one, the more you lose in the other… simple.

Tobias26
Posts: 70

Re: Patch Notes 23/03/2019

Post#458 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:56 pm

Drysill wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:36 pm
Firstly, I play all types DPS, Healer and Tank.
Secondly, what happen to 1st deal? It backfired on you so now you ask for something else???
Thirdly, exactly what you say.. Double the toughness, double the resistance (keep other’s influence out) but NOT half the strength, NOT half the crit%...

You want Double the defenses and Equal the offenses… let me think about it…………NO

All I say is there is a need to be a real tradeoff between offence and defense, to be fair for all.. the more you get in one, the more you lose in the other… simple.
You offer to take away from tanks, offering nothing in return. I'm just trying to explain that tanks mostly are unfairly nerfed classes, and with recent changes to the protection of the 6 trees of the skills become useless. Before there was at least some sort of compromise (which I have always disagreed and thought that was not enough) - 2h tanks have low or extremely low dps, low mobility and lack of many things inherent in the dps classes, but instead having the guard and opportunities to reduce damage from the enemies (what I consider to be insufficient compensation for the low dps and lack of so many needed for the melee class of things). Now in addition 2h tanks cant guard. In the end, 2h tank still cant do damage, cant guard and in fact has become useless to the group. 2x tanks needs up, but they was nerfed even more without some reason.
Duis - Chosen 40/76
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Nidwin
Posts: 642

Re: Patch Notes 23/03/2019

Post#459 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 2:13 pm

peterthepan3 wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:32 pm
I don't understand the point you're trying to make, that 2 x 2h SMs can guard eachother and kill unorganised players?
Clearly,
I'm done here.

EP -> jobe done
Nerf Magus more :lol:
Nidwinqq used teabag Magus [Hysteria]

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Nekkma
Posts: 378

Re: Patch Notes 23/03/2019

Post#460 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 2:13 pm

Telen wrote:
Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:14 pm
One of the better changes on ror is 2h being able to avoid guard damage. There always needed to be some drawback over snb. So what do ppl prefer? Lower guard or can’t risk guard.
The perceived problem seems to me to be the damage 2h tanks can put out. If this is indeed deemed as a problem then I would rather prefer to adjust the damage output as the 2handed tank should first and foremost be a tank. In such a process one needs to address utility as well since some classes clearly have less of it.

Personally, I think this mainly is an order pug scenario problem as the destro paintrain consisting of BOs and BGs is difficult to deal with if you lack healers and/or tanks. However, the game should not be balanced around that.
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