Patch Notes 17/08/2019

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Sulorie
Posts: 4160

Re: Patch Notes 17/08/2019

Post#111 » Sat Aug 17, 2019 8:19 pm

rmpl wrote:
Sat Aug 17, 2019 8:07 pm
Sulorie wrote:
Sat Aug 17, 2019 8:01 pm
A melee class with no-cd pounce has basically some kind of range snare, range kd and additionally a cd increaser, 75% 10sec charge (high cd but longer duration and speed compared with usual melee dd charge) and long range aoe kb. I forgot to mention the snare lasts almost twice its cooldown, while other melee dd have the opposite with 5sec snare with 10sec cd.

Shall I go on?
Your theorycrafting is irrelevant, you never stepped into Caledor Woods. You are oblivious to what is actually going on at the highest level of gameplay where the best players are pushing their classes to the limits.
Do you have any arguments besides "6vs6 bruh"?
Dying is no option.

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nat3s
Posts: 92

Re: Patch Notes 17/08/2019

Post#112 » Sat Aug 17, 2019 8:28 pm

Nefarian78 wrote:
Sat Aug 17, 2019 7:40 pm
Sulorie wrote:
Sat Aug 17, 2019 6:37 pm
Nah, melee SH were more potent than those, in the mentioned gear, despite having no crit dmg or aa tactic. Their dmg was slightly overperforming for the available mobility and utility.
*Laughs in aSW and WL*

mSH was perfectly fine as it was and it was nowhere near close being a "high performance" class. The only good thing about the class is Squig Leap to catch people while roaming.

Edit: Also wanted to add...The nerfs to Destro have to stop, for real. Try playing 6mans in both sides with the same people every single day and you'll notice the abyss of difference in strenght and synergy between Order and Destro.
This^

I'm all for balance, but there are some significant outliers at present which need toning back... None of those are melee squigs! ASW, WL, Slayer with their new 20% ap bonus, dps AM.

whats the driver for the odd balance decisions? I don't believe the devs favour Order, they put too much time and effort into funding this project both financially and in terms of their time to sabotage it, so i can only think it's to try to keep the pop from spiking over to Destro.

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wargrimnir
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Re: Patch Notes 17/08/2019

Post#113 » Sat Aug 17, 2019 8:34 pm

Nadril21 wrote:
Sat Aug 17, 2019 5:40 pm
The way domination triggered did need some serious tweaking, sometimes SCs just drag on like torture. With that said the change to the way it reduces time on the scenario instead of ticking up points is counter productive. The scenarios should always tick up at the end. Prior to this patch, the SC scores ticked up for BOTH sides giving both the winning and losing team more emblems.

Removing this and making the Oppressor grind harder, which is already insane coupled with the new weapons, seems like cruel and unusual punishment.
This is the first iteration of what we already expected would need additional cases built in to prevent legitimate fights from ending early. As per usual, the immense wave of whine on the day of the patch is not unexpected. Sometimes I think people do this so they can "aha!" themselves later when we inevitably adjust things anyway.

We're not idiots, this stuff also takes time to implement, and getting it working in the first place wasn't a simple snap of the fingers.

As for the intent, that hasn't changed. If one side is being mercilessly stomped with no recourse, we strongly want to discourage that. Fighting and killing is part of any scenario, but as has been stated MANY times, sitting at a spawn ignorning an objective and farming kills for 15 minutes is not what anyone (allegedly) wants to engage in. It's not FUN for the attackers, it's definitely not FUN for the defenders. Better to get both groups out of there asap.

Domination affecting score only FURTHER encouraged this behavior as a strong enough group would simply wipe defenders, spawncamp, and get a full 500 points in the least amount of time possible. Since we're well aware the contingent of players most likely to ignore objectives and spawncamp defenders also has significant overlap with the players who are driven solely by gear acquisition and the path of least resistance, leaving this intact makes very little sense when both behaviors need to be curbed for a healthy gameplay alternative.

Unintended consequences are simply unintended. A few more checks need to be thrown in-place to make sure that either the "losing" team is not ahead in points or at least close, or both teams are not well saturated with kills (which implies a nice brawl is going on). We simply want to catch instances where one team is totally rolled over by the other, as these instances are the ones that make people afk, quit, give up, and stop playing scenarios entirely.
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wargrimnir
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Re: Patch Notes 17/08/2019

Post#114 » Sat Aug 17, 2019 8:39 pm

nat3s wrote:
Sat Aug 17, 2019 8:28 pm

whats the driver for the odd balance decisions? I don't believe the devs favour Order, they put too much time and effort into funding this project both financially and in terms of their time to sabotage it, so i can only think it's to try to keep the pop from spiking over to Destro.
This one was driven solely by a bug that was being abused. While the ability to stack both tactics was in-game for quite a while, it was never intended to stack. This was working at some point, but apparently either broke, or wasn't tested well enough. We're not in the habit of balance via bugfixing, but we're also not going to open a can of worms over bugfixing either.
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rmpl
Posts: 766

Re: Patch Notes 17/08/2019

Post#115 » Sat Aug 17, 2019 8:42 pm

Sulorie wrote:
Sat Aug 17, 2019 8:19 pm
Do you have any arguments besides "6vs6 bruh"?
No, it is not necessary. If you do not have any 6v6 experience your opinion will most likely be flawed or bias because you simply have not seen what good synergised players can do with certain classes when pushed to their limits with best specs and gear. To an average player msh might look like it's overperforming, the class sounds great on paper but in reality it is never used in serious play simply because there are much better choices. This is why this change baffles most good players, the devs are nerfing a class that was already underperforming.

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TenTonHammer
Posts: 3705

Re: Patch Notes 17/08/2019

Post#116 » Sat Aug 17, 2019 8:53 pm

nat3s wrote:
Sat Aug 17, 2019 8:28 pm
Nefarian78 wrote:
Sat Aug 17, 2019 7:40 pm
Sulorie wrote:
Sat Aug 17, 2019 6:37 pm
Nah, melee SH were more potent than those, in the mentioned gear, despite having no crit dmg or aa tactic. Their dmg was slightly overperforming for the available mobility and utility.
*Laughs in aSW and WL*

mSH was perfectly fine as it was and it was nowhere near close being a "high performance" class. The only good thing about the class is Squig Leap to catch people while roaming.

Edit: Also wanted to add...The nerfs to Destro have to stop, for real. Try playing 6mans in both sides with the same people every single day and you'll notice the abyss of difference in strenght and synergy between Order and Destro.
This^

I'm all for balance, but there are some significant outliers at present which need toning back... None of those are melee squigs! ASW, WL, Slayer with their new 20% ap bonus, dps AM.

whats the driver for the odd balance decisions? I don't believe the devs favour Order, they put too much time and effort into funding this project both financially and in terms of their time to sabotage it, so i can only think it's to try to keep the pop from spiking over to Destro.
Some time back wargrim shot down implementing cosmetic armor sets because destro npcs had better looking stuff so if they implemented it it will result in a population swing for destro
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Scottx125
Posts: 188

Re: Patch Notes 17/08/2019

Post#117 » Sat Aug 17, 2019 9:06 pm

SC change sounds good on paper but makes no sense. Surely it should be a combination of things such as if you're outnumbered by more than 2+ players and the enemy side has 12 more kills THEN they count as dominating. If the teams are even, and one side is dominating. Surely they then deserve the max reward without having the other team sitting through it for 15 mins... But even with said change, SC's are dying. The queue time is ridiculous and the grind is punishingly bad.

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wargrimnir
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Re: Patch Notes 17/08/2019

Post#118 » Sat Aug 17, 2019 9:18 pm

Scottx125 wrote:
Sat Aug 17, 2019 9:06 pm
SC change sounds good on paper but makes no sense. Surely it should be a combination of things such as if you're outnumbered by more than 2+ players and the enemy side has 12 more kills THEN they count as dominating. If the teams are even, and one side is dominating. Surely they then deserve the max reward without having the other team sitting through it for 15 mins... But even with said change, SC's are dying. The queue time is ridiculous and the grind is punishingly bad.
I guess it's easier to pretend that no one has responded to anything in this thread that already addresses your concern.
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wachlarz
Posts: 248

Re: Patch Notes 17/08/2019

Post#119 » Sat Aug 17, 2019 9:48 pm

Sulorie wrote:
Sat Aug 17, 2019 8:01 pm
rmpl wrote:
Sat Aug 17, 2019 7:27 pm
Sulorie wrote:
Sat Aug 17, 2019 6:37 pm
Nah, melee SH were more potent than those, in the mentioned gear, despite having no crit dmg or aa tactic. Their dmg was slightly overperforming for the available mobility and utility.
Do you play anything else other than solo scs and orvr?
Where did you lost your common sense?

A melee class with no-cd pounce has basically some kind of range snare, range kd and additionally a cd increaser, 75% 10sec charge (high cd but longer duration and speed compared with usual melee dd charge) and long range aoe kb. I forgot to mention the snare lasts almost twice its cooldown, while other melee dd have the opposite with 5sec snare with 10sec cd.

Shall I go on?
WL got 10 sec slow and 5 sec cd...

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Jail
Posts: 376

Re: Patch Notes 17/08/2019

Post#120 » Sat Aug 17, 2019 10:29 pm

Zegota wrote:
Sat Aug 17, 2019 11:49 am
Natherul wrote:
Sat Aug 17, 2019 11:07 am
Not doing the objective and farming kills in SCs are def something we want to penalize
Ahahahaha
Is this a late april's fools joke meme lives!

How about you just delete scs at this point. Don't let them suffer.
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