Patch Notes 28/05/2021

[sogeou]

Nobody is cut off from the game and who exactly as hurting?

This thread is one giant overreaction from people that somehow cant press more then two buttons.

Honestly, its embarrassing.

Furthermore, if its just about ability sequencing, why not use Plan B? That seems to be what everyone is pretending that they used it for, yet there is an option that can do the same thing, and yet people are still begging for NB back. Its almost like people were using it for way more then just sequencing.

First sequencing should not be an issue. One good thing about having balanced addon's is everyone has access. Everyone might not know how to make a real macro or use other software.

Second, Plan B is NOT a sequencer. It just moves other hotbars in place of the top one. And it was broken as of yesterday.

[Akalukz]

Don't get me wrong - I hear you, as do the developers who made this change.

My post was to shine light to a member of the community who aired a valid reason for NB - benefitting their individual circumstances, i.e. those with disabilities who rely on such addons to streamline their game experience and allow them to experience things other members of the community take granted for doing so.

The problem lies where people take advantage of such addons to enhance their gameplay - changing an addon from being something to support an individuals means of playing and experiencing the game - to an addon that enhances a players ability levels by automating certain aspects of combat.

Your point is valid, NB has been a core part of RoR for a long time - and your question is also valid, i.e. 'why now?'. However I am not in a position to answer these questions as I personally did not implement the change. This is the reason I have personally kept away from the NB conversations and in my initial post highlighted I would only be addressing the individuals posts as he came at the change from a direction of accessibility which is something I felt worth in replying to.

It would be REALLY nice if you could coax a Dev to come in here and talk to the disabled people they have cut off from the game. I hadn't even considered them before coming here and reading this. Its not good at all. They are no where to be found and people are hurting from this change.

It's one thing to say you hear them and care, and another entirely to do the right thing.

We are looking at alternate options to assist those with accessibility issues get back to playing RoR as they enjoy. I think you, and others, are missing the point. NB was used by a minority for accessibility, it was used enmass to gain an advantage which caused the addon to be required to remain competitive. Addons are there to support - they aren't there to enhance gameplay to the point that if you don't use them you're at a disadvantage.

You might want to look at Tether if this is the qualification.

[Lokiusus]

Nobody is cut off from the game and who exactly as hurting?

This thread is one giant overreaction from people that somehow cant press more then two buttons.

Honestly, its embarrassing.

Furthermore, if its just about ability sequencing, why not use Plan B? That seems to be what everyone is pretending that they used it for, yet there is an option that can do the same thing, and yet people are still begging for NB back. Its almost like people were using it for way more then just sequencing.

Can't help to reply to the "epic gamer" post above:

1. People actually do have disabilities that limit their ability to play twister on their keyboards. That disability could be something ranging from a couple missing fingers to a cerebral palsy. You're effectively dehumanizing anyone without perfect use of both hands by suggesting that their cessation of playing the game isn't hurting "anyone" and/or that they're just lazy. Think about that.

2. Plan B is broken and won't be fixed because it's a 3rd party addon (see my rejected bug report https://github.com/WarEmu/WarBugs/issues/19071).

3. Plan B only worked for SM/BLORK.

[Sulorie]

Addons are there to support - they aren't there to enhance gameplay to the point that if you don't use them you're at a disadvantage.

Taking this definition, then multiple UI enhancing addons like enemy or buffhead and many more qualify for being a huge advantage.
You hardly see what hits you, who you actually target and let's not talk about following your guard target as tank.
Guess why so many new players get farmed and they don't actually fight back, as they don't see it coming.
Or tanks who manage to find the guard button but struggle to follow. Even seeing who needs heal is a challenge.
NB isn't even coming close to their effect on gameplay.

[Alfa1986]

Don't forget that people with disabilities are often closed in themselves and do not like to show /discover to the others their physical disabilities, much less complaining and begging that ppl around to feel sorry for them. only one out of ten will express their claims directly, and nine will simply leave in silence. when you say that there are few such people in reality you do not know how many there are. I admite that there can be quite a lot of them since computer games for them are, in fact, the most accessible form of entertainment and pastime.

[anthiquery]

Nobody is cut off from the game and who exactly as hurting?

This thread is one giant overreaction from people that somehow cant press more then two buttons.

Honestly, its embarrassing.

Furthermore, if its just about ability sequencing, why not use Plan B? That seems to be what everyone is pretending that they used it for, yet there is an option that can do the same thing, and yet people are still begging for NB back. Its almost like people were using it for way more then just sequencing.

I hope for you that you will never become disabled , what you say is just discriminatory and offensive

[Skullgrin]

Ok, after seeing another forum thread that made the claim that the number of posts in this thread meant something important, I decided to go through all 50+ pages of this thread and get an actual count of those for or against the NerfedButtons ban, along with a few other items of interest. So here are the numbers I came up with -

People approving NerfedButtons removal - 54

People against NerfedButtons removal - 28

People neither for or against NerfedButtons removal (I know its weird, right?) - 5

People claiming to need NerfedButtons because of a disability - 6

People White Knighting for the disabled to try to get NerfedButtons brought back - 16

People with a disability that are against NerfedButtons (me, I have arthritis) - 1

Number of trolls that should probably consider themselves lucky that they haven't been banned - 7


Interestingly, there is almost twice as much support for removing NerfedButtons as there is for keeping it. As for the rest, I'll leave it up to you to determine what it all means. And once you do, please let me know because I haven't a clue...

[Sulorie]

Ok, after seeing another forum thread that made the claim that the number of posts in this thread meant something important, I decided to go through all 50+ pages of this thread and get an actual count of those for or against the NerfedButtons ban, along with a few other items of interest. So here are the numbers I came up with -

People approving NerfedButtons removal - 54

People against NerfedButtons removal - 28

People neither for or against NerfedButtons removal (I know its weird, right?) - 5

People claiming to need NerfedButtons because of a disability - 6

People White Knighting for the disabled to try to get NerfedButtons brought back - 16

People with a disability that are against NerfedButtons (me, I have arthritis) - 1

Number of trolls that should probably consider themselves lucky that they haven't been banned - 7


Interestingly, there is almost twice as much support for removing NerfedButtons as there is for keeping it. As for the rest, I'll leave it up to you to determine what it all means. And once you do, please let me know because I haven't a clue...

You counted posts or individual users? Are there even so many forum users? :^)

[Skullgrin]

You counted posts or individual users? Are there even so many forum users? :^)

Individual forum posters, at least as closely as I could. Those against the ban tended to post more often, so the count of them may actually be over-represented by a few.

And before anyone asks, yes, I included myself in the number of trolls counted. So that number is correct too!

[Onigokko0101]

Nobody is cut off from the game and who exactly as hurting?

This thread is one giant overreaction from people that somehow cant press more then two buttons.

Honestly, its embarrassing.

Furthermore, if its just about ability sequencing, why not use Plan B? That seems to be what everyone is pretending that they used it for, yet there is an option that can do the same thing, and yet people are still begging for NB back. Its almost like people were using it for way more then just sequencing.

First sequencing should not be an issue. One good thing about having balanced addon's is everyone has access. Everyone might not know how to make a real macro or use other software.

Second, Plan B is NOT a sequencer. It just moves other hotbars in place of the top one. And it was broken as of yesterday.

If everyone had access to something that instantly killed someone it wouldnt make it balanced.