Recent Topics

Ads

[Marauder change] patch notes discussion (28/03/20)

Chosen, Magus, Marauder, Zealot

Moderators: Developer, Management, Web Developer

Forum rules
Before posting on this forum, be sure to read the Terms of Use
Your topic MUST start with your class name between hooks (IE : [Shaman] blablabla)
Sofong
Posts: 113

Re: [Marauder change] patch notes discussion (28/03/20)

Post#101 » Wed Apr 01, 2020 1:07 pm

Likeaboss wrote:
Wed Apr 01, 2020 1:00 pm
Sofong wrote:
Wed Apr 01, 2020 12:55 pm
Spoiler:
Likeaboss wrote:
Wed Apr 01, 2020 12:45 pm


oh no... you loose the tactic when you switch stance... damn thats really a mess. I mean Marauder is the only char with such Tactics.

And hold on, WHAT? Monstro buff only last in Monstro stance? Sure you should make it last longer and hold even when you switch to other stances, i mean it is just a 1000 selfheal buff over 5s on a dps, and not an unique OP armorpenetration-immunity buff...


Sarcasm Sheldon^^


Reminds me back in 2008 when Marauder only was debuffer without crit dmg tactic and others stuff, everyone cried for a buff,
and Galva kept fragging everyone, even befor the buff.
really? slayer/sw/engi 120ws120str120ballistic -toughness tactics are core...... i remember monstro proc used to last through stance idk since when it was nerfed.
What about WL tactic? have of them require an active Pet, when it dies your tactics are worthless 15s...
Dont Slot it, or deal with it... Bu don't cry on forum
.... all i say at #81 was the changes are nice and some advice on TB, u brought up the not able switching stances and other stuff, ok, whatever.... goodbye.

Ads
User avatar
Likeaboss
Posts: 111

Re: [Marauder change] patch notes discussion (28/03/20)

Post#102 » Wed Apr 01, 2020 1:09 pm

Sofong wrote:
Wed Apr 01, 2020 6:53 am
players almost always stay on sav stance(i know i do)
cheers m8

User avatar
Grock
Posts: 532

Re: [Marauder change] patch notes discussion (28/03/20)

Post#103 » Wed Apr 01, 2020 1:41 pm

Fanaticseb wrote:
Wed Apr 01, 2020 12:47 pm
ye i don't agree with "extra maintenance without any actual skill/decisionmaking part", because watching your buffs/debuffs and acting accordingly is skill. I mean its alot of overhead, but there are ppl out there that love to play a high skill ceiling class and perform well with it.
I'm not sure if you understood my point correctly.
Removing CD from stance switching will make it so you could switch stance at any time you need it, and the only thing you'd lose is a few seconds of a proc and im not sure if that's even important - when you're doing a rotation you aren't gonna wait for a proc to tick, it just doesn't make much sense.

When there's a cooldown on stances it forces you to plan ahead and makes mistakes more punishing, thus requiring better skill from the player

But to re-iterate - im not against any of such changes, im just thinking that current mara stance mechanic is generally bad and needs a redesign
Orkni
Image

nat3s
Posts: 211

Re: [Marauder change] patch notes discussion (28/03/20)

Post#104 » Thu Apr 02, 2020 7:34 am

I have 2 main issues with the Mara design on RoR:

1. The stance dancing makes for a higher skillcap class. Bit like feral druids around 2010 in WoW (stay with me here - you dont need to know about old WoW expansions). The big diff between the 2 is design philosophy... in WoW feral was rewarded with the highest dps for its high skill cap. Average players did average dps, exceptionally players did exceptionally dps. In RoR, the Mara does **** dps for its high skill cap which makes for a clunky and unpopular class imo. Why roll a mara when you can go aSW, WL, Slayer and shred people far easier... The answer there of course was maras provided a key role in their morale drain, or did until these changes.

2. People misunderstand how PSM works, the dmg buffs are fairly insigificant and Maras damage is pretty mediocre when compared to other classes, WL, aSW, Slayer all burst far harder. Mara can do some nice fluff dmg in WB play, capable of being near the top on dmg done in a city siege, but with 3-4 DBs compared to BWs 25-50. These changes mean Order continues to have the more favorable mirror match ups, but destro has now lost their morale advantage, which for organised WB play will allow Order to dominate going forward.

When you consider Order are already dominating in terms of rvr zone locks, altdorf vs IC sieges and t2-4 scenario play, it seems odd to nerf destros WB morale play. Really not seeing the incentive to roll anything but Order right now... And that's a problem with their current overpop.

User avatar
Likeaboss
Posts: 111

Re: [Marauder change] patch notes discussion (28/03/20)

Post#105 » Thu Apr 02, 2020 9:00 am

nat3s wrote:
Thu Apr 02, 2020 7:34 am
Spoiler:
I have 2 main issues with the Mara design on RoR:

1. The stance dancing makes for a higher skillcap class. Bit like feral druids around 2010 in WoW (stay with me here - you dont need to know about old WoW expansions). The big diff between the 2 is design philosophy... in WoW feral was rewarded with the highest dps for its high skill cap. Average players did average dps, exceptionally players did exceptionally dps. In RoR, the Mara does **** dps for its high skill cap which makes for a clunky and unpopular class imo. Why roll a mara when you can go aSW, WL, Slayer and shred people far easier... The answer there of course was maras provided a key role in their morale drain, or did until these changes.

2. People misunderstand how PSM works, the dmg buffs are fairly insigificant and Maras damage is pretty mediocre when compared to other classes, WL, aSW, Slayer all burst far harder. Mara can do some nice fluff dmg in WB play, capable of being near the top on dmg done in a city siege, but with 3-4 DBs compared to BWs 25-50. These changes mean Order continues to have the more favorable mirror match ups, but destro has now lost their morale advantage, which for organised WB play will allow Order to dominate going forward.

When you consider Order are already dominating in terms of rvr zone locks, altdorf vs IC sieges and t2-4 scenario play, it seems odd to nerf destros WB morale play. Really not seeing the incentive to roll anything but Order right now... And that's a problem with their current overpop.
You should play both realms, then we would not have to read a Order is better than Destro Post,
full of wrong arguments and tears. :P
Order Overpop? which Timezone you play in? NA? cuz EU its different everyday.

Jastojan
Posts: 102

Re: [Marauder change] patch notes discussion (28/03/20)

Post#106 » Thu Apr 02, 2020 10:02 am

nat3s wrote:
Thu Apr 02, 2020 7:34 am
I have 2 main issues with the Mara design on RoR:

1. The stance dancing makes for a higher skillcap class. Bit like feral druids around 2010 in WoW (stay with me here - you dont need to know about old WoW expansions). The big diff between the 2 is design philosophy... in WoW feral was rewarded with the highest dps for its high skill cap. Average players did average dps, exceptionally players did exceptionally dps. In RoR, the Mara does **** dps for its high skill cap which makes for a clunky and unpopular class imo. Why roll a mara when you can go aSW, WL, Slayer and shred people far easier... The answer there of course was maras provided a key role in their morale drain, or did until these changes.

2. People misunderstand how PSM works, the dmg buffs are fairly insigificant and Maras damage is pretty mediocre when compared to other classes, WL, aSW, Slayer all burst far harder. Mara can do some nice fluff dmg in WB play, capable of being near the top on dmg done in a city siege, but with 3-4 DBs compared to BWs 25-50. These changes mean Order continues to have the more favorable mirror match ups, but destro has now lost their morale advantage, which for organised WB play will allow Order to dominate going forward.
I agree with the stance dancing. It is not very rewarding to switch stances and you realy have to calculate if it is necessary to switch. The example of feral druid is realy good example here. Same as warrior in WOW which was my main char for years. You hardly could be a good pvp war without stance dancing (defensive stance with spell reflect especially). Switching stances as mara... I find it more punishing as rewarding sometimes and this mechanic here in RoR looks not very refined. What about to make stance bonuses last for aditional 5 sec. after stance switch? For example if I switch from savagery to monstro I will have a gift of savagery for 5 sec even in monstro and vice versa. For these 5 seconds I won't lose my monstro gift. Additionally I could have 2 gifts for these 5 seconds during the CD for switching stances. It could bring new possibilities for gameplay and more joy to make stance dancing instead of prevent it. Why not? This mechanic has a potential and I think it will be small (not very hard to implement maybe) but very beneficial change when it comes to new gameplay possibilities.

Edit: or reduce the CD to 1 or 2 sec. As someone mentioned later.
Last edited by Jastojan on Thu Apr 02, 2020 11:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

Fanaticseb
Posts: 3

Re: [Marauder change] patch notes discussion (28/03/20)

Post#107 » Thu Apr 02, 2020 11:15 am

Grock wrote:
Wed Apr 01, 2020 1:41 pm
I'm not sure if you understood my point correctly.
Removing CD from stance switching will make it so you could switch stance at any time you need it, and the only thing you'd lose is a few seconds of a proc and im not sure if that's even important - when you're doing a rotation you aren't gonna wait for a proc to tick, it just doesn't make much sense.

When there's a cooldown on stances it forces you to plan ahead and makes mistakes more punishing, thus requiring better skill from the player

But to re-iterate - im not against any of such changes, im just thinking that current mara stance mechanic is generally bad and needs a redesign
I grant you that it is currently not viable to play on the procs, because they disappear after stance switch. But if they are kind of lingering, like it was suggested before, then it would make sense to play around them.

I dont quite see the "plan ahead" = skill part. For me its just punishment after a wrong decision ex. target at 30% -> switch brut -> guillotine; now you are stuck in brutality for another 3 gcds.

I just think 5 secs is too punishing and i would prefer like a 1 or 2 sec cd instead.

User avatar
Likeaboss
Posts: 111

Re: [Marauder change] patch notes discussion (28/03/20)

Post#108 » Thu Apr 02, 2020 11:26 am

Fanaticseb wrote:
Thu Apr 02, 2020 11:15 am
ex. target at 30% -> switch brut -> guillotine; now you are stuck in brutality for another 3 gcds.
Tipps for that 3 gcds when you are "stuck" in Brut:
-Pulverize
-Thunderous Blow
-Impale
-Corruption
-Snare

You are not stuck in the stance man... Use it's utility..

Just to find out if you really that harmed with that stance dance, or you just want your class buffed..
When you'd like a patch on that. Would you suggest to grant the SW the same? because he has the same Mechanic,
3 stances and 5s cooldown on the switch..

Ads
Dajciekrwi
Posts: 564

Re: [Marauder change] patch notes discussion (28/03/20)

Post#109 » Thu Apr 02, 2020 12:11 pm

i simply just cant stand the bullshit of pen&paper theorists about marauders in brute.
One proper style of brute marauder is:
1) you MUST waiting till Order ranks is broken,
2) you MUST find Order below 50% of health,
3) use charge, absorb potion, Convulsive Slashing, Debilitate, and on 1% enemies health- GUILLOTINE!
4) use Flee to back line of destro,
5) wait 10 second and repeat.
ofc You can use these "utilities" and die in every battle , You choose

Jastojan
Posts: 102

Re: [Marauder change] patch notes discussion (28/03/20)

Post#110 » Thu Apr 02, 2020 12:19 pm

Dajciekrwi wrote:
Thu Apr 02, 2020 12:11 pm
i simply just cant stand the bullshit of pen&paper theorists about marauders in brute.
One proper style of brute marauder is:
1) you MUST waiting till Order ranks is broken,
2) you MUST find Order below 50% of health,
3) use charge, absorb potion, Convulsive Slashing, Debilitate, and on 1% enemies health- GUILLOTINE!
4) use Flee to back line of destro,
5) wait 10 second and repeat.
ofc You can use these "utilities" and die in every battle , You choose
It is the same like dps zealot (single target especially). It looks nice on the paper, but in fight... nah.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests