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Ironbreaker, Engineer, Slayer, Runepriest
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szejoza
Posts: 748

slayer stuff

Post#1 » Mon Nov 20, 2017 2:07 pm

stuff won't be here as this server is shitfest
Last edited by szejoza on Tue Sep 11, 2018 4:22 pm, edited 7 times in total.
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Fallenkezef
Posts: 1483

Re: [Slayer]Seeking Doom - The Guide

Post#2 » Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:26 am

Wow, thanks! Found this very useful
Alea iacta est

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Crenshaw
Posts: 123

Re: [Slayer]Seeking Doom - The Guide

Post#3 » Wed Nov 22, 2017 8:30 am

I wonder why there's so little traffic in this topic. Refreshing to see something so we'll written with plenty of solid information. Well done :)

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szejoza
Posts: 748

Re: [Slayer]Seeking Doom - The Guide

Post#4 » Wed Nov 22, 2017 8:40 am

I still need to cover info about stats tho, forgot about this little important part ^^
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Skalier
Banned
Posts: 100

Re: [Slayer]Seeking Doom - The Guide

Post#5 » Wed Nov 22, 2017 8:40 am

If I can suggest you something, do what I did. Remove your Slayer and make Iron Breaker.

Maybe someday Torquemadra cheange Slayer a bit... like she did with White Lion. Who know.
She needs only inspiration or a wind in the sails.

Till this time give up.
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szejoza
Posts: 748

Re: [Slayer]Seeking Doom - The Guide

Post#6 » Wed Nov 22, 2017 8:45 am

Make a proposal here viewforum.php?f=78 if you think slayer is in bad position, just because you can't play it doesn't mean it's bad

I play in organised warbands, pug warbands, solo roaming, sc's and sometimes 6 man and I've never felt like slayer was underperforming (the class mechanic is unforgiving and takes a while to get used to but it's also rewarding as hell)
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Kereloth
Posts: 4

Re: [Slayer]Seeking Doom - The Guide

Post#7 » Wed Nov 22, 2017 9:31 am

Great job Sheykis.
While i read this guide i have noticed two thinghs that might be incorrect.
1) Tactic - Fierce Might Givenchy u extra crit DMG note chance.
2) Morales 1: Like U said Confusing Movements gives 100% chance to parry or dodge attacks, for 7s.
Untouchable increace youre chance to defender allegro attacks BY not TO 100%. Do if you have 30% chance to parry, you'll have 60% for 5s.

That's 2 cents from me. I might be wrong cuz i didnt test it on RoR server. All i said comes from live server expirience.
Kereloth - Slayer RR83

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szejoza
Posts: 748

Re: [Slayer]Seeking Doom - The Guide

Post#8 » Wed Nov 22, 2017 9:36 am

Right, missed that with that wall of text ;)
Thanks for reminding me, will do the test for M1 when I'm back from work, as for Fierce Might it confused me cause of the error that is associated with using this tactic (sometimes when you die with that tactic slotted you get system message that your chance to crit is suspiciously high) so will check that too
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Toadwart
Posts: 17

Re: [Slayer]Seeking Doom - The Guide

Post#9 » Thu Nov 23, 2017 12:47 am

Also most of the Exhaustive skills get 75% damage bonus when used while Furious and only 50% increase when Berserk.

You mention this throughout the guide like its a bad thing, it isnt. The damage is exactly the same in both states:
Furious (+25%) +75% exhaustive skill =100% damage
Berserk (+50%) +50% exhaustive skill =100% damage

Also your damage will be a bit lower on the regular skills but your exhaustive attacks will be stronger.

As explained above, that just isnt true. While the difference between 2 hand and dual wield does boil down to damage, it is that a 2 hand slayer will do significantly more single target damage than a dual wield slayer can ever hope to, largely due to their skills hitting for larger damage hits (base damage of skills being higher + Base dmage of weapon being higher + 15% crit tactic) and bypassing a larger chunk of the targets toughness reduction. Dual wield slayers will obviously do more AoE damage however. there are no AoE armor debuffs. So while their AoE is great, a large portion of the damage is reduced because you cant debuff 3,5,9 targets armor at the same time and they hit for smaller amounts which is more greatly affected by the opponents toughness.

Slayer "group buffs" are complete garbage and really are not even worth putting on your bar with the exception of Gudrun's Warcry. The toughness buff is at best 150 toughness for 10s and takes a global CD. To get that number you would need 6 ppl all within 20ft and you may get 20-30 pts of damage reduction from it..for 10s. The weapon skill buff again only lasts 10s on a 1 min cd, and maxes out at a whopping 77 WS while increasing your chance to be crit anywhere from 3% to 50+% depending on if you run base initiative or if you stack it. Remember that self initiative debuff also stacks with witch elf/squig initiative debuffs and conqueror procs.

All of the slayer group buffs need reworked from the ground up. As is, the slayer brings nothing unique to a group except physical melee damage the AP reduction buff. While needing full time guard, full time armor debuff (to even function) and a capable healer.

Make a proposal here viewforum.php?f=78 if you think slayer is in bad position, just because you can't play it doesn't mean it's bad

It is bad. One example:

Spine Crusher (back positional, 216 base damage, no cd) [slayer]
Torment (back positional, 177 base damage, no cd, ignores all armor when used from behind) [witch hunter]

**just using base numbers from waronline.org character builder and not factoring stats, ect that are variable but can be the same on both classes.

Spine Crusher in slayer normal state will do 216-40% (even light armor class will have this mitigation minimum) 130 damage.
Spine Crusher in furious state will do (216+25%)-40% ( ) 162 damage
Spine Crusher in berzerk state will do (216+50%)-40% ( ) 194 damage

As you can see, the only time spine crusher even barely outdamages torment is when the slayer is taking 50% more damage from all sources. That cannot be downplayed, a class that takes 50% more damage for barely more damage output.

Those numbers only get worse for the slayer as you compare medium and heavy armor mitigations, to the point where the slayer does far less damage yet still takes 50% more damage.

There are more examples of this throughout the slayer and its mirror choppa but those two skills are both from mdps classes and are practically the same for comparison purposes.

Is the class playable, absolutely, but dont belittle the guy that said you are better off playing an Ironbreaker instead of a slayer if you want to dps, the slayer class is flawed.

Witch Hunter, Witch Elf, White Lion And Marauder (all mdps) all either ignore or debuff their damage type with the games very best armor debuffs and none of them take 50% extra damage in the process.

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Ridduk
Posts: 333

Re: [Slayer]Seeking Doom - The Guide

Post#10 » Thu Nov 23, 2017 2:53 am

Is Slayer different here than it was on live?

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