Recent Topics

Ads

[Slayer] Guide - How to take lickin' and keep on skippin'

Ironbreaker, Engineer, Slayer, Runepriest
Forum rules
Before posting on this forum, be sure to read the Terms of Use
Your topic MUST start with your class name between hooks (IE : [Shaman] blablabla)
richard1032
Posts: 42

Re: [Slayer] Guide - How to take lickin' and keep on skippin'

Post#11 » Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:56 am

With that setup i suspect you have low initiative. Combine that with no futile strikes and 1 initiative debuff and you are toast. A dead slayer does 0 damage.

Death isn't inevitable in a good group. Get some good gear, initiative at least 250, futile strikes at least 2, dump your rage at the right times, use your snare effectively and your survive ability is good. I died twice over 15+ sc's tonight.

Littlebomber
Fandanfinlyman

Ads
Elio
Posts: 51

Re: [Slayer] Guide - How to take lickin' and keep on skippin'

Post#12 » Fri Mar 09, 2018 4:15 am

Hella low initiative, yes. I do need to add a gear progression bit, and that may help cover some bases because I theorycrafted with my available gear and not with ideal gear. Currently, I'm looking swapping some pieces to drop +AA haste and Crit for crit reduction as well as dropping some Parry for FS. Giving me, on paperdoll, a total of ~3% chance to be crit while still stacking exclusively WS talis.
Elio wrote:Also, a quick note, this is how I optimize my slayer for jovial guild pre-made groups, solo scenarios, and in RvR. I don’t run in a serious six-man group, and it’s fully possible that this whole guide is moot in that regard.
But... as I stated early in this guide this is targeted at new/struggling slayers. Most people playing don't have the luxury of playing with a solid 6-man group. You are right though, the biggest thing you can do is learn when to push, how to position, and correct rage management, and that is something that'll be added to the guide in the near future.

User avatar
tionblack
Posts: 302

Re: [Slayer] Guide - How to take lickin' and keep on skippin'

Post#13 » Fri Mar 09, 2018 4:43 am

I would not suggest anyone to use this build or you will make your healers and tanks go mental :D
No Futile Strikes ?
Full wep skill from renown??
STR talismans in gear??
Wrong,wrong wrong,

1)Get your chance to be critted below 10(get it to 0)Beleive me you dont want to be critted in red zone.
2)get base initiative around 230
3)Use weapon skill talismans
4)Combine sets for strenght
5)Drop riposte for group play
6)you dont need that much parry from renown in group unless your % 100 sure your against Legion of BOOM meele premade i would not max it.
Image

kill Droll you Kill this Server. DROLL is Community :wink:

Elio
Posts: 51

Re: [Slayer] Guide - How to take lickin' and keep on skippin'

Post#14 » Fri Mar 09, 2018 8:58 am

Aye, nothing like making a guide to have a vast ocean of knowledge be thrust upon you! I was 100% wrong about the STR talis - depending on what potion/liniment/group composition you can have some play with STR. WS talis are the way to go.

I'm testing running FS with lower parry now, but I stand by WS from renown. The damage increase from the extra weapon skill is noticeable when comparing average dmg done between builds.

I'll update the guide to reflect a more offensive and defensive renown setup. Thanks for the input.

Dinotron
Posts: 38

Re: [Slayer] Guide - How to take lickin' and keep on skippin'

Post#15 » Fri Mar 09, 2018 7:12 pm

I posted a comment on your YouTube video, but I figure you'll see it here better:

What addons are you using for WB frames and also self/target frames? It looks very clean!

User avatar
Fallenkezef
Posts: 1483

Re: [Slayer] Guide - How to take lickin' and keep on skippin'

Post#16 » Fri Mar 09, 2018 8:11 pm

Parry is useless if the rdps nuke you. I maxed out dodge/disrupt and parry with rebown when I mained a slayer.

Tbh using renown for hard stats is not an advisable option.

I ran merc for damage with the defensive genesis set which was a good tradeoff. Even running a 2h build I got good parry scores just relying on the parry renown and WS talis with enough dodge/disrupt to make into melee range of rdps.
Alea iacta est

Elio
Posts: 51

Re: [Slayer] Guide - How to take lickin' and keep on skippin'

Post#17 » Sat Mar 10, 2018 3:58 am

@Dinotron I'm using Enemy for group/warband and Pure for my unit frames.

User avatar
Toshutkidup
Posts: 726
Contact:

Re: [Slayer] Guide - How to take lickin' and keep on skippin'

Post#18 » Sun Mar 11, 2018 1:59 am

I liked the guide overall. I didn't build my slayer exactly like this, however some things are similar. I wont break anything down and say its wrong. I also did a build for my Slayer with STR talis.. I have MAYBE 1-2 22+ WS talis however I believe currently its all 22/23+ STR
First RR90 Slayer working towards the top of the mountain.I still solo, still run riposte.

Twitch:https://www.twitch.tv/toshutkidup
My Youtube http://www.youtube.com/c/Toshutkidup

Ads
User avatar
Darosh
Banned
Posts: 1197

Re: [Slayer] Guide - How to take lickin' and keep on skippin'

Post#19 » Sun Mar 11, 2018 6:12 am

Elio wrote:Curious what you see as a red flag with the guide? It's still in its infancy, working on images for UI/Button layout, but it isn't meant to be a total fluff piece. Tone aside.
The most glaring ones were your neglicence of initiative/crit reduction, use of riposte (which is probably the least potent tactic you can run outside of solo roam, and even there its meh), the glass approach in combination with pugging, the usage of SCs numbers as metrics, the usage of RR for plain stats, neglicene of avoidance, alongside a few more things ~ but lets put that aside, as you are actively working* on the guide.

I suggest you swap out some of gear for dominator (setboni: str, wounds, armor + crit reduction [boots], ini for free on most pieces - e.g.: swapping conq chest for domi chest) and/or if you can some pieces of redeye (6% critreduction for free; 3% boots, 3% setboni - the cloak is a perfect piece to mix-and-match with for the setboni).
The crit on conq boots does nothing for you if you run a setup without crit, the WS/ini on the inf belt is hardly worth the tradeoff in setboni/melee power (whatever you choose to opt for, domi/conq).
More than 50% armor pen through WS is completly overkill, might aswell push your initiative to combat debuffs and to allow you to actively run Fierceness to buff the WS for your entire party instead.
You should always have Winds Impervious tome accessories in your bag to swap on the fly, alongside a bunch of tactic sets (e.g.: Shoutness of the Stone is pure gold against good WEs/BGs).
There is plenty of ways to min-max a Slayer ~ you don't necessarily need BiS gear either, but I'd HIGHLY suggest you plan ahead, some pieces will turn out to be a waste of currency and time.
On one hand you have unnecessary stats in your setup, on the other hand you completly neglect important ones... I can see this setup work out 'just fine' against headless chicken that don't know how to assist or CC, but meh.

Fyi, if you plan on running a haste setup, its either all in or bust...(Redeye setboni + oathstones + conq shoulders//oathstones + conq shoulders + overlord head, PFM +++++++++++ a group, as you'll want to run rather glassy), you'd just gimp yourself running bits and pieces.
(Note: If you pug/play with meh groups and/or against good opposition PFM is basically useless, as you won't stick in red to make the haste payoff properly; a halfarsed haste setup might work ... you could in theory get [close] to 50% haste just through gear, but I don't see that tradeoff pay off statwise on the long run - a full haste setup on the other hand is as pewpew-ish as you can get, especially if you can run full glass with it.)

As to what you most certainly do not want to do if you ever get to play with a fix group that runs a good KotBS/engi:
Use ID on cooldown... you'll break every single stagger (and your own detaunt), if not only because your targets know how to use it to their own advantage; to break staggers (or to get you instagibbed by nearby guards) ~ if you have momentum, keep up the pressure, if you don't save the AP and allow yourself to use detaunt, don't mindlessly hit random buttons and don't waste your AP on moral'd/guarded/detaunting targets either, especially if you aren't AP fed properly.
You'll just massively increase your downtime by hammering your abilities 24/7 ~ unless you use some of the AP tactics (which you shouldn't), AP pots, AP regen from gear (which you shouldn't rely on) or are AP fed: rather have the AP necessary to properly burst than hitting your target every 2ish seconds (all the things worth using cost >=30AP without GW, your base regen is 25AP - you'll cockblock yourself out of the GCD cycle or race the GCD cycle of your target's healers with rather lackluster spikes/waste or miss burst opportunities if you mindlessly hammer away).
I.e: 1 attack every 2sec, versus x attacks in a row - keep in mind avoidance checks, sitting at <30 AP 24/7 severely gimps your dps and nullifies your pressure.
Mind you, if you were to run a full haste setup - which you shouldn't without a (proper) group - managing AP:Burst would be a cakewalk, but so would be everything by virtue of the group.

As a rule of thumb: Slayer as a class is meant to be weight to be carried = there is no point going to glassy in a group that has newly been formed or forms irregularly, let alone whilst pugging... a slayer is either dead weight (too squishy for the group to handle) or a god (exactly as squishy as the group can handle), a good balanced slayer is a proper (= your 'casual') mdps (= still almost entirely useless without guard), a deftard slayer is basicially CC on two legs and a good, albeit twisted tank (as far as pugplay is concerned) ~ you'll draw attention and work as dps sponge whilst scaring off squishies (especially glass ones, but others will just see a midget and run regardless of its actual dps, which isn't necessarily lackluster... but lacking), provided you have a good healer and pots with you.

Abbd.:
Additional rule of thumb for all things pug and in general:
1. If you notice that no one assist you, assist off of others - unless you know your targets, i.e.: you know that you can burst someone down before you draw attention to you; be ready to hardswap on the fly (get SwiftAssist or similar addons).
2. Don't use SL on <3 targets, don't use it without Onslaught/No Escape to mask it, don't tunnelvision your target from the get go ~ try to get SL off onto the backline, then get back to your target.
3. SL kills pressure (and HtL, it should atleast unless smth changed), use it defensively if you can/have to.
4. Use NC on guardbots, it'll melt them or force them and their guardee to back the **** off ~ don't waste it on mdps unless you are in a straight up 1vX... which you should never find yourself in.
5. Don't use Charge to engage.
6. Use Flurry to bridge distances, it after all has a 25ft range.
7. No Escape, Flee, Rampage are excellent ragedrops; don't use your detaunt before you dropped your rage, ragedrops are your main priority if you wanna survive a burst. Ragedrop (preferably No Escape) > Pots (> Detaunt, provided there is no ID ticking or you memorized the ticks) > Charge > else.
8. Don't ever use Relentless Strike unless you run PURE glass, max crit stack and FM whilst in a min-max'd group. Its a garbage ability on its own and a waste of AP.
9. Help your allies; use your snare if you see mdps/tanks running towards your backline; use EB to kill the burst of dps (Sorc >= SH > WE > CH > Mara, ofc depending on range) or burst heals.

One more thing:
If you really like playing with specs and such... try a wounds/crit stack (or at the very best ASW, yumyum) with FM for the luls, and maybe 2h if you fancy it ~ make sure to grind enough gold to bribe your mates to carry you with that spec (especially the healers will have a hard time with you, as they'll have to let you drop and sit at HP% that isn't quite fun to see/easy to maintain as a healer), tho.



(*Note: My biggest gripe with the guide was that it lacked a proper disclaimer 'ATTENTION: This class is horrible to play without group.' that you now more or less included. I've seen too many people burn themselves out trying to play this class lonewolfish and basing their enjoyment on the coin toss that is PUG SCs and blobvR. Now, spare me the 'it can work in soloroam and w/e', yes, but it needs BiS gear and a proper pot economy, which new players simply won't have at their disposal, its a moot point ~ and even if the stars align, its still a niche and very dependent on timezones... can't roam if every zone has a bajillion individual blobs.)

E: Format, words ~

User avatar
shaggyboomboom
Posts: 1230

Re: [Slayer] Guide - How to take lickin' and keep on skippin'

Post#20 » Sun Mar 11, 2018 12:02 pm

Darosh should make a main guide and this one should be deleted. New players will take this for actual truth and the quality of game play, which is already very low, will be even lower. Cheers
Image

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests