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[IB] Masochistic class?

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Koha
Posts: 178

Re: [IB] Masochistic class?

Post#31 » Tue Aug 10, 2021 9:44 pm

wargrimnir wrote: Fri May 21, 2021 4:08 pm This is something we have on the list, not for IB specifically, but about the overall efficacy of Group/ST buffs.
This is the only real issue : the consistency of ST buffs for tanks. Not an easy one to solve.
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Kpi
Posts: 517

Re: [IB] Masochistic class?

Post#32 » Tue Aug 10, 2021 9:49 pm

I will be very happy if the IB take a punt similar to the BG
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Fey
Posts: 768

Re: [IB] Masochistic class?

Post#33 » Wed Aug 11, 2021 12:03 am

I like to use guarded attack as a cover blessing for more important buffs like Oathbound, and Ancestor's Fury. Stubborn as Stone is another good cover blessing. I don't know how many sever blessings are being thrown out, but it's a good habit imo.
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ashton007
Posts: 380

Re: [IB] Masochistic class?

Post#34 » Thu Aug 12, 2021 6:24 pm

Koha wrote: Tue Aug 10, 2021 8:51 pm Life is made of choices. IB and BG have plenty, and that's great. Just don't put all your abilities in one sequencer.

SM/BO have to make choices at each stance change...

Some skills are not to be used at all : armor buff that does not stack with pots (most tanks, WP and DoK armor prayers...), others are situational. (for saving pots in pve it's ok).

Still IB has a good place : the funnier tank to play on order, perfect balance of dmg and utility, compared to SM and Kotbs that are too much damage or utility oriented.

Grudge HAS to be harder to build => IB earns heavy damage from it and don't spend as much grudge compared to BG (for keeping up the crit tactic for example) + overall less abilities are using grudge.

IB is meant to build and keep grudge high to do damage (it's like getting a train running, long to start but hard to stop), spending grudge is mostly defensive on IB not offensive.

BG needs to produce and spend hate all the time to do the same job and works at the opposite : keep hate high too improve defense not offensive and spend hate to improve offense.

I'm not saying it's harder nor easier just different and should not be mirrored or things shouldbe mirrored both ways and we will end with only one class.
You realize a tanks job even with a 2h is protection first right?? So all a BG has to do to keep its max defenses is stop spending(which it’s already better at building hate), a IB cannot stop spending for defensives... the BG is better at both with 2h AND it doesn’t have to do the awkward/bad TRI-spec.

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kmark101
Posts: 482

Re: [IB] Masochistic class?

Post#35 » Thu Aug 12, 2021 7:00 pm

Whoever compares the IB and BG has very little experience and knowledge of the game. The two classes are mirrors on paper, but in reality the BG is the "modern" version of the IB, with its mechanics and skills seem like a "better version" of what the IB can provide. It has a historical reason, which is simple: IB was the first class that Mythic designed in the game and BG was one of the last, with all the experience and feedback they got from the IB's implementation, hence they could tweak and make a "modern" IB of the BG. It shows at every spec and every skill level.

The other problem, as some of you mentoined the 2h tank damage department and IB has a massive issue here: physical only damage type and no armor bypass skill, only a 10s duration WS buff. All those once-hard-hitting-skills like Heavy Blow that you like to stare at Volgo's videos were strong at conq gear level, but now at sov gear level their damage is pretty low. Most of the times you can't even debuff a dok or marauder under the armor cap, unless you use your morale 1 ability... no other class in the game has to use their morale ability just to do basic damage...

The third major issue is the existence of armor potions, but this has a massive effect on the whole Order side, not only the IB. WP armor prayers, IB single target armor buffs, etc.. all useless with the existence of armor potions, where destro freely receives the same extra armor treatment as order, while their classes do more magical damage than order... not hard to see how this causes issues with balance in a setup where order is the more physical damage dealer faction and destro is the more magical/debuff stacking faction... (and on top of that, until very recently BG was the only class who's armor buff was stacked on top of potions... right!).
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Bozzax
Posts: 2477

Re: [IB] Masochistic class?

Post#36 » Thu Aug 12, 2021 7:50 pm

Yet +25% parry for a friend is the best def buff in game after guard

+ Excellent CC

( grom plate M3 imo should be reverted to a grp buff provided BG get an equal worth grp 60s CD buff)

/end thread
A reasonable RvR system that could make the majority happy http://imgur.com/HL6cgl7

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kmark101
Posts: 482

Re: [IB] Masochistic class?

Post#37 » Fri Aug 13, 2021 1:31 am

Bozzax wrote: Thu Aug 12, 2021 7:50 pm Yet +25% parry for a friend is the best def buff in game after guard
Not sure why you think that. Your friend is usually blasted up by sorcs and maguses and the initiative part of it is more useful than the parry %... The parry buff is great for yourself to mitigate more guard damage, it is awesome indeed. However, it is nothing compared to what BG's and Chosens get in the parry department...
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Bozzax
Posts: 2477

Re: [IB] Masochistic class?

Post#38 » Fri Aug 13, 2021 8:01 am

Tell your friends to use clns, again +25% on your buddy is second only to guard
A reasonable RvR system that could make the majority happy http://imgur.com/HL6cgl7

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ashton007
Posts: 380

Re: [IB] Masochistic class?

Post#39 » Fri Aug 13, 2021 2:52 pm

Bozzax wrote: Thu Aug 12, 2021 7:50 pm Yet +25% parry for a friend is the best def buff in game after guard

+ Excellent CC

( grom plate M3 imo should be reverted to a grp buff provided BG get an equal worth grp 60s CD buff)

/end thread
Black guard can buff parry too if it builds for that... not our fault tri spec is the only good 2h build honestly. But again what do buffs/debuff a have to do with grudge/hate... The IB needs to spend grudge to keep its defensives up, it should be slightly better at pumping grudges... to do it’s main function. BG already has the best AoE of any tank in game.

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NSKaneda
Posts: 968

Re: [IB] Masochistic class?

Post#40 » Fri Aug 13, 2021 3:08 pm

Oathfriend anyone getting hit - insta grudges.

Rising anger if you roam solo.
Long reach in warband / parties.

Manage rotations right and you'll never go below 85grudges in a fight.
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