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[Knight] With recent round of nerfs, is it time to go 2h spec?

Knight of the Blazing Sun, Bright Wizard, Witch Hunter, Warrior Priest
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Serbiansword
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Re: [Knight] With recent round of nerfs, is it time to go 2h spec?

Post#11 » Fri Dec 23, 2016 10:53 pm

Gerv wrote:
Serbiansword wrote:Shield vs 2h as a tank:

1. Shield gives you additional stats and additional sockets
2. Shield gives you better block and parry %, helps you with dirty tricks
3. Shield gives you access to gilded shield tactics, +15% to disrupt
4. Hold the line

Now, as a tank, I think that all these things that I've numbered are better than higher damage and arcing swing that 2h provides you with. You simply can't tank properly without the shield.
You can effectively tank with a 2hd and there are some good abilities to get as well.
1. 2hd, as Zabis said has 2 slots and gives more offensive stats.
2. There is also Encouraged Aim (+10% chance to be crit) however you do loose out on the 5% heal crit.
3. No offense but very few tanks would take this tactic over others you normally take.
4. Great for the group, but investing renown points into dodge and disrupt also give the same effect.

But the big point, as Dabbart and I have pointed out is it's all situational and group dependent.
Well, I don't know, when playing as a tank, pugging or premade, I am personally always group-oriented, but ofc that is my own choice and we all have our different playstyles.

Now, as far as gilded shield is concerned... With it and with some renown investment you can get your disrupt around 40%. I don't know if that's enough or if it's an overkill, but at the moment I'm testing that build and I'm quite satisfied with it.
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Gerv
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Re: [Knight] With recent round of nerfs, is it time to go 2h spec?

Post#12 » Sat Dec 24, 2016 12:10 am

It all depends on play-style and personality, but I think using the following tactics is about as good as its gets for group: Focused mending, DT, super punt and sliced through. There is no room, in my opinion, for anything else.

You could sub out focused mending for something else, depending on damage being taken by your grp and the competency of your healers, maybe RF.
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Stmichael1989
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Re: [Knight] With recent round of nerfs, is it time to go 2h spec?

Post#13 » Sat Dec 24, 2016 10:00 am

Here's the advantages I can think of for each side so far:

Shield - DT for 5% heal crit over Encouraged Aim, HTL for some personal survivability and 15% dodge/disrupt for anyone behind you, 20%ish block for more personal survivability.

2h - Encouraged Aim for 5% offensive crit at the cost of 5% heal crit, Arcing Swing for Order's only wounds debuff, added damage for whatever the use might be (killing a WE who is killing your buddy is more effective than snaring her and tickling her with a 1h.)

Honestly, the only group utility you gain from a shield is HTL, and for that you get Arcing Swing, which helps your DPS out immensely.
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Dabbart
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Re: [Knight] With recent round of nerfs, is it time to go 2h spec?

Post#14 » Sat Dec 24, 2016 11:53 am

Personal survivability=Better Guard. Better Guard=better group utility. Imo, if you have a 2 knight grp, then having 1 as 2h is fine. Otherwise, the 2h knight is doing so because they prefer the spec for personal reasons. The actual argument about Group benefits is pretty solidly in the Shield camp imo.

I ran Slice through, DT, Coordination, and Super Punt on my knight, swapping into Focused Mending depending. But I was always slayer/WL guard bot duty, or pushing backlines for Interrupts. As I said earlier. If your style or tactics differ then your build probably will too.

Just don't get stuck in a build. Try some other stuff out. And I highly suggest setting up a few Tactic sets so you can switch for SCs depending on group/enemy and ORvR.
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vladivoj
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Re: [Knight] With recent round of nerfs, is it time to go 2h spec?

Post#15 » Sat Dec 24, 2016 2:48 pm

I think 2h kobs is better now after Dirty Tricks nerf. Wounds debuff and 10% crit works better for me.
When thinking about build for kobs you have to realize that you really cant take everything to be effective, so you can also drop Focused Mending. Best way to go is slotting Slice Through, Runefang, Encouraged Aim and Banish Darkness. With remaining points spec KD + Vigiliance. Having Vigilance with Runefang will actually make you more tanky than SnB kobs, who have to take Dirty Tricky + Focused Mending to be effective. In my opinion: 2h kobs brings strong offensive debuffs and seems better for 6man, SnB kobs brings only decent defensive support, but seems mandatory for large scale.
My experience is based on playing kobs only in premade past last 8 months on this server. We always use RP so thats why i think Focused Mending isnt so important. If you are only pugging than some build with Focused Mending might work better.

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Eathisword
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Re: [Knight] With recent round of nerfs, is it time to go 2h spec?

Post#16 » Sat Dec 24, 2016 7:23 pm

I'm with Vladivoj.
Unless you plan on tanking WarBands, 2H is pretty great. I am no knight here (was on live) but 2H IB is similar, and with vigilance, Runefang, M1 and M2 defensive, you can be pretty tanky and help the measly poor dps you sometimes get with you in scenario.

Also, to point out, with 2 decent healers, you can tank 6-8 dps in a scen as 2H for a decently long time, even 2 premade.

2H greatly suffer when you enter the kiting range of open RvR large groups (fighting 6v12+), as Gerv said. Mostly because you are more easily CCed than SnB tank, because you must use your renown point for parry and deft defender, otherwise you become too squish. Whereas SnB tank can get Resolute defense and Cleansing Wind to avoid more CC.
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Telen
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Re: [Knight] With recent round of nerfs, is it time to go 2h spec?

Post#17 » Sat Dec 24, 2016 7:38 pm

With offensive stats not counting against spec defences 2h tanks are far more survivable than on live. Targeting 2h tanks on live was very effective and better in many cases than to target guarded dps. Here unless you want to hold a bo long after your group wiped you might aswell go 2h and spec avoidance as theres nothing dps can do about it. Thats why melee trains are so dominant in scs here.
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Tankbeardz
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Re: [Knight] With recent round of nerfs, is it time to go 2h spec?

Post#18 » Sat Dec 24, 2016 11:41 pm

Dabbart wrote:2 tali slots, but you can't stack the same tali twice. And double stats is the exact same as receiving 50% from sword and 50% from shield no? Other than DPS obviously...

Comes down to play-style, and the type of group you are in. Personally, I would never run a Tank w/o a shield. You are the only archetype that can use them, and Block/Parry combo is FAR superior to just parry. Not to mention, taking Shield Rush Tactic boosts your parry by 15% and block by 10%, or the overall benefits from HTL. But again, it comes down to play-style. I might of played my Knight different from how you do, doesn't make either of us "better" or superior. Just different styles.

Depends what you are trying to get from your Knight. And it really depends on if you are PUGing or grouping up, and if in a group, what is your specific role in that group? Guard bot protecting the Slayer, 2h is inferior simply due to Guard damage avoidance. 3-2-1 group, the 2H might pull ahead.

I suggest you try both, and see how it "feels". Remember, don't pay much attention to SC numbers.
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Tankbeardz
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Re: [Knight] With recent round of nerfs, is it time to go 2h spec?

Post#19 » Sat Dec 24, 2016 11:43 pm

Telen wrote:With offensive stats not counting against spec defences 2h tanks are far more survivable than on live. Targeting 2h tanks on live was very effective and better in many cases than to target guarded dps. Here unless you want to hold a bo long after your group wiped you might aswell go 2h and spec avoidance as theres nothing dps can do about it. Thats why melee trains are so dominant in scs here.
Nah..this is simply not the case. 2h was super easy mode on live with gear / pocket items / better mitigation.

Oh, and Odjira...

Dabbart
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Re: [Knight] With recent round of nerfs, is it time to go 2h spec?

Post#20 » Sat Dec 24, 2016 11:54 pm

Well, I do prefer the Defensive Rifts...
Azarael wrote: It's only a nerf if you're bad.

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Secrets wrote: Kindly adjust your attitude to actually help the community and do not impose your will on it. You aren't as powerful as you think.

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