[Swordmaster] Builds, hints and tips.

[ToXoS]

If you go more tankier and play Sword&Shield style would spec for crashing wave&vaul's buffer then rest in hoeth and at least have protection of hoeth. You do lose crit tactic from khaine, but if in orvr it's better to be more survivable in wb vs wb fights if your are low gear/rr and using shield&sword as SM. As you need to be the frontline and hold the line is better for the whole group in warband to have. As every zerg fights rarely have 2 good premade parties build to be frontline arrow fist that can always push in and get to the backlines.

SM really needs more fixing to be able to play like IB&Kotb can. More tanky and have build-in skills buffs for whole party. SM just isn't viable to play tanky mode when KOTB&IB do 100x more to their party when they are build to be tanky. Only thing where SM will always be better is dps as SM don't have any target that it has trouble in killing, because of all attacks being spirit & having spirit debuffs.

1. Crushing advance - armor bonus for whole group and stacks with armor potion (Minimum your guarded person gets the buff). This would already make shield&sword tanky SM more viable. 13 pts skill that is waste of time.

2. Redirected force - Remove this and change this totally to skill that does nothing else but buff your party. Doesn't need to do damage. Easy change is something like give your party parry/dodge/disrupt 10% bonus for 10s 30s cd skill.

3. Tactic forceful shock - Make this change Gusting wind to single target knockback and have long range knockback in it.

Just hope someday SM could be played more support tank and not just offensive tank.

Not ALL attacks of SM are spirit damage. Nevertheless, I'm 100% with you. You should work on a balance proposal with these ideas.

[Collateral]

Crit tactic is useless if you're speced snb for wb anyway. I posted here the builds I use some time ago. You can be quite tanky as snb SM, and not completely useless in a wb. You have WW, punt, double resist debuffs/group stat buffs, crashing wave etc. It's a solid class for wb play. Kotbs/chosen being so strong is their own problem, not of other classes imo.

[Charon]

2. Redirected force - Remove this and change this totally to skill that does nothing else but buff your party. Doesn't need to do damage. Easy change is something like give your party parry/dodge/disrupt 10% bonus for 10s 30s cd skill.

Crit tactic is useless if you're speced snb for wb anyway. I posted here the builds I use some time ago. You can be quite tanky as snb SM, and not completely useless in a wb. You have WW, punt, double resist debuffs/group stat buffs, crashing wave etc. It's a solid class for wb play. Kotbs/chosen being so strong is their own problem, not of other classes imo.

I quite agree that balanced accuracy main function is to support finisher and create aditional burst so its rather small scale tactic. SM does not have any worthy aoe finisher GW has different purpose. So maybe its way how RF should be changed. For now its lackluster skill we all agree.

Btw i dont know why but in my opinion both IB and SM have problem with their formaly most tankiest middle path. Both Vaul and Stone seems to be weaker than other options that sm and ib have.

[dansari]

Crit tactic is useless if you're speced snb for wb anyway. I posted here the builds I use some time ago. You can be quite tanky as snb SM, and not completely useless in a wb. You have WW, punt, double resist debuffs/group stat buffs, crashing wave etc. It's a solid class for wb play. Kotbs/chosen being so strong is their own problem, not of other classes imo.

I disagree. SM is in a pretty poor place regarding wb play imo. I think the greatest drawback is a lack of cc. One measly AOE punt, a kd, and a single target snare... Anyway, not a balance thread.

[Collateral]

Crit tactic is useless if you're speced snb for wb anyway. I posted here the builds I use some time ago. You can be quite tanky as snb SM, and not completely useless in a wb. You have WW, punt, double resist debuffs/group stat buffs, crashing wave etc. It's a solid class for wb play. Kotbs/chosen being so strong is their own problem, not of other classes imo.

I disagree. SM is in a pretty poor place regarding wb play imo. I think the greatest drawback is a lack of cc. One measly AOE punt, a kd, and a single target snare... Anyway, not a balance thread.

I don't see how it's different from BO. I would argue that it could actually be better (double resist debuff is not a small thing). If you think bo aoe snare is useful in wbs, you're wrong. Unless you have 4 bos spamming it, it's not worth wasting a tactic anymore when you can be more tanky. Punt is one of the most important things in the SM arsenal when it comes to wb play, so I don't know how you can say 'measly'. It's one of the ways you can interrupt early destro morale drops from tanks, which I still don't see order doing a whole lot for some reason. He also has a bubble, which has more dmg absorption, and he can use it whenever he wants. While on bo you actually have to hit something first, and the bubble is smaller, so it's useless.

SM is far from a poor place in wb play. It's just that order players should actually think about how to utilise certain things I guess (not saying you specifically, but in general).

[Thamor]

Very weak aoe knockback and give immunity to everyone who you hit...not good play 99% of the times it's very bad choice to have SM's who spamming that skill and giving free immunity, when you can have super single target knockback to get the healer punted to your own side or get the tank that is guarded far away enough that you can kill the target. Gusting winds is just bad in almost every situation.

[peterthepan3]

It's useless if used by bad players. Too few people know how to utilise a sm properly in wb. Grur gave some good points regarding it.

[Collateral]

Gusting winds is just bad in almost every situation.

That is simply wrong. I don't understand you people. I played bo (sm mirror) for almost 2 years on this server now. Majority of that time was spent in phalanx, playing in wbs. While I'm certainly not the best ever, I can still say I know a thing or two about the class(es), especially in wb play. And I'm telling you, the punt is FAR from useless. But if you don't want to believe me there's nothing I can do. I just wish people stop crying about early destro morale drops, when order actually has ways of dealing with it (punt is only one of many).

I won't derail this thread any more.

[ToXoS]

Gusting winds is just bad in almost every situation.

That is simply wrong. I don't understand you people. I played bo (sm mirror) for almost 2 years on this server now. Majority of that time was spent in phalanx, playing in wbs. While I'm certainly not the best ever, I can still say I know a thing or two about the class(es), especially in wb play. And I'm telling you, the punt is FAR from useless. But if you don't want to believe me there's nothing I can do. I just wish people stop crying about early destro morale drops, when order actually has ways of dealing with it (punt is only one of many).

I won't derail this thread any more.

Gusting winds? Bad?
Ask my squishy groupmates I saved from a destro melee train if Gusting Winds is bad or not.
Some people clearly lack imagination. Or just need to l2p. Or just play the SM as a FO loldps. Idk.
Even if the SM doesn't have a super punt, in A LOT of situations, a medium AoE punt is better.

[Dalgrimar]

AoE KB is actually pretty good if you know when and how to use it.
Both offensive and defensive.