DPS AMs post dot nerf/disrupt buff

[Ormix]

I honestly don't know how you can consider 1v1 an actual balance point, but whatever. Here's my evaluation of a DPS AM as a class. It's strengths and weaknesses and so forth. If you actually stop being short sighted and conservative enough about the game to say that something should be ineffective just because it doesn't go with one specific build choice of all the available options, then you would realise that different things are all supposed to be effective and viable in any given game, just with various different strengths and weaknesses.

DPS AM:

It has slightly single less target damage than a Shadow Warrior but attacks spirit resistance which is usually weak amongst destro so I suppose it kind of evens out, however unlike a shadow warrior or actual true dps classes, it takes time to set up your burst combo to maximum effectiveness. That means you need 4 gcds to apply 4 dots, then you need to debuff toughness of the target with Law of Ages with a 5th gcd, then a short burst of two 1s cast damage spells (the second is a silence) and an instant cast channel spell. Any other dps class can do basically more or at the worst equal damage, but in a much shorter time.

It has self healing, shields and other goodies, which make it quite a bit more durable then most of the other RDPS classes, however unlike other dps classes, the AM has ABSOLUTELY NO VIABLE AOE DAMAGE. Nada. 0. You have one ability that does a tiny bit of damage which you can use every 30 seconds, and it's at short range, which puts you in a bad spot. This is actually a huge damn deal for any dps class. WL has no aoe, and it's burst damage potential is the highest of all melee classes. Not sure if Squig Herder has it or not, but Squig Herder has a spammable ranged slow, ranged silence, ranged armor reduction and really fast burst damage at a safe distance.

What it has to make up for lacking aoe damage is aoe debuffs that make other people do more damage to their targets or a group of enemies do less damage or aoe ap drain if you swing that way. None of these things directly impact the battlefield, but can be decently useful.

DPS AM is also just not a hybrid. Hybrid never worked. Even if you didn't use Divine Fury, your heals suck because you invested everything into intellect so you can get through disrupts and do more damage. It's actually just stupid consider the miniscule heals of a DPS AM to be "healing", because even in SCs where I had to heal and debuff much more than I had the opportunity to dps, you would see engineers with their barrels doing pretty much more healing than a DPS AM. So should we consider an engineer a hybrid dps/healer and nerf the living crap out of it now?

When you take these things into consideration, DPS AM was just pretty much balanced. In fact, it was slightly weaker than other DPS classes simply because it didn't have any actual aoe damage, which is a huge deal for rvr.

Post nerf, AM is basically just a guy that can barely do damage, because disrupts happen A LOT even with capped intellect and tactics, a guy that can barely debuff the enemies (which is the only real contribution he has in an RVR environment besides single target damage, which is usually better when it's burst, and AM has to prepare for several seconds before he does any damage) because, again, disrupts and a guy that isn't a healer either, because he's worse than an engineer with his barrel.

I remember someone said in this threat that nobody cares about DPS AMs, well the players that play them and have fun doing so care. Imagine if Marauder was just nerfed to the ground suddenly, screwing over one of the most popular classes on destro. I imagine there'd be a raging shitstorm on the forums, not because it's important for the game balance or something, but because the people that liked marauders care. And similarly, I care about the class I'm here to play and spend 80% of my time on when online. It's actually bad enough that DPS AM/Shaman enthusiasts that I knew and chatted with on the server just straight up respecced into full healer, because it's unplayable.

I said that nobody cares about dps AMs, but I do, since I play the class. Well, used to... now it's just feels like a half of the class. Not being able to do proper damage or even debuff targets feels terrible...

[Ormix]

Do you guys think the devs gonna do anything?

[anarchypark]

how many rotations do you need more to kill target? compared to b4?

[Ormix]

how many rotations do you need more to kill target? compared to b4?

Healers - sumply unkillable atm, even with 2 tactics for strikethrough, the AP drain will not be applyed in most of the cases. Same goes to health drain dot.

Tanks - unkillable. Blocks, parry and dissrupt. (But thats understandable)

Mdps - depens on your luck really Sometimes I got 0 out of 5 skills that actually go though and for the next rotation it's 2\3 out of 5 skills...so pretty much no damage compare to before.

Rdps - little better than mdps, but still it feels like 30-35% damage reduction because of disrupts.

At least thats my experience.

[anarchypark]

what's ur int and strikethrough?
since disrupt happen on DoT ticks, give 20% strikethrough bonus when applying DoT?
GL with suggestion forum

[Ormix]

what's ur int and strikethrough?
since disrupt happen on DoT ticks, give 20% strikethrough bonus when applying DoT?
GL with suggestion forum

"Topics made to suggest combat system, gameplay or balance changes will be locked." - this is from suggestion forum main topic.

[anarchypark]

My bad, I mean balance forum.

[diedrake]

I honestly don't know how you can consider 1v1 an actual balance point, but whatever. Here's my evaluation of a DPS AM as a class. It's strengths and weaknesses and so forth. If you actually stop being short sighted and conservative enough about the game to say that something should be ineffective just because it doesn't go with one specific build choice of all the available options, then you would realise that different things are all supposed to be effective and viable in any given game, just with various different strengths and weaknesses.

DPS AM:

It has slightly single less target damage than a Shadow Warrior but attacks spirit resistance which is usually weak amongst destro so I suppose it kind of evens out, however unlike a shadow warrior or actual true dps classes, it takes time to set up your burst combo to maximum effectiveness. That means you need 4 gcds to apply 4 dots, then you need to debuff toughness of the target with Law of Ages with a 5th gcd, then a short burst of two 1s cast damage spells (the second is a silence) and an instant cast channel spell. Any other dps class can do basically more or at the worst equal damage, but in a much shorter time.

It has self healing, shields and other goodies, which make it quite a bit more durable then most of the other RDPS classes, however unlike other dps classes, the AM has ABSOLUTELY NO VIABLE AOE DAMAGE. Nada. 0. You have one ability that does a tiny bit of damage which you can use every 30 seconds, and it's at short range, which puts you in a bad spot. This is actually a huge damn deal for any dps class. WL has no aoe, and it's burst damage potential is the highest of all melee classes. Not sure if Squig Herder has it or not, but Squig Herder has a spammable ranged slow, ranged silence, ranged armor reduction and really fast burst damage at a safe distance.

What it has to make up for lacking aoe damage is aoe debuffs that make other people do more damage to their targets or a group of enemies do less damage or aoe ap drain if you swing that way. None of these things directly impact the battlefield, but can be decently useful.

DPS AM is also just not a hybrid. Hybrid never worked. Even if you didn't use Divine Fury, your heals suck because you invested everything into intellect so you can get through disrupts and do more damage. It's actually just stupid consider the miniscule heals of a DPS AM to be "healing", because even in SCs where I had to heal and debuff much more than I had the opportunity to dps, you would see engineers with their barrels doing pretty much more healing than a DPS AM. So should we consider an engineer a hybrid dps/healer and nerf the living crap out of it now?

When you take these things into consideration, DPS AM was just pretty much balanced. In fact, it was slightly weaker than other DPS classes simply because it didn't have any actual aoe damage, which is a huge deal for rvr.

Post nerf, AM is basically just a guy that can barely do damage, because disrupts happen A LOT even with capped intellect and tactics, a guy that can barely debuff the enemies (which is the only real contribution he has in an RVR environment besides single target damage, which is usually better when it's burst, and AM has to prepare for several seconds before he does any damage) because, again, disrupts and a guy that isn't a healer either, because he's worse than an engineer with his barrel.

I remember someone said in this threat that nobody cares about DPS AMs, well the players that play them and have fun doing so care. Imagine if Marauder was just nerfed to the ground suddenly, screwing over one of the most popular classes on destro. I imagine there'd be a raging shitstorm on the forums, not because it's important for the game balance or something, but because the people that liked marauders care. And similarly, I care about the class I'm here to play and spend 80% of my time on when online. It's actually bad enough that DPS AM/Shaman enthusiasts that I knew and chatted with on the server just straight up respecced into full healer, because it's unplayable.

Hate to break it to you but instead of continuing to complain about nerf... Adapt to it. Ask fellow AMs that are doing well and see if they have advice for you. BTW, you mentioned if mara was nerfed to the ground guess what... Mara is my fav class... Always was even when a mara player was laughed at. I will still play my fav class and deal with the nerfs, it would prob make me change the way i played him but i wouldnt come to the forums and complain.

[Ormix]

I honestly don't know how you can consider 1v1 an actual balance point, but whatever. Here's my evaluation of a DPS AM as a class. It's strengths and weaknesses and so forth. If you actually stop being short sighted and conservative enough about the game to say that something should be ineffective just because it doesn't go with one specific build choice of all the available options, then you would realise that different things are all supposed to be effective and viable in any given game, just with various different strengths and weaknesses.

DPS AM:

It has slightly single less target damage than a Shadow Warrior but attacks spirit resistance which is usually weak amongst destro so I suppose it kind of evens out, however unlike a shadow warrior or actual true dps classes, it takes time to set up your burst combo to maximum effectiveness. That means you need 4 gcds to apply 4 dots, then you need to debuff toughness of the target with Law of Ages with a 5th gcd, then a short burst of two 1s cast damage spells (the second is a silence) and an instant cast channel spell. Any other dps class can do basically more or at the worst equal damage, but in a much shorter time.

It has self healing, shields and other goodies, which make it quite a bit more durable then most of the other RDPS classes, however unlike other dps classes, the AM has ABSOLUTELY NO VIABLE AOE DAMAGE. Nada. 0. You have one ability that does a tiny bit of damage which you can use every 30 seconds, and it's at short range, which puts you in a bad spot. This is actually a huge damn deal for any dps class. WL has no aoe, and it's burst damage potential is the highest of all melee classes. Not sure if Squig Herder has it or not, but Squig Herder has a spammable ranged slow, ranged silence, ranged armor reduction and really fast burst damage at a safe distance.

What it has to make up for lacking aoe damage is aoe debuffs that make other people do more damage to their targets or a group of enemies do less damage or aoe ap drain if you swing that way. None of these things directly impact the battlefield, but can be decently useful.

DPS AM is also just not a hybrid. Hybrid never worked. Even if you didn't use Divine Fury, your heals suck because you invested everything into intellect so you can get through disrupts and do more damage. It's actually just stupid consider the miniscule heals of a DPS AM to be "healing", because even in SCs where I had to heal and debuff much more than I had the opportunity to dps, you would see engineers with their barrels doing pretty much more healing than a DPS AM. So should we consider an engineer a hybrid dps/healer and nerf the living crap out of it now?

When you take these things into consideration, DPS AM was just pretty much balanced. In fact, it was slightly weaker than other DPS classes simply because it didn't have any actual aoe damage, which is a huge deal for rvr.

Post nerf, AM is basically just a guy that can barely do damage, because disrupts happen A LOT even with capped intellect and tactics, a guy that can barely debuff the enemies (which is the only real contribution he has in an RVR environment besides single target damage, which is usually better when it's burst, and AM has to prepare for several seconds before he does any damage) because, again, disrupts and a guy that isn't a healer either, because he's worse than an engineer with his barrel.

I remember someone said in this threat that nobody cares about DPS AMs, well the players that play them and have fun doing so care. Imagine if Marauder was just nerfed to the ground suddenly, screwing over one of the most popular classes on destro. I imagine there'd be a raging shitstorm on the forums, not because it's important for the game balance or something, but because the people that liked marauders care. And similarly, I care about the class I'm here to play and spend 80% of my time on when online. It's actually bad enough that DPS AM/Shaman enthusiasts that I knew and chatted with on the server just straight up respecced into full healer, because it's unplayable.

Hate to break it to you but instead of continuing to complain about nerf... Adapt to it. Ask fellow AMs that are doing well and see if they have advice for you. BTW, you mentioned if mara was nerfed to the ground guess what... Mara is my fav class... Always was even when a mara player was laughed at. I will still play my fav class and deal with the nerfs, it would prob make me change the way i played him but i wouldnt come to the forums and complain.

In the matter of fact, I did ask fellow AMs and shamans and they all went full healers...

[Acidic]

Also u have to understand that you are also benefiting from the changes. As a hybrid you should be getting improvements from your stats. The formula works better for hybrid than single stat due to the way it works.