DPS AMs post dot nerf/disrupt buff

[Acidic]

So. in your view, the changes to DoT classes were done as a direct result of DPS AMs dominating solo/1v1 encounters by using the above 'tactics'?
Since when does a solo PoV have any bearing on class balance, and how does a blanket nerf to the other DoT classes (namely, the magus/engi) seem justified, just because DPS AM dominates solo (as it always has done, and as everyone has accepted).

No, did I mention 1v1
I mentioned a play style of the dot class this thread was initiated with.

And in what environment, other than solo/1v1, was this tactic ever considered overperforming? I can't recall ever hearing people complain about DPS AMs/DoT classes detaunting after applying DoTs, outside of solo roaming, because it's a complete nonissue.

Well reasoned not.

[peterthepan3]

No, did I mention 1v1
I mentioned a play style of the dot class this thread was initiated with.

And in what environment, other than solo/1v1, was this tactic ever considered overperforming? I can't recall ever hearing people complain about DPS AMs/DoT classes detaunting after applying DoTs, outside of solo roaming, because it's a complete nonissue.

Well reasoned not.

? K

[Sulorie]

Instead of making dots break detaunt it could have been fixed properly to respond to cheesy dot-up-and-detaunt tactics. As dot damage is calculated per tick now, all what is needed is a decrease of damage for active dots by 50% on the target you detaunt.

[peterthepan3]

Instead of making dots break detaunt it could have been fixed properly to respond to cheesy dot-up-and-detaunt tactics. As dot damage is calculated per tick now, all what is needed is a decrease of damage for active dots by 50% on the target you detaunt.

But why is even that warranted in any environment outside of solo/1v1? I'm yet to hear a compelling argument.

[dansari]

I... Don't spend a single point on dodge/disrupt.

We know. Thanks

[Sulorie]

Instead of making dots break detaunt it could have been fixed properly to respond to cheesy dot-up-and-detaunt tactics. As dot damage is calculated per tick now, all what is needed is a decrease of damage for active dots by 50% on the target you detaunt.

But why is even that warranted in any environment outside of solo/1v1? I'm yet to hear a compelling argument.

Well, it is hard to argue why it should be possible to deal almost all of your damage excluding direct attacks (2 ticks of stronger dots have damage similar to their 2sec cast), while receiving only half damage by your enemy.
Saying that as a DPS AM myself.
Balancing on a group setting can't be the reason to ignore such flaws. Any class with direct damage deals zero damage after detaunt.
For 1vs1 hardly anything will change, as you in most cases don't need to detaunt.

[Esperflame]

I'd say ask Xiuxiu about how he gets around the new disrupt rules. I can be running 25% disrupt and holding the line and I still go from 100% to 0% health in like 3-5 seconds without disrupting a damn thing. That guy is a machine!

[live4treasure]

I honestly don't know how you can consider 1v1 an actual balance point, but whatever. Here's my evaluation of a DPS AM as a class. It's strengths and weaknesses and so forth. If you actually stop being short sighted and conservative enough about the game to say that something should be ineffective just because it doesn't go with one specific build choice of all the available options, then you would realise that different things are all supposed to be effective and viable in any given game, just with various different strengths and weaknesses.

DPS AM:

It has slightly single less target damage than a Shadow Warrior but attacks spirit resistance which is usually weak amongst destro so I suppose it kind of evens out, however unlike a shadow warrior or actual true dps classes, it takes time to set up your burst combo to maximum effectiveness. That means you need 4 gcds to apply 4 dots, then you need to debuff toughness of the target with Law of Ages with a 5th gcd, then a short burst of two 1s cast damage spells (the second is a silence) and an instant cast channel spell. Any other dps class can do basically more or at the worst equal damage, but in a much shorter time.

It has self healing, shields and other goodies, which make it quite a bit more durable then most of the other RDPS classes, however unlike other dps classes, the AM has ABSOLUTELY NO VIABLE AOE DAMAGE. Nada. 0. You have one ability that does a tiny bit of damage which you can use every 30 seconds, and it's at short range, which puts you in a bad spot. This is actually a huge damn deal for any dps class. WL has no aoe, and it's burst damage potential is the highest of all melee classes. Not sure if Squig Herder has it or not, but Squig Herder has a spammable ranged slow, ranged silence, ranged armor reduction and really fast burst damage at a safe distance.

What it has to make up for lacking aoe damage is aoe debuffs that make other people do more damage to their targets or a group of enemies do less damage or aoe ap drain if you swing that way. None of these things directly impact the battlefield, but can be decently useful.

DPS AM is also just not a hybrid. Hybrid never worked. Even if you didn't use Divine Fury, your heals suck because you invested everything into intellect so you can get through disrupts and do more damage. It's actually just stupid consider the miniscule heals of a DPS AM to be "healing", because even in SCs where I had to heal and debuff much more than I had the opportunity to dps, you would see engineers with their barrels doing pretty much more healing than a DPS AM. So should we consider an engineer a hybrid dps/healer and nerf the living crap out of it now?

When you take these things into consideration, DPS AM was just pretty much balanced. In fact, it was slightly weaker than other DPS classes simply because it didn't have any actual aoe damage, which is a huge deal for rvr.

Post nerf, AM is basically just a guy that can barely do damage, because disrupts happen A LOT even with capped intellect and tactics, a guy that can barely debuff the enemies (which is the only real contribution he has in an RVR environment besides single target damage, which is usually better when it's burst, and AM has to prepare for several seconds before he does any damage) because, again, disrupts and a guy that isn't a healer either, because he's worse than an engineer with his barrel.

I remember someone said in this threat that nobody cares about DPS AMs, well the players that play them and have fun doing so care. Imagine if Marauder was just nerfed to the ground suddenly, screwing over one of the most popular classes on destro. I imagine there'd be a raging shitstorm on the forums, not because it's important for the game balance or something, but because the people that liked marauders care. And similarly, I care about the class I'm here to play and spend 80% of my time on when online. It's actually bad enough that DPS AM/Shaman enthusiasts that I knew and chatted with on the server just straight up respecced into full healer, because it's unplayable.

[Dabbart]

Instead of making dots break detaunt it could have been fixed properly to respond to cheesy dot-up-and-detaunt tactics. As dot damage is calculated per tick now, all what is needed is a decrease of damage for active dots by 50% on the target you detaunt.

But why is even that warranted in any environment outside of solo/1v1? I'm yet to hear a compelling argument.

And you wont. It was fun while it lasted. Just like retaining mounted speed after jumping in water. But we all knew it was too good to be true. If you're squishy, watch your Agro. Or get a guard.

I... Don't spend a single point on dodge/disrupt.

We know. Thanks

[Zegota]

I'd say ask Xiuxiu about how he gets around the new disrupt rules. I can be running 25% disrupt and holding the line and I still go from 100% to 0% health in like 3-5 seconds without disrupting a damn thing. That guy is a machine!

Nah, man, what you're describing sounds like some lotto winning situation. At this point healers just stand in my face and tank me, without even cleansing and detaunting, cause it's impossible to get through. Even if WoP gets through once every blue moon, I might get a chance to apply more dots in that window cause of lowered wp, but usually the wop tick gets disrupted together with, considering how rotation works, most of the dmg that comes post wop tick, cause the debuff ended. Also in group play, after the kill on enemy dps I simply can't assist the group with pressuring healer. I also don't bother with SnB tanks unless they are some loldps trying to throw your attention away with the shield, or if they are way out of position.

I'm capped int with 7% disrupt strikethrough. Can't imagine how tough it must be for the other casters with less.

Not saying that it should be easy to kill snb tanks and healers, but as a caster it's almost impossible to punish a bad play of a healer at this point. And I might be mistaken, but I don't think that there are any skills that flat debuff disrupt, unlike other evasion, so disrupt should be toned down a bit at this point.