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[AM] Vaul healing viability and questions

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Telen
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Re: [AM] Vaul healing viability and questions

Post#11 » Mon Apr 27, 2020 12:29 pm

uanaka wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 12:18 pm
At least in city wbs, I've seen a few groups run some really good lifetap spec shaman with fury of da green. If it gets paired with Waaaagh and Chop Fasta, you have almost 100% uptime. And the good shaman can blow out WP in terms of heal numbers. You might need to chain it with some dps abilities to keep your mechanic up that allows you to cast it on the move (i dont know the spec myself, but i've seen how good it can be), but that shouldn't be too difficult.

I just think it's harder for AM to get as much value since you have less cooldown increasers and less survivability tactics compared to the shaman with their run away/auto detaunt (whether or not they use that tactic is something else). And from what I have seen, they have the flexibility to use he shaman as healers as opposed to order using them for morale pump bots.

Also, Energy of Vaul is actually 5 secs cd, it's just the career builder not updating it correctly.
FotG and EoV are counted as dps abilities so you have to chain them with healing abilities (dumb I know as they now need a tactic to actually do damage). They are still just healbots casting heal then FoG for the base heal.
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uanaka
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Re: [AM] Vaul healing viability and questions

Post#12 » Mon Apr 27, 2020 12:34 pm

Telen wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 12:29 pm
uanaka wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 12:18 pm
At least in city wbs, I've seen a few groups run some really good lifetap spec shaman with fury of da green. If it gets paired with Waaaagh and Chop Fasta, you have almost 100% uptime. And the good shaman can blow out WP in terms of heal numbers. You might need to chain it with some dps abilities to keep your mechanic up that allows you to cast it on the move (i dont know the spec myself, but i've seen how good it can be), but that shouldn't be too difficult.

I just think it's harder for AM to get as much value since you have less cooldown increasers and less survivability tactics compared to the shaman with their run away/auto detaunt (whether or not they use that tactic is something else). And from what I have seen, they have the flexibility to use he shaman as healers as opposed to order using them for morale pump bots.

Also, Energy of Vaul is actually 5 secs cd, it's just the career builder not updating it correctly.
FotG and EoV are counted as dps abilities so you have to chain them with healing abilities (dumb I know as they now need a tactic to actually do damage). They are still just healbots casting heal then FoG for the base heal.
I can't say for sure, but I think at least some of them might be specced full DPS with the tactic that changes it completely to a lifetap without a base heal. Just because I've seen some crazy numbers (4+ mil) and I don't know if that can be achieved with just relying on the base heal alone.

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Telen
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Re: [AM] Vaul healing viability and questions

Post#13 » Mon Apr 27, 2020 12:42 pm

uanaka wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 12:34 pm
I can't say for sure, but I think at least some of them might be specced full DPS with the tactic that changes it completely to a lifetap without a base heal. Just because I've seen some crazy numbers (4+ mil) and I don't know if that can be achieved with just relying on the base heal alone.
They wont be. Its practically a free heal due to heals reducing the cast time of FotG and FotG then reducing the cast time of their heal.

Just before Mythic were canned and the game went into maintenance mode they were working on a AM/Shaman mechanic rework that had all Vaul abilities use either mechanic point so you werent limited to healbot or dps. Personally Ive never known why the didnt implement that here.
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krvutami
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Re: [AM] Vaul healing viability and questions

Post#14 » Mon Apr 27, 2020 1:05 pm

Would mechanic like 'converts x% of your Willpower to Int / Willpower to Str' help with the Vaul /Isha/ Salv WP builds actually use their offensive and support skils?

On my salv WP it just doesn't feel good using any of Grace skills (or KB for that matter) due to lack of chance to hit, which isn't making sense as both Warrior Priest and Archmage classes in general have been heavily advertised as the ones weaving offense/support and healing in order to truly shine, one on the front lines, the other in the back lines.

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Telen
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Re: [AM] Vaul healing viability and questions

Post#15 » Mon Apr 27, 2020 1:25 pm

It would never work. It would either be completely op in smallscale or completely worthless in rvr. You have to specialize on this server particularly now everyone is gearing towards aoe morale bombing due to all endgame gear being locked behind a game mode that requires it and the cap increase.
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Starx
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Re: [AM] Vaul healing viability and questions

Post#16 » Mon Apr 27, 2020 10:42 pm

EoV and the shaman equiv work best in heal setups not dps. This is due to the class mechanic always being in the correct state to use it for EoV, and the fact that EoV while not mentioned anywhere (im too lazy to make a bug report for AM) cannot crit unless you have the tactic for it slotted. And to be real with you that tactic sucks donkey ****, and barely makes you heal for more even in a DPS setup, i only ran it to jerk off to my scoreboard numbers in city. Should also be mentioned here that EoV is really only good in city, or largescale RvR (and you would be retarded not to run it there plz respec for city at least). It's pretty much **** in scs and small scale compared to funnel. AM in general is just bad in smallscale imo tho.

You see more shamans running it proper because shaman like people have said here before are more tanky than AM, have a better morale pump etc... Ya I know AM has the best single target pump but it costs a ton of gcds is extremely frustrating to use, and the entire warband and warband leader have to play around you pumping a knight to m4 before they do anything. Meanwhile shaman pushing 1 button every 10 seconds that also happens to be a nice little dmg buff to the group and in no way shape or form changes how the shaman or warband plays.

As for playing a DPS lifetap build with EoV+tactic I do it on my DPS AM because it's the ONLY thing that makes DPS AM go from dogshit to just bad in city. And to top off this crapcake you need at minimum 6pc DPS sov to even pull it off so you can have EoV and DE in the same spec.

You need to learn to juggle the mechanic to get anything out of this, if you get caught out with too many of 1 stack it can really mess things up.

For instance you could start a fight with full heal stacks by hotting everyone, go in with SoC, EoV, DE, dot, EoV now you are in 1 dmg stack, however if you say group heal here youll be back in heal stack for EoV however EoV wont be off cd at the same time there will be a ~2 sec delay so you want to actually build 2 dmg stacks after EoV and then hit 2 group heals in to EoV, build 2 dmg stacks... etc... You can also instead of building 2 dmg stacks say... EoV, Group heal, Transfer essence, group heal, EoV... you'll have some minor downtime on EoV with this but gain some pretty good singletarget healing on whoever you defensive target is. And of course in any of these juggles group heal can be traded out for whatever single target heal the situation might call for.

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satanicomoderno
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Re: [AM] Vaul healing viability and questions

Post#17 » Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:02 pm

krvutami wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 9:07 am
Hello guys,

Seeing more and more grace WP's are running around, I was wondering if it's possible to go same lifetap route with AMs, as I find straight up healing boring and miserable. My post contains essentially two questions:

1. Can you do good stuff with your Vaul AM in scenarios, oRvR and cities (not interested in organised tryhard groups here, mostly pugging it)

2. Does this build make sense RoR.builders - Archmage. If not, what would you change around?

Thanks!

This one is my old build. Didn't work as I expected. I didn't heal enough, I didn't caused damage enough and I died a lot! LOL!
Arcing Power is useless, if the lifetap of this tactic was bigger, like 50% or 75% this would be great! Instead, I'd use golden aura.
Also this is the worst build for AM atm. If you wanna run a heal AM go Isha/Asu, if DPS, go Asu/Vault. As DPS, I always change tactics between Golden Aura and Khaine's Touch because I love melting doks and zealots when possible.

raistomen
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Re: [AM] Vaul healing viability and questions

Post#18 » Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:55 pm

krvutami wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 10:41 am
Telen wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 10:36 am
You'll still be a healbot just with a couple of abilities to use your mechanic points on. The changes that made a hybird build possible were rolled back. You either use the tree for the debuff & silence as dps or EoV as a healer.
Okay, thank you for your reply. So it's play either full healer or full dps and disregard class mechanic 98% of the time.

Sad to hear that, such a shame.
I wouldn't quite give up on that idea. A good AM will spend a GCD anyway to flip high magic.

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raistomen
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Re: [AM] Vaul healing viability and questions

Post#19 » Wed Jun 24, 2020 6:00 pm

uanaka wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 12:18 pm
At least in city wbs, I've seen a few groups run some really good lifetap spec shaman with fury of da green. If it gets paired with Waaaagh and Chop Fasta, you have almost 100% uptime. And the good shaman can blow out WP in terms of heal numbers. You might need to chain it with some dps abilities to keep your mechanic up that allows you to cast it on the move (i dont know the spec myself, but i've seen how good it can be), but that shouldn't be too difficult.

I just think it's harder for AM to get as much value since you have less cooldown increasers and less survivability tactics compared to the shaman with their run away/auto detaunt (whether or not they use that tactic is something else). And from what I have seen, they have the flexibility to use he shaman as healers as opposed to order using them for morale pump bots.

Also, Energy of Vaul is actually 5 secs cd, it's just the career builder not updating it correctly.
Don't order also have a GCD reducer?

Sulorie
Posts: 4911

Re: [AM] Vaul healing viability and questions

Post#20 » Wed Jun 24, 2020 7:07 pm

raistomen wrote:
Wed Jun 24, 2020 6:00 pm
uanaka wrote:
Mon Apr 27, 2020 12:18 pm
At least in city wbs, I've seen a few groups run some really good lifetap spec shaman with fury of da green. If it gets paired with Waaaagh and Chop Fasta, you have almost 100% uptime. And the good shaman can blow out WP in terms of heal numbers. You might need to chain it with some dps abilities to keep your mechanic up that allows you to cast it on the move (i dont know the spec myself, but i've seen how good it can be), but that shouldn't be too difficult.

I just think it's harder for AM to get as much value since you have less cooldown increasers and less survivability tactics compared to the shaman with their run away/auto detaunt (whether or not they use that tactic is something else). And from what I have seen, they have the flexibility to use he shaman as healers as opposed to order using them for morale pump bots.

Also, Energy of Vaul is actually 5 secs cd, it's just the career builder not updating it correctly.
Don't order also have a GCD reducer?
They do but destro have higher uptime with BO+choppa in same grp.
Dying is no option.

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