[SM] Is Swordmaster even the best 2H tank?

[Kyraith]

Just curious peoples feelings here.

Seems like 2H Knights and even IBs are still more useful then a 2H SM.

[Rapzel]

Define best.

Highest avoidance in the game for a 2H? Yes
Highest damage on a tank? Probably yes.
Decent buffs? Yes
Screwed over by gear, and meta DPS? Yes.
Issues because lack of a USEFUL punt? Yes.

SM is pretty good pug stomper, and used to be great with aSW and WL because 3 man pounce and instantly kill a target (let's not even talk about when weapon procc and wrist slash stacked), changes to WL burst and the release of new gear sets changed this quite dramatically, healers tanked up and got better at positioning.

I'm going to be honest though and tell you idk if SM is weak or not, I think with gear it'll still be strong, it's just that KotBS is so much stronger than any other order tank for small scale (everything except PvE tbh) there's no way to replace it.

So the fight for the second tank slot atm is between IB and SM.
And while I think overall IB is a little bit weaker than SM.
IB still synergizes with slayer way better than SM (armor debuff, parry buff with init), also playing around one punt is not the best even though you can do the ol' punt/kd.

As long as most careers feel lack luster compared to slayer I don't think this will change.

[billyk]

SM has great single target burst but lacks the CC to be useful as a large scale tank and the AoE to be useful as a large scale dps.

Everything the SM can do for a WB, the KotBS can do better. Except bursting down squishies, but with no pounce (M2 yeah, yeah)/pull and a bugged AoE root, SM is suboptimal for everything but small scale.

[DokB]

2h SM still has the best damage of Order tanks, as well as some very niche abilities (mainly WODS for self-preservation and Wings M2) but after that they fall flat compared with the utility that 2h IB brings. And KotBS is just in a completely different realm to the other classes with what they bring to a group.

Trying to play in Solo Ranked with a tank like SM or BO where all you bring to the table is your damage isn’t enough unfortunately. You really need the utility to make plays which is why I think you don’t see many these days.

[jvlosky]

Just curious peoples feelings here.

Seems like 2H Knights and even IBs are still more useful then a 2H SM.

The only reason a Knight goes 2h is to get access to their wounds debuff and crit debuff if they are talented for it, which they probably are if 2h.

Also to get access to shorter cd on banish darkness with the talent.

2h knight dmg is really bad. Still a tank, just different flavor.

[Fey]

With SM I'd take a look at trying to carve out a niche for yourself. People drool over BG debuffs, but SM can debuff as well.

Lingering intimidation tactic with dragon talon will seriously debuff mdps output. If you have a mdps on the opposite side that you recognize then debuff the crap out of them. With: Quick Incision - Lingering Intimidation - Dragon Talon you can greatly hamper the output of that Choppa 3-man that keeps pwning you in Nordenwatch.

One of the nastiest ways to utilize a 2-hand SM is with a 2-hand IB in city scenarios. Cross guard each other and go around debuffing out-going healing on each healer. The two of you will readily pump out so many hexes and curses that the IB's Punishing Knock is going to cripple enemy healing.

Also the damage that the two of you are producing is going to distract the healers. It is mediocre dps sure, but eventually they will be forced to focus on themselves. This is exactly what you want. One or two global cooldowns where the healer has to heal themselves is one or two less group heals. That can easily set a group up for collapse.

SM has decent dps and can actually heal sort of. However don't neglect your debuffs. Even without Lingering Intimidation, Dragon's Talon is like a targeted Challange.

Dazzling Strike is no slouch either, especially on Shaman/Zealot that like to sit there and spam group heal. More often than not this is a shaman who thinks he's hot **** in a champagne glass. Well really he's just cold diarrhea in a Dixie cup, and you're going to show him with Dazzling Strike.

Also Blurring Shock and Skull Thumper are like the only skills left in the game without an ICD. That alone is worth something. Devs you'd better leave these skills alone, I swear to Nyarlathotep.