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[SM] Whispering Wind problems

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Gurf
Posts: 519

Re: [SM] Whispering Wind problems

Post#41 » Thu Feb 04, 2021 5:32 pm

emiliorv wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 3:53 pm
Spoiler:
Gurf wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 2:17 pm
Spoiler:
emiliorv wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 1:34 pm

im tired of every post turned into => destro mirror is better///destro class XX is OP//Nerf this///nerf that

In this post its ANYTHING TO ARGUE ABOUT BO => the OP was clear enough. Hes asking to remove the silence component from WW and move to other sm ability. Nothing more.
People are allowed to add and develop a discussion you know, that is generally how things go for a thread not in the suggestion forum.

The original developers of the game didn't think BO needed a CD decreaser at all, probably because Choppa already had one. Not only did BO get one from ROR developers but also they get one which is better than the SM, this would be ok if Destro also didn't get mirrored Shattered Limbs increaser to SH but they did. This is all relevant to any discussion about changes to WW and what level it should be brought up to make is balanced on a wider faction scale.

I am not a massive fan of nerfs on classes which aren't obviously OP (unlike those people who call for Rampage nerfs on a daily basis and even have it in their Sig :lol: ) but I mentioned making Waaaaagghh being triggered on hit to make it more organisation friendly skill which takes better teamwork to pull off, ie make the game more group and skill orientated rather than pug friendly, which is what everyone seems to talk about when it comes to end game, but obviously its not a relevant talking point it it means nerfing Destro in any way.

At the moment pretty much only Rolgrom carries off SW and WW in City well, because it takes good leadership and organisation to do it effectively. If WW and SW becomes a braindead spam then that isn't good for anyone. But if Waaaaggh with MSH took the same level of teamwork to pull off effectively I see that as a good thing, even though it involves nerfing BO.
The 90% of your post are pure whine about destro classes (the other 10% are to buff order classes). This isnt different, dont try to hide the clearly intentions to promote a nerf behind the "more organization friendly"...its curious how you are looking for more organization gameplay but (somehow) support the change in city matchmaking who favour soloq...

This is ironic coming from the number one forum Rampage nerf campaigner

My reasoning is logically argued as to why I think changes are needed to either WW or Waaaaaagh or both. Its clear to me the ror Dev's messed up when they changed the tactic Mor' Choppin' Dem, it wasn't what the creators intended and its obvious that one side having insta available cleanse on all its healers is not balanced, or all the smaller advantages like being able to spam shatter without cooldown, detaunt cooldown brought down by 1/3, res 1 sec cooldown, Zealots being able to use Leaping Alteration twice as often as Rune Priests, SH most powerful aoe attack being brought down to spam levels etc etc etc, there is barely a single class who isn't significantly buffed by these. Anyone who has played in a group to any kind of high level knows the power of these cooldown decreaser abilities.

But like I said earlier I think removing the Silence and making WW undefendable would probably have to do for now, as its probably too late now to balance Waaaaagh with WW as BO is such a popular class

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emiliorv
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Posts: 1295

Re: [SM] Whispering Wind problems

Post#42 » Thu Feb 04, 2021 5:56 pm

Gurf wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 5:32 pm
emiliorv wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 3:53 pm
Spoiler:
Gurf wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 2:17 pm
Spoiler:
People are allowed to add and develop a discussion you know, that is generally how things go for a thread not in the suggestion forum.

The original developers of the game didn't think BO needed a CD decreaser at all, probably because Choppa already had one. Not only did BO get one from ROR developers but also they get one which is better than the SM, this would be ok if Destro also didn't get mirrored Shattered Limbs increaser to SH but they did. This is all relevant to any discussion about changes to WW and what level it should be brought up to make is balanced on a wider faction scale.

I am not a massive fan of nerfs on classes which aren't obviously OP (unlike those people who call for Rampage nerfs on a daily basis and even have it in their Sig :lol: ) but I mentioned making Waaaaagghh being triggered on hit to make it more organisation friendly skill which takes better teamwork to pull off, ie make the game more group and skill orientated rather than pug friendly, which is what everyone seems to talk about when it comes to end game, but obviously its not a relevant talking point it it means nerfing Destro in any way.

At the moment pretty much only Rolgrom carries off SW and WW in City well, because it takes good leadership and organisation to do it effectively. If WW and SW becomes a braindead spam then that isn't good for anyone. But if Waaaaggh with MSH took the same level of teamwork to pull off effectively I see that as a good thing, even though it involves nerfing BO.
The 90% of your post are pure whine about destro classes (the other 10% are to buff order classes). This isnt different, dont try to hide the clearly intentions to promote a nerf behind the "more organization friendly"...its curious how you are looking for more organization gameplay but (somehow) support the change in city matchmaking who favour soloq...


Its clear to me the ror Dev's messed up when they changed the tactic Mor' Choppin' Dem,
Sure...devs messed when introduced a change that hurts your realm...tell me more...

Both realms having access to diferent abilities is always unbalanced by default?

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teiloh
Posts: 691

Re: [SM] Whispering Wind problems

Post#43 » Thu Feb 04, 2021 9:55 pm

emiliorv wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 5:21 pm and dont forget nerf RUN AWAY! too => remember that is hands down the best tactic in the game
Good thing Run Away was stopped from refreshing and now has a 10s ICD. So it's not the best, just one of the best now.

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Detangler
Posts: 988

Re: [SM] Whispering Wind problems

Post#44 » Fri Feb 05, 2021 12:43 am

Abilities that provide self buffs or group buffs should always proc no matter if it's an attack-based ability. It makes no sense that some always proc the buffs and others don't.

Change all abilities to proc self buffs no matter if defended.
Detangler and alts - 84 Chosen, other 40s - DoK, Zealot, SH, WE, BG, BO
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Tangler and alts - 8X IB, other 40s - RP, SM
Order - Most dishonorable

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Likeaboss
Posts: 230

Re: [SM] Whispering Wind problems

Post#45 » Fri Feb 05, 2021 7:04 am

I just can't understand all this hatred in this topic. behave like childen who dont want to go to bed...

Since the old LIVE server Career builder isn't availabel anymore.. i can't tell for sure, plz tell me when i remember wrong..

CD decreaser was on SM and Choppa, and on live "chopp fasta" was on a 2 min cooldown
(really not 100% sure could have been 1 min CD)

-now "Chopp fasta" is on a 40s cooldown = 50% Uptime
-SM still has it's 50% uptime CD decreaser

And for some reason BO has got the same ability, in my opinion a bit better than SM, even when you have to slot a tactic for it.

So WHY exactly can't the destroforumwarriors understand why order isnt happy about this :geek:
wargrimnir wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 11:50 pm Accidental solo-friendly content doesn't stay that way for very long.

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Wdova
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Re: [SM] Whispering Wind problems

Post#46 » Fri Feb 05, 2021 7:31 am

Likeaboss wrote: Tue Feb 02, 2021 12:51 pm Pretty easy, just make it a AoE Ability with low or even no damage, doesnt matter...
remove silence on it and let it activate without target like BO
And make it require tactic slot like BO version? 😂
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Likeaboss
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Re: [SM] Whispering Wind problems

Post#47 » Fri Feb 05, 2021 7:41 am

Wdova wrote: Fri Feb 05, 2021 7:31 am
Likeaboss wrote: Tue Feb 02, 2021 12:51 pm Pretty easy, just make it a AoE Ability with low or even no damage, doesnt matter...
remove silence on it and let it activate without target like BO
And make it require tactic slot like BO version? 😂
Likeaboss wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:19 am
Noslock wrote: Wed Feb 03, 2021 4:59 pm
Likeaboss wrote: Tue Feb 02, 2021 12:51 pm Pretty easy, just make it a AoE Ability with low or even no damage, doesnt matter...
remove silence on it and let it activate without target like BO
and put a tactic on it like a bo right?
Yea, why not? Make a tactic which makes CD reduction on "Wrath of heaven"
and add an AA Damage buff which stacks with other AA Damage Buff's :P
Come one, if you would read the thread you would notice that this bullshit statement came up more than 1...
But picking one post that already has been answered 2-3 times, shows your intentions,
so please go back in that destro forumwarrior corner
WW SM has for sure a tactic spot that is not extremly needed...
wargrimnir wrote: Mon Apr 05, 2021 11:50 pm Accidental solo-friendly content doesn't stay that way for very long.

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Wdova
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Re: [SM] Whispering Wind problems

Post#48 » Fri Feb 05, 2021 12:22 pm

Spoiler:
Likeaboss wrote: Fri Feb 05, 2021 7:41 am
Wdova wrote: Fri Feb 05, 2021 7:31 am
Likeaboss wrote: Tue Feb 02, 2021 12:51 pm Pretty easy, just make it a AoE Ability with low or even no damage, doesnt matter...
remove silence on it and let it activate without target like BO
And make it require tactic slot like BO version? 😂
Likeaboss wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:19 am
Noslock wrote: Wed Feb 03, 2021 4:59 pm

and put a tactic on it like a bo right?
Yea, why not? Make a tactic which makes CD reduction on "Wrath of heaven"
and add an AA Damage buff which stacks with other AA Damage Buff's :P
Come one, if you would read the thread you would notice that this bullshit statement came up more than 1...
But picking one post that already has been answered 2-3 times, shows your intentions,
so please go back in that destro forumwarrior corner
WW SM has for sure a tactic spot that is not extremly needed...
I am going to pretend I havent read Your toxic reaction. Since I have rr70 + SnB SM in my arsenal, I can confirm, that WW was fine( I dont know if it was changed during last year and half). In orvr or scenario there was always caster type class around for silence. If I can compare BO version to SM one( I am leveling my 34 BO), I like SM version more. Personaly for me I feel that SnB SM was a bit easier to play than SnB BO.
Pigbutcher - Choppa RR80+
Cyplenkov - Marauder RR80+
Vdova - Witch elf RR80+

Hajzl - Swordmaster RR80+
Roznetka - Engineer RR70+

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Gurf
Posts: 519

Re: [SM] Whispering Wind problems

Post#49 » Fri Feb 05, 2021 12:37 pm

Wdova wrote: Fri Feb 05, 2021 12:22 pm
Spoiler:
Likeaboss wrote: Fri Feb 05, 2021 7:41 am
Wdova wrote: Fri Feb 05, 2021 7:31 am

And make it require tactic slot like BO version? 😂
Likeaboss wrote: Thu Feb 04, 2021 10:19 am

Yea, why not? Make a tactic which makes CD reduction on "Wrath of heaven"
and add an AA Damage buff which stacks with other AA Damage Buff's :P
Come one, if you would read the thread you would notice that this bullshit statement came up more than 1...
But picking one post that already has been answered 2-3 times, shows your intentions,
so please go back in that destro forumwarrior corner
WW SM has for sure a tactic spot that is not extremly needed...
I am going to pretend I havent read Your toxic reaction. Since I have rr70 + SnB SM in my arsenal, I can confirm, that WW was fine( I dont know if it was changed during last year and half). In orvr or scenario there was always caster type class around for silence. If I can compare BO version to SM one( I am leveling my 34 BO), I like SM version more. Personaly for me I feel that SnB SM was a bit easier to play than SnB BO.

Why would you like it more? The BO one can't be blocked or parried, WW has no advantage at all. They are talking of moving the silence to another ability not completely remove it. Maybe if you are running solo or pug it doesn't make any difference but when you have a bunch of SW on Discord waiting for your signal it is a different situation, In many situations you end up trying to hit a pet or silencing a tank just so you can try get it off when needed, then if blocked you have gone 40 seconds without any effect at all, there is no advantage to WW except not having it use a tactic slot.

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Wdova
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Re: [SM] Whispering Wind problems

Post#50 » Fri Feb 05, 2021 1:38 pm

Spoiler:
Gurf wrote: Fri Feb 05, 2021 12:37 pm
Wdova wrote: Fri Feb 05, 2021 12:22 pm
Spoiler:
Likeaboss wrote: Fri Feb 05, 2021 7:41 am




Come one, if you would read the thread you would notice that this bullshit statement came up more than 1...
But picking one post that already has been answered 2-3 times, shows your intentions,
so please go back in that destro forumwarrior corner
WW SM has for sure a tactic spot that is not extremly needed...
I am going to pretend I havent read Your toxic reaction. Since I have rr70 + SnB SM in my arsenal, I can confirm, that WW was fine( I dont know if it was changed during last year and half). In orvr or scenario there was always caster type class around for silence. If I can compare BO version to SM one( I am leveling my 34 BO), I like SM version more. Personaly for me I feel that SnB SM was a bit easier to play than SnB BO.

Why would you like it more? The BO one can't be blocked or parried, WW has no advantage at all. They are talking of moving the silence to another ability not completely remove it. Maybe if you are running solo or pug it doesn't make any difference but when you have a bunch of SW on Discord waiting for your signal it is a different situation, In many situations you end up trying to hit a pet or silencing a tank just so you can try get it off when needed, then if blocked you have gone 40 seconds without any effect at all, there is no advantage to WW except not having it use a tactic slot.
Trying to execute it on SnB tank is bad idea. What I like about it is the silence component. If silnce will be moved to another usefull skill, than I would agree, that making it mirror to BO version will be better. Downside for BO version is the need of extra tactic slot for it.
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