DPS spec tank/healer Hypocrisy

[Daknallbomb]

What more do pugs need? They have a pug scenario, can get renown/inf/medallions quickly from being in a warband, can get ruin/beastlord gear very easily if they find a group. What is it exactly pugs are being prevented from doing?

Also ror is not a hardcore game.

You have to be kidding. I agree that getting ruin and BL is not especially hard, and it's pretty good gear. But I don't agree about pugs just getting ez medals etc. quickly from just 'being in a warband'. Tell me, how many pugs do you see with full conq, how about 3p or even 2p? I personally don't see many, but maybe I'm not looking enough. Now tell me, how many 6mans and hc players do you see with full conq? Pretty much every single one, and on multiple characters. And why is this the case? I said it 10 times before. It's small groups following warbands, stealing kills and ganking soloers and, well, pugs. Because only dbs reward the medals. I can't count how many warbands our guild had since the new gear release, and guess how many conq do I have. 5p, maybe 6p? Nope, atm I'm on 4p, won 2 gold bags with one duplicate. Oh and the gold bags were from group play, ganking soloers and stuff you know. So now imagine the pugs getting medals by just 'being in a warband'. Sorry man, but it just doesn't happen.

I totally went derail mode, so I'm done in this thread. We can discuss this somewhere else.

*Edit by miself * was crap

[peterthepan3]

By 'easy' I refer to the means of acquisition, i e. steamrolling the zone, getting medals for zerging down people.

You won't get AS MANY medals as groups, but why should you for playing relatively-risk free?

Annihilator/merc gear is very easy to get right now (will be even easier if/when conq currency can be downscaled 1:5), and is only marginally worse than conq/dom. It's incredibly easy if you put some work into it and don't just join a wb hoping to get everything given to you.

[dansari]

That's an interesting concept.. giving some type of incentive for tanks to use guard. I wonder if something could be added that doesn't go against the vision of the devs. That would certainly help in solo queue scs.

[th3gatekeeper]

It's funny:). If you make from guard aura ability and tank get 50% damages from all players in 10 or 30 feet range then tank die in seconds and no one want guard anymore. Better is make from this spamable ability on 1 target or even total remove from pvp and stay only to take hate from mobs.

Weird... its like you never even read this thread... back when I FIRST brought up this idea:

Now, if we JUST did this... the tanks would never activate Guard... cause they would get NUKED in 2 seconds with 4 party members standing next to them...

So what you then have to do is modify Guard a little... I have ideas for this as well..

I always love how rather than put our thinking caps on, people stop at the first sign of "well this might be a problem, better not think about this any further".....

Anyways, as suspected, there are people that understand this is an issue and others that have no clue - likely because they have people who play during the same times they do, or have plenty of hours to play, etc.

But for the "majority" of gamers out there, who maybe log in for 30 min to 90 min "spurts" of play sessions at random times or NA times.... Or heck, even most NA players - understand this issue. If you have 30 minutes to kill, its not even worth playing ROR because itll take you half that time just finding a competent group to play with. Without which, you cant even really play the game and ONE of the primary culprits of this issue is Guard.

Now, if guard were to give the tank some type of "selfish" benefits, then you might see it more. Or if guard were made much more convenient for people to use, so they didnt have to "try hard" to use it. (Again, not that it IS hard to use, but players dont want to have their gameplay focused around staying 30 feet of 1 person. Its just not FUN to use...) Rather, would like to focus on using ALL of their abilities such as punt, taunt, challenge, snare, buff, debuff, etc. (Notice I didnt say "DPS")....

I think there are MANY creative ways to re-work guard and make a tanks life more FUN and less forced to /follow people around with guard on 1 person.

[warislove]

i play a tank and i love to guard folks that now what are they doing, same goes for the ones that dont...but that is my job and i love it. i dont need an incentive for doing it.

those tanks that dont guard either dont know their class or they just dont give a damn...reading tooltips isnt that hard

so its two things i guess: if u hate guard mechanic dont play a tank or if u really want to, play a dps tank and dont whine about low dmg/surviveability

[dansari]

That's not the issue gate is referring to. Gate is talking about how guard is too much a focus of what the game is built around and if it can be tweaked then it might make it more enjoyable for everyone in solo queue, especially mdps classes (while not really changing the game for premade groups)

[warislove]

i always que solo, so i guess he means how to make guard to work with no brain effort involved?

like make it an permanent auto acivating aura with 300ft range?

[Daknallbomb]

Well that it would be a aoe disaster nicht tank would survive that

[Kali14]

Ok I don't said...you said...just someone else said...but nevermind. What as pug player can I say about guard? This ability is main reason why I play always as mdps, not tank. I hate guarding an mdps because he almost killing me and we are not sure if we get heals from dps healer That's why I have better comfort as mdps because Im not able to doing anything except imitate tank...because usually we have 1-2 tanks on 12 players in pug SC...I know tanks are stronger than mdps, the most because they have shield and may almost ignoring enemy fire + 5k armour and may almost ignoring physical damages. But not many players want play tank because they will must guard someone...On destro it's bit different but because their tanks are much fun than mdps. When I play order tank, usually I guard healer because I get heals from him. It's fair deal.

[th3gatekeeper]

i play a tank and i love to guard folks that now what are they doing, same goes for the ones that dont...but that is my job and i love it. i dont need an incentive for doing it.

those tanks that dont guard either dont know their class or they just dont give a damn...reading tooltips isnt that hard

so its two things i guess: if u hate guard mechanic dont play a tank or if u really want to, play a dps tank and dont whine about low dmg/surviveability

Congrats. We have finally found him! The search is over guys. The only pug tank in the game who uses guard. I knew he would make an appearance in this thread eventually. To be real, we are the exception to the rule. For every tank that uses guard there are 10 more that don't... Go play a mdps or rdps and you will feel the pain... I leveled to 40 and rr40 on a Mara in pug SCs and can count on one hand the number of times guard was cast on me, let alone ignoring that tank even staying within range.... It's why I don't even bother playing my Mara at all and stick to chosen or BG...

i always que solo, so i guess he means how to make guard to work with no brain effort involved?

like make it an permanent auto acivating aura with 300ft range?

If you read I proposed a few ideas, none of which I'm committed to... One is permanent aura guard and retain 30ft range or even drop it to 25 ft. Still requires active thought to use... but not too much effort in "swapping" as well as allows your party to have an active role in obtaining guard rather than having no control at all over it... If aoe any member can choose to run to the tank and get it, rather than hope the tank takes time to cast it on you...

Another is to make it an aoe and almost work like a "detaunt" for your group. Where it has an uptime and downtime or at least an uptime with a CD... Almost like the M3 that tanks have (forget the name ATM).

At this point, I'm just gonna stop. If anyone cares to increase population, this is something that should be looked at. Otherwise RoR will remain a niche game that people will pick up for a few months, quit, and come back to each release of new gear... It'll be something that people can't play in short periods of time (like 20 or 30min) which is what leads to people not bothering logging in unless coordinated play times for longer play sessions... Which is clearly not what the.majority of gamers want in games for EVERY play session.

I have interviewed many people who have quit and have quit myself several times... And it usually stems around "this game sucks for solo play" and further discussion around "why do you say that" 9 times out of 10 involves "tanks not using guard".

I doubt the DEVs even see the problem. But if you look hard enough and care to talk to players, it will surface.