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MSH needs some attention

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xanderous
Posts: 465

MSH needs some attention

Post#1 » Wed Jun 17, 2020 8:40 am

Will we ever see the broken animations and easily interrupted abilities of the MSH get some attention. Specifically the ones i take issue with are...

Really bad gas : 20s cooldown, 1s cast time, duration 6s: I'd really like the cast time and the cool down to be adjusted, it is very easily interrupted leaving you too long without being able to cast it again, secondly 6s duration seems to be quite short considering its damage is quite low in comparison to other classes output.

Big Bouncin: 8s cooldown, duration 3s: Same issue, easily interrupted and its not spamable due to 8s cooldown, many other melee classes have spamable one ability for aoe but if denied use of the ability you are forced to wait too long to be able to reuse it.

Outta my way: is channelled ability and can be interrupted by even slightly running over a barely raised bit of terrain, this needs changed to fall in line with other charge abilities.

Potential class solution for my cool down grievance is to give squig leap some kind of cooldown reduction proc on self to encourage more of a combo style of play example being an ability like...

"Were's ma waaaagh" When using squig leap you gain 3s cooldown duration, if bad gas is used the duration continues another 3s, if big bouncin is used after all 3 abilities cooldowns are reset, if either ability is interrupted, most recent casted ability cooldown is reset"

This is just an example so please don't take it as "the solution" just wish to highlight the issues

Just my thoughts, i really enjoy the class but it is definitely under performing when compared to other classes in the same field, class does not even have a CC break ability, some stats don't convert over to melee armor like "reduce chance to dodge" to "reduced chance to parry" Ballistic skill tactic not converting to strength and only good damage morale is M4 which is great when you have it whilst others classes have great M2's so their their overall ability damage output should compensate for that.

But however this is not a please buff MSH thread, I just hope that devs have not forgotten about the class and could please take a look at the issues i highlighted
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Manatikik
Posts: 1172

Re: MSH needs some attention

Post#2 » Wed Jun 17, 2020 8:53 am

xanderous wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 8:40 am
Will we ever see the broken animations and easily interrupted abilities of the MSH get some attention. Specifically the ones i take issue with are...

Really bad gas : 20s cooldown, 1s cast time, duration 6s: I'd really like the cast time and the cool down to be adjusted, it is very easily interrupted leaving you too long without being able to cast it again, secondly 6s duration seems to be quite short considering its damage is quite low in comparison to other classes output.

Big Bouncin: 8s cooldown, duration 3s: Same issue, easily interrupted and its not spamable due to 8s cooldown, many other melee classes have spamable one ability for aoe but if denied use of the ability you are forced to wait too long to be able to reuse it.

Outta my way: is channelled ability and can be interrupted by even slightly running over a barely raised bit of terrain, this needs changed to fall in line with other charge abilities.

Potential class solution for my cool down grievance is to give squig leap some kind of cooldown reduction proc on self to encourage more of a combo style of play example being an ability like...

"Were's ma waaaagh" When using squig leap you gain 3s cooldown duration, if bad gas is used the duration continues another 3s, if big bouncin is used after all 3 abilities cooldowns are reset, if either ability is interrupted, most recent casted ability cooldown is reset"

This is just an example so please don't take it as "the solution" just wish to highlight the issues

Just my thoughts, i really enjoy the class but it is definitely under performing when compared to other classes in the same field, class does not even have a CC break ability, some stats don't convert over to melee armor like "reduce chance to dodge" to "reduced chance to parry" Ballistic skill tactic not converting to strength and only good damage morale is M4 which is great when you have it whilst others classes have great M2's so their their overall ability damage output should compensate for that.

But however this is not a please buff MSH thread, I just hope that devs have not forgotten about the class and could please take a look at the issues i highlighted
Saying MSH is anything but a phenomenal DPS class is just straight arguing in bad faith dude...

While its true some overlooked factors need to be addresses (some of the Assault converts need to happen (not Masterful Aim cause thats just a dumb idea) but it needs to be tied into the pet more than Squig Armor since the pet is the class mechanic and NOT squig armor regardless what a lot of MSH like to pretend). Another thing that needs to happen is enable some of the Path of Stabbin' abilities that are not available to Squig Armor (why that was ever designed I will never know). MSH is in a FANTASTIC spot over all and none of the ability changes (nor anything else added to Squig Leap except a CD at all times (Pounce on WL as well ofc) is needed to alter their nutty damage output in AoE) needs to be adjusted in terms of damage; they have great AoE pressure, amazing utility, a self pump that leads to a 2400 BASELINE m4, and a decent ST spec - there's nothing else you can really ask for except to fight NPC mobs instead of other players.
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xanderous
Posts: 465

Re: MSH needs some attention

Post#3 » Wed Jun 17, 2020 9:28 am

Manatikik wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 8:53 am

Saying MSH is anything but a phenomenal DPS class is just straight arguing in bad faith dude...
Nice rant, does not address any of the main points about the buggy and easily interrupted abilities which interfere with the apparently phenomenal damage pressure they do, i donno what you are even doing here, talkin about people ignoring that it is a pet class, why....
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Starkus RR68 BG Snaptz RR83 SH Plagueis RR81 Magus Alec RR75 Engie Sourgazt RR60 Shaman
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Cyrinael
Posts: 10

Re: MSH needs some attention

Post#4 » Wed Jun 17, 2020 1:36 pm

How the **** does everyday another "Buff SH" thread come up. I would wish for other classes to have as many ambitious players aswell...

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wargrimnir
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Posts: 6738
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Re: MSH needs some attention

Post#5 » Wed Jun 17, 2020 2:23 pm

Cyrinael wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 1:36 pm
How the **** does everyday another "Buff SH" thread come up. I would wish for other classes to have as many ambitious players aswell...
We stated in recent patch notes that Squig Herder would be next up for a balance pass once we're finished with SW, so everyone is posting their wish lists. It's kind of expected, but a lot of it is way over the top probably. To be honest, it's just going to make the whole balancing part take a bit longer as we need to sift through piles of relatively low effort feedback to find something to work with, and then squish it into cohesive specs that have some thematic semblance, without being a pile of horribly broken overpowered toys.
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M0rw47h
Posts: 589

Re: MSH needs some attention

Post#6 » Wed Jun 17, 2020 2:40 pm

xanderous wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 9:28 am
Manatikik wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 8:53 am

Saying MSH is anything but a phenomenal DPS class is just straight arguing in bad faith dude...
Nice rant, does not address any of the main points about the buggy and easily interrupted abilities which interfere with the apparently phenomenal damage pressure they do, i donno what you are even doing here, talkin about people ignoring that it is a pet class, why....
You already got party wide coldown reductions on two very popular classes.
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Illuminati
Posts: 172

Re: MSH needs some attention

Post#7 » Wed Jun 17, 2020 3:06 pm

I've played a mSH to above 80 in all areas of gameplay. I would request the following,

[NERF]
-Modify [Territorial Aggression] to reduce the cooldown of Squig Leap by 5 seconds (to 5 seconds). *doing the same to WL

[IMPROVE]
-Improve the AA damage and guarantee the hit on the second weapon while in squig form. Additionally, grant the +10% parry, its not working.
-Make [Cut Ya!] work in Melee form (it's in the Big Bouncing Tree)
-Make [Run Away] work in Melee form
-Increase the health of the squig pets to 1/2 or equal to WL pets to promote build diversity
-Make the squig pets immune to AoE morale damage like WL pets
-Give the squig pets reduced AoE damage, like WL pets

[FIX]
-Actually make the speed boost work after leaping (it does not)
-Make the Squig Armor buff to Armor an amount instead of % so the SH doesn't get double impacted by base armor debuffs of WL pets (Shred), etc. without nerfing the total armor.

Premise of these changes: Slight reduction in mobility (unlimited leaps are stupid), improved ST damage, improved pet gameplay, and fixing abilities to work/matter.
————————————————
Destro: Killamanjaro (80+ Choppa) / Killamanjaroo (70+ DoK) / Unsworn (70+ Chosen) / Illuminatii (60+ Blackguard) / Killaman (80+ Squig)
Order: ?

Bugs reported: 6

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nebelwerfer
Legacy RR80
Posts: 361

Re: MSH needs some attention

Post#8 » Wed Jun 17, 2020 3:20 pm

wargrimnir wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 2:23 pm
Cyrinael wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 1:36 pm
How the **** does everyday another "Buff SH" thread come up. I would wish for other classes to have as many ambitious players aswell...
We stated in recent patch notes that Squig Herder would be next up for a balance pass once we're finished with SW, so everyone is posting their wish lists. It's kind of expected, but a lot of it is way over the top probably. To be honest, it's just going to make the whole balancing part take a bit longer as we need to sift through piles of relatively low effort feedback to find something to work with, and then squish it into cohesive specs that have some thematic semblance, without being a pile of horribly broken overpowered toys.
What SH needs is a viable ranged spec that can deal decent aoe dmg, which atm is impossible. Splintering arrows tactic from the right tree is ****.

It really should be buffed and then i would be quite happy with rSH aoe dmg / st dmg viability. easy peasey 8-)

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nuadarstark
Posts: 151

Re: MSH needs some attention

Post#9 » Wed Jun 17, 2020 3:33 pm

I understand that rSH needs some good loving, but now people are saying to also make mSH better? Like what? Boost to what, stratosphere? It's already one of the best builds destro has and one of the most popular ones.
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Illuminati
Posts: 172

Re: MSH needs some attention

Post#10 » Wed Jun 17, 2020 3:43 pm

nuadarstark wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 3:33 pm
I understand that rSH needs some good loving, but now people are saying to also make mSH better? Like what? Boost to what, stratosphere? It's already one of the best builds destro has and one of the most popular ones.
Ever played one? It’s not like a WL that has every tool/role viability...

Do you think aSW needed buffs like crosscut, etc.?

The mSH suffers from snare/roots, crappy AA damage, armor debuffs destroy its resiliency, few abilities and build synergy. The effect you see is a mobile AoE class, which is outclassed by Slayers w/ ID, spin2win WLs, BWs. The mSH is basic and effective, but can use some attention.
————————————————
Destro: Killamanjaro (80+ Choppa) / Killamanjaroo (70+ DoK) / Unsworn (70+ Chosen) / Illuminatii (60+ Blackguard) / Killaman (80+ Squig)
Order: ?

Bugs reported: 6

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