The State of RvR and the Elephant in the Room

[Cornerback]

Great post. I love your ideas and you hit the nail on the head. Why bother with actual RVR fights when the content is locked in cities.

But you can still do stuff as groups, just two nights ago I broke a siege with a 10man (only 2healers) and a 4-5 people jumping from the walls.
You can still fight the zerg and win, the change to the keep doors is a good thing since it stopped that lazy strategy of just suiciding on the ram or suiciding near the keep just to get a ress inside. Stop running with pugs and organize yourselves, honestly it's not that hard to run a group in discord, sure you'll fail a lot of times, out of 20 fights you might get 2-3 good ones and the rest is a stomp either way.

Of cource you can do this. But it is not rewarding. How much does this help you with your progression towards endgame gear?

I'd prefer invader/royal drops from high RR players in RVR or quests for invader/royals (stuff like kill 1k enemies in rvr etc) over doing cities anytime. Heck, I hate city sieges. They are mostly boring and onesided and always the same.

[Wam]

people complain if not enough cities, people complain if too many cities

Rvr is what you make of it, the issue is lack of desire/incentive or organisation for underdog to perform... The campaign is still finding its place after recent changes, sometimes there is a rank 4 or 5 city... they a bit more rare... maybe improving reward for them to encourage defending and ranking up city more than current not too bothered about defending just want a city any rank and get rewards.

Sov medals dropping in rvr is something dev's have been firmly against, and it will make cities almost irrelevant, they have tried to find middle ground and have improved this with bags and increased reward which i think was a good and fair change. Sov medals from kills would be great (encouraged fighting) but people really shouldn't need that incentive to fight, the city loggers once they got their gear what are they going to do with nothing left to farm? for power leveling alts it would be very nice but pretty sure in dev mindsight it would be semi "abused/exploited" I.e leveling curve way too fast compared to the status quo where you have to put in some effort and grind it over period of time... in current method from playing orvr hard you can still get decent amount of medals if you just focus one character only.

The morale nerf change stops underdogs blowing up bigger numbers, the no instant respawn stops the lemming defence... people could still stall sieges but usually lacking motivation/organisation too... the Battlefield objectives should play a more important role to allow underdog pull numbers away from the zerg... zerg run supplies rank 2 pvdoor keep is the problem of orvr and bo's being the after thought when it don't matter keep already lost.

[Jagosa]

Yes.

[witc0m]

RvR right now is just Order constantly pushing relatively defenseless zones to a stream of 1* or 2* city sieges that Destro will dominate 75% of the instances. It's like clockwork.

I think City Sieges are a totally garbage end-game mechanic anyway. We can fight for hours on end, pushing through numerous Tiers and unique zones, fighting hundreds of players against hundreds of players, and the culmination of all that fighting are small-scale instanced 24v24 scenarios? That's just stupid and entirely anti-climactic.

Maybe I'm in the minority, but I think the game should just do away entirely with city sieges in their current form. Spend time on the oRvR lakes and alter/add content that makes the fighting more dynamic. Change the mechanics in how they work, add towers and other BO's or mini-keeps that you have to hold at the same time of pushing the larger keeps. Incentivize running supplies and give greater rewards for actually killing other players. Try adding something that encourages the reward gains for running in smaller groups to try to limit the constant warband roaming action. I don't even know if the devs have liberty to add stuff like this, but they spent all that time on an arena that nobody uses, I'd think they could change the dynamics of the oRvR lakes.

Or, if you have to keep city, make it a 48v48 or something. Also, limit the amount of premade players that can enter into the city. In a regular scenario, a single premade group can only constitute 25% of the total potential player pool. Said another way, you can only que as a 6-man premade into scenarios. Sure, you might get lucky and get with 3 other premades too, but in general they do that to prevent the entire scenario being a single premade group that will destroy the other teams over and over.

So why do we allow city to be an entirely premade group? Because it's "end game"? I say make it 48v48 where the max premade that can join is a 12-man or something. You may get with other premades, you may get with pugs, who knows.

I might get shut down for these ideas, I'm just thinking out loud and randomly spit balling. But I think we can all agree that RvR currently is a mess and the "end game" is not in a good state at all.

[TreefAM]

Man order nerds trying their best to advocate for a more pug friendly approach, just organize lmao

[Sarnai]

Bringing more value to BOs during sieges would be a great thing. Something like if the defenders hold all 4 BOs, no damage to door/lord.

[wargrimnir]

Bringing more value to BOs during sieges would be a great thing. Something like if the defenders hold all 4 BOs, no damage to door/lord.

This is already a thing. Holding BO's empowers your keep lord. It's not 0 damage, but it's a significant reduction.

[Baaldr]

Very Good post OP, maybe Also have royals only be lootable in rvr for rr75+ players?

[Acidic]

Bringing more value to BOs during sieges would be a great thing. Something like if the defenders hold all 4 BOs, no damage to door/lord.

This is already a thing. Holding BO's empowers your keep lord. It's not 0 damage, but it's a significant reduction.

Think this is the problem, there is a mechanic but it’s nit significant enough , it can be ignored with minimal impact. He won’t wipe u while tanked so funnel and PVE lord down work. For a mechanic to work and have an impact it can not be ignorable.

[wargrimnir]

Bringing more value to BOs during sieges would be a great thing. Something like if the defenders hold all 4 BOs, no damage to door/lord.

This is already a thing. Holding BO's empowers your keep lord. It's not 0 damage, but it's a significant reduction.

Think this is the problem, there is a mechanic but it’s nit significant enough , it can be ignored with minimal impact. He won’t wipe u while tanked so funnel and PVE lord down work. For a mechanic to work and have an impact it can not be ignorable.

It is the difference between wiping a lord in 2 minutes, and taking 15 minutes to grind him down. If the defending realm isn't in a position to challenge the lord room, then it really doesn't matter how many BO's they hold.