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blondgelockt
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Posts: 47

Re: SoR change

Post#151 » Tue Dec 01, 2020 4:26 pm

Xergon wrote:
Tue Dec 01, 2020 12:06 pm
Imagine that RvR was played w/o SoR addon for over 4 years, and no one ever complained during that time. Action was spicy and unpredictable.
Yeah, ZonePop and questions about zone population ("pop?" "pop?" "anyone got pop?") didn't exist at all. And surely not on live. Sure, sure.

I have a better idea: Just ban pugging altogether if you all got such a hatred for us. Devs said several times they despise the pug mentality after all, so why not just do it all the way? Numbers in RvR can't get much lower anymore anyway. I'm quitting too.

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Lithenir
Posts: 262

Re: SoR change

Post#152 » Tue Dec 01, 2020 5:28 pm

Fenris78 wrote:
Tue Dec 01, 2020 2:29 pm
Gurf wrote:
Tue Dec 01, 2020 12:14 pm
The way around that is that you look at AAO, then you do a Player search for the friendly players in the zone , from that you know roughly how many opposition are in the zone, or at least you know if there are about 10 or about 100

Otherwise, let SoR have a search function with one click on the zone you're in, like did the old Zonepop, but only displaying your Realm population.
Less ressource intensive (less real-time requests from everyone), and you'll have to do it actively (and being in zone) to see numbers.
Just use ZonePop addon.... It still searches for your own faction. Problem solved :P

Edit: Just checked. Doesn't really work ^^

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Xergon
Posts: 650

Re: SoR change

Post#153 » Tue Dec 01, 2020 6:39 pm

blondgelockt wrote:
Tue Dec 01, 2020 4:26 pm
Xergon wrote:
Tue Dec 01, 2020 12:06 pm
Imagine that RvR was played w/o SoR addon for over 4 years, and no one ever complained during that time. Action was spicy and unpredictable.
Yeah, ZonePop and questions about zone population ("pop?" "pop?" "anyone got pop?") didn't exist at all. And surely not on live. Sure, sure.

I have a better idea: Just ban pugging altogether if you all got such a hatred for us. Devs said several times they despise the pug mentality after all, so why not just do it all the way? Numbers in RvR can't get much lower anymore anyway. I'm quitting too.
I completely do not understand what is ur issue? Questions about pop is what it suppose to be to create communication and cooperation between players within same realm, is it not ? And about PUGs im not saying they doing bad thing, they are almost ONLY reason why u having action in RvR atm, the issue is that PREMADE groups have no incentive to make those things because its not worth the effort neither its
smart to be the 1st who start siege and expose urself to attacks...
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blondgelockt
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Posts: 47

Re: SoR change

Post#154 » Tue Dec 01, 2020 6:50 pm

Xergon wrote:
Tue Dec 01, 2020 6:39 pm
I completely do not understand what is ur issue?
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TreefAM
Posts: 519

Re: SoR change

Post#155 » Tue Dec 01, 2020 6:51 pm

Order players quiting because they can't see numbers from Altdorf, can't make this **** up

Fenris78
Posts: 211

Re: SoR change

Post#156 » Tue Dec 01, 2020 7:01 pm

Xergon wrote:
Tue Dec 01, 2020 6:39 pm
I completely do not understand what is ur issue? Questions about pop is what it suppose to be to create communication and cooperation between players within same realm, is it not ? And about PUGs im not saying they doing bad thing, they are almost ONLY reason why u having action in RvR atm, the issue is that PREMADE groups have no incentive to make those things because its not worth the effort neither its
smart to be the 1st who start siege and expose urself to attacks...
Issues are :
- Pugs are not organized enough to start communicating their moves, let alone numbers since they obviously dont have time/ressources/manpower to get quick and accurate infos.
- Warbands are communicating into their wbs mostly, being in discord or not, and barely make the effort of broadcasting their moves and pop in /1, let alone /t4.
- Informations about numbers in chat are either cumbersome, cluttering the channels wich already contains barely enough space for meaningful infos, like WB recruitment and moves/sieges, countdowns, etc.
- Any information will be instantly obsolete the time needed for others to react ; for instance, knowing that X enemy is fighting here and need backup will most probably be too late anyway, not to mention refresh rate of battles on minimap wich dont allow for accurate reading (swords everywhere for some minutes, for X seconds of engagments).

By knowing numbers of our faction and/or indicator of % ppl fighting in each zone :
- Allow for commitment, either in term of scale (my group is X members, we want big fights or small ones, we can chosse instantly), for solo players, small scale and wb altogether
- Avoid clutter of the chat needlessly constantly asking "where is action", "pop ?", and so on, letting meaningful informations be readable (thus allowing efficient coms for wb leaders who dont have to spam their msg every few seconds, for instance)
- Make less unnessessary moves between tp (wich are limited and/or timed), saving both money and time for more fight, commitment and action in the lakes, instead of afking waiting for infos, or blindlessly going into traps/zergs/gankers/etc.
- Allow for tactical move and communication between different zones (for instance knowing that XX allies are in Y zone, you can send a call to help knowing you can count on those XX peeps, instead of presuming that every others are in the same zone, wich is mostly not the case).

All we need is a somehow relevant and efficient (quick and inobstrusive) indicator of how many ALLIES are in zone at a given time. It doesnt have to be real-time or very accurate, but such an indicator is a real time/chat-saver who will help everyone.

More time fighting, less time asking, would you please ?

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wargrimnir
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Re: SoR change

Post#157 » Tue Dec 01, 2020 9:24 pm

Not that I want to stop the conversation by providing any real expectations or anything, but we are planning on moving forward with the partial population tracker that will show the size of the force by organizational name rather than by number. groups/warbands/warhost etc. It seems like a good compromise that alleviates the need to find the most populated zone while also taking care of the concerns about population level hyperfocus impacting RvR decisions when it's probably unnecessary.
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PlagueMonk
Posts: 73

Re: SoR change

Post#158 » Wed Dec 02, 2020 7:28 pm

Maybe I'm too late to add my voice to the conversation but.......I personally like the change in principle. I do not however like the current execution.

I feel that you should always know your exact numbers but the enemy number should remain hidden until you start encountering them. The longer you are exposed the more accurate that number.

Ex. you know the Order Pop for a zone is 95 but have no clue what Dest are out there so it would look like......95 - ???. As you start to encounter Dest that changes.

95 - ???
95 - PRE (presence - you have encountered a few here or there)
95 - WB (so 18 - 36 ish)
95 - ZRG (multiple WBs)
95 - 102 (you are at a siege and can gauge the enemy strength pretty accurately now)

then if you part ways those exact numbers should go back to generalizations.
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Nekkma
Posts: 601

Re: SoR change

Post#159 » Wed Dec 02, 2020 7:45 pm

Are people really upset that they cannot find their own zerg without these addons?

I have played without them all my time on ror and it is extremely simple to find the zonen with actions.

1. Type .rvr to see status of zone. 2 star zone is pretty much the only active ones outside primetime.
2. Confirm which 2 star zone is active by pressin ”m”. Crossed swords show up on the zone with battles in them.
3. Open wb meny and see in which zone friendly wbs are located.
4. Ask in guildchat. You can do this right when you log on ”Hey, any groups going and where’s the action?”

After I log in it takes me less than a minute to find out which zone are hot.
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Beara
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Re: SoR change

Post#160 » Thu Dec 03, 2020 2:01 pm

I agree 100% it’s Fenris.

And I’m glad that the devs decided to compromise on the issue, lately I’ve been logging in, spamming /a /5 for something to do and logging out because there’s nothing or everyone is just zerging back and forth of the war camps in a zone

The “logging off out of boredom” hit real hard. I just hope it’s not to late honestly. It was a real bad time to screw around with quality of life just As wow came out.

Personally I don’t see the downside of having the population numbers. Everyone is doing magic and **** and figuring out how many people are around is the feat that can’t be done? Just doesn’t make sense.
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