Recent Topics

Ads

Any ideas to bring back players?

Let's talk about... everything else
Panel
Posts: 82

Re: Any ideas to bring back players?

Post#211 » Mon Jun 27, 2022 8:29 am

Start at the bottom and work up with balancing so that the gaps get smaller - fix the issues that plague engineer/magus alike then bring engi up to the level of magus and balance is closer- then move on to the next under performers - rinse repeat

Ads
kakaonutella
Posts: 7

Re: Any ideas to bring back players?

Post#212 » Mon Jun 27, 2022 10:07 am

Just my few cents:

I just logged back In and saw the new token-gear system...I am quite negatively surprised.
I remember when I was happy that I farmed one or two items of my gear and I knew I will stick to them for longer. I had to choose which ones etc. to pick, what to mix...and now I just need to farm a lot of these crests to get as much as possible and just buy that. This makes me ask a question - If back in the day it was hard to get these crests, and I felt so rewarded that I got a piece of gear, isn't this destroying everything because all you need is turbo grind of a single currency? Might be wrong here, I didn't test that one out but I just logged in and got like 3k of them and I am literally able to upgrade my gear a single tier up, because my renown allows that and currency is...well just lying there

Secondly, this connects to my other point. I remember a lot of negativity towards balance in favor of Order, which made them stomp 70% of time Destro. When I brought here friends back in the day, they all went order, because it was playable, so I kinda lost them. Now, when I'm, back, I brought more friends, and in first few days we also saw a train stomp on RvR, and a bit less on SC. So question is - Was this somehow balanced out? My personal experience was that if a Destro tries hard to push it to the limits, they get nerf, while Order wasn't trying hard and was stomping anyway so...I quite think the same way about balance. Which leads to that currency farm, I saw that you get more if you win a SC for example, which if what I've said is indeed true, it boosts Order even more and creates gear gaps.

Third point as of bringing players is some sort of meta killing. In various MMOs, meta kills the game because it is either you play this way, or you don't play because no one wants you.

Did you know that choppa for example, has two neat healing cuts and shiet tons of single target dmg if he uses 2h weapon? Is anyone promoting that gameplay? Flanking? funzies? no. All you get is people stick into big groups and just do positon war being mostly afk under a castle till gate falls, or fight a position war over terrain. How you want to bring a new players if they are asked to play one build that is decent, because people play around one strategy in which most other builds doesn't work? It's a player driven game, players should promote other game styles. How about a flanking team of stunties or orcs that focus on getting this or that, healers, backdoors...anything. I barely seen that for a year or two while I was here before.

This comes to my last point - Promotion. I bet fun videos, that contain extremely awesome WH Lore as an addition, to when someone talks and shows some FUN tactics, FUN gameplay, explains classes in a FUN way, shows that there are gear choices, how skill looks, how places look and so on. That would be beneficial. I just watch some YT videos and they seem like they would be recorded when the game was just released, back all those years, old minded.


Two additional thing that I thought about while writing this:
1. WH world is awesome, I've went to do most of Orc and Dwarf Campaign and I think that expanding PVE in own, unique way would be great too, just please do not abandon PVP for this. If you will polish PVP, tons of people, just like now, will be only for it and game will thrive. Then, going to PVE would be a good Idea I guess.

2. I understand that game might have some old engine and making cooler looking spells can kill the server, but perhaps there is a way to make it hm, reworked only for people that turn it on? so if I would like to have a cooler looking Sorc spell, only I would see that graphic, so perhaps it wouldn't impact other players that didn't turn that graphic on? Just thinking out loud.

User avatar
Earthcake
Posts: 251

Re: Any ideas to bring back players?

Post#213 » Mon Jun 27, 2022 10:12 am

Panel wrote: Mon Jun 27, 2022 8:29 am Start at the bottom and work up with balancing so that the gaps get smaller - fix the issues that plague engineer/magus alike then bring engi up to the level of magus and balance is closer- then move on to the next under performers - rinse repeat
I don't think balance or imbalance is the real problem here.
There are big balance problem yes, but for exemple, my favourite toon is my IB, IB are complete garbage atm so I don't play him, but I didn't leave due to that, I can play other toons.

One thing that bothers me tho, and almost made me quit is the fact that I don't understand the big changes.

For exemple the GCD change to solve a problem that doesn't exists.
Timestamp ? What timestamp lol ? Play with healers that can dispell, with tanks that can guardswap and/or use a shield spell to save your ass, play near a wall to use LoS, there are many ways to prevent timestamping.
Will it SOMETIMES happen ? Yes, keyword sometimes, like not often at all. But only if you know how to play...
So break many aspects of the game to solve a problem that doesn't exist in the 1st place, ofc people are frutrated about it.

Same for the Nerfed Buttons thing, if you cannot beat people using it, then play better and you'll beat them...
So again, a non problem, upset half the server cause you are not good enough to beat them.

And several other changes that were less discussed but are as obscure as these ones.

It really seems like the big changes that upset many people are carried by a minority not understanding the game, and that's scary. That prolly made many quit.

User avatar
Haojin
Posts: 1062

Re: Any ideas to bring back players?

Post#214 » Mon Jun 27, 2022 12:24 pm

Brand new balance changes or adding new abilities to the game are probably the least motivational element for bringing back players. It's comical that the thread becomes "balance whine support group" quite fast. The only way to increase population is by increasing the quality of playability of the game. Despite some big-brained focus group members advocating that major balance changes (either over buffing or butchering to the ground) going to cause a massive population increase but it's simply wrong. Also, note that I don't think the people running the server care about population decrease that much (more players, more problems). Otherwise, they'd rip themselves when they lose almost every peon-wave refugee. Anyway, here's my 2c's:

RVR Rework:

1-Open RVR needs a non-absurd rework that doesn't need to be radical (aka lakes with 30+ BO in it; a terrible copycat attempt from ESO). The majority of the players stay on the server because of the ORVR, and the current ORVR system is absurdly boring and repetitive. For new players, it might be interesting for a while but the hype dies down quite fast.

Open RVR should cater to every scale of war while spreading the fight all around the map "naturally". I admit it's not an easy task but leaving it as it is while more players burning out and never coming back is just sad. Dalen shared an accurate population density map in the past and it's truly disappointing why the ORVR fruitless at the moment.

2-Campaign needs to be meaningful, players need to be motivated to push the campaign further to achieve something. To achieve goals players tend to organize which means players being in guilds, more guilds more competition, more competition more motivation to keep playing. The current scheduled campaign is totally against the spirit of RVR. It should be in-between new and old system. Players need to be in charge of how the campaign going to act. At the moment, there is no real reason to put effort into the campaign, the final goal going to happen anyway.

Reverting Major Changes:

1- Banning ancient add-ons like nerfed buttons without replacing it with a non-harmful and functioning form was a mistake.

2- GCD change was necessary or not but it's not logical to break the way players play the game after years and yet we didn't experience the gain from it apart from sour gameplay.

Avoiding Creating Abominations:

Major class re-works without actual testing by in-action proven players are going to create community flak. Small tweaks are always a better way to find ideal balance. With that, you are not going to break the way players play the game and find a middle spot. I am wondering who asked those:

-1st edition of ASW which can double initiative debuff.
-SNB DOK/WP which can dish high amount of damage and healing at the same time.
-SH that functioning like a swiss knife with an absurd damage boost.
-1st edition of Guardian WL which the pet is enough to kill a player by itself.

All those major changes caused problems except for the biased players who are pushing their agenda in a cunning way.

Leveling & New Player Experience:

1-Leveling should be in a timeframe that allows players to understand the basics of their class. It should be super speedy compared to the current one. Can even consider adding fast leveling spots in active RVR lakes same like the old days, specifically on the most unwanted areas to spread the density. Or giving juicy XP for the RVR activities like running supplies, carrying siege engines or taking the most unwanted BOs, etc. Options are limitless.

In the end, being stuck on lower levels without getting real benefit for the end game is just a waste of time.
Guildmaster of Phalanx

K8P - Karak Norn

Shogun4138
Posts: 119

Re: Any ideas to bring back players?

Post#215 » Mon Jun 27, 2022 3:33 pm

Open lotd or make it so players can open lotd. Add farmable mobs to said zone.

Add new ways to attack keeps or defend.

Change BO's so they need to be held while taking keeps.

If keep lords die, there should be a way to recapture keep. And flip the zone back.
Gogo 80we
Mudflinga 81rSH
Zenzo chosen**

User avatar
Tesq
Posts: 5704

Re: Any ideas to bring back players?

Post#216 » Mon Jun 27, 2022 5:57 pm

Spoiler:
Haojin wrote: Mon Jun 27, 2022 12:24 pm Brand new balance changes or adding new abilities to the game are probably the least motivational element for bringing back players. It's comical that the thread becomes "balance whine support group" quite fast. The only way to increase population is by increasing the quality of playability of the game. Despite some big-brained focus group members advocating that major balance changes (either over buffing or butchering to the ground) going to cause a massive population increase but it's simply wrong. Also, note that I don't think the people running the server care about population decrease that much (more players, more problems). Otherwise, they'd rip themselves when they lose almost every peon-wave refugee. Anyway, here's my 2c's:

RVR Rework:

1-Open RVR needs a non-absurd rework that doesn't need to be radical (aka lakes with 30+ BO in it; a terrible copycat attempt from ESO). The majority of the players stay on the server because of the ORVR, and the current ORVR system is absurdly boring and repetitive. For new players, it might be interesting for a while but the hype dies down quite fast.

Open RVR should cater to every scale of war while spreading the fight all around the map "naturally". I admit it's not an easy task but leaving it as it is while more players burning out and never coming back is just sad. Dalen shared an accurate population density map in the past and it's truly disappointing why the ORVR fruitless at the moment.

2-Campaign needs to be meaningful, players need to be motivated to push the campaign further to achieve something. To achieve goals players tend to organize which means players being in guilds, more guilds more competition, more competition more motivation to keep playing. The current scheduled campaign is totally against the spirit of RVR. It should be in-between new and old system. Players need to be in charge of how the campaign going to act. At the moment, there is no real reason to put effort into the campaign, the final goal going to happen anyway.

Reverting Major Changes:

1- Banning ancient add-ons like nerfed buttons without replacing it with a non-harmful and functioning form was a mistake.

2- GCD change was necessary or not but it's not logical to break the way players play the game after years and yet we didn't experience the gain from it apart from sour gameplay.

Avoiding Creating Abominations:

Major class re-works without actual testing by in-action proven players are going to create community flak. Small tweaks are always a better way to find ideal balance. With that, you are not going to break the way players play the game and find a middle spot. I am wondering who asked those:

-1st edition of ASW which can double initiative debuff.
-SNB DOK/WP which can dish high amount of damage and healing at the same time.
-SH that functioning like a swiss knife with an absurd damage boost.
-1st edition of Guardian WL which the pet is enough to kill a player by itself.

All those major changes caused problems except for the biased players who are pushing their agenda in a cunning way.

Leveling & New Player Experience:

1-Leveling should be in a timeframe that allows players to understand the basics of their class. It should be super speedy compared to the current one. Can even consider adding fast leveling spots in active RVR lakes same like the old days, specifically on the most unwanted areas to spread the density. Or giving juicy XP for the RVR activities like running supplies, carrying siege engines or taking the most unwanted BOs, etc. Options are limitless.

In the end, being stuck on lower levels without getting real benefit for the end game is just a waste of time.
this can be summ into "ppl that know how to develop game designign the game aswell", design and coding are 2 different things. Designer need to keep in account fun, ppl beahviur, gameplay geography problems, if ttk is too high or low and if the game should revolve more around dmg /cc or a mix etc; dev need to be able to code it, they should work in tandem a tecnician and a designer with designer on top of the tecnician....not just 1 ppl since it can programm that it also design.... how can you expect someone that spend most of its time coding but then to know the problems of the game? how can you pretend someone that use most of its time to play, to be also able to code?

but we always get the same asnwer no one is avaiable to code for some one else vision...then the project is dead, its not voluntary job cuz you dont want to do what is REQUIRED to be done. If you like the game and you have spare time then put it to other's use, if you pretend that you should decide how to use your time in this house then you just gona be a hindrance for the project.
Image

User avatar
Undeadfiend
Posts: 26

Re: Any ideas to bring back players?

Post#217 » Tue Jun 28, 2022 10:03 am

Yeah, FIX BO PUNT PLEASE...THE ONE THAT WAS BROKEN after the ap patch...IF fixed I will return

User avatar
wonshot
Posts: 1101

Re: Any ideas to bring back players?

Post#218 » Tue Jun 28, 2022 12:02 pm

Hao's post hits most of it imho.

Newplayer experience with some T1 tutorials about how RoR pvp is different (no enemycasttimers, take on a cc system, interrupt and immunities, guard meta and how to break it etc etc)
Along with build defining abilities and careers getting acces to their stuff around the same time (why is group heal lvl 20 when you get to face full aoe spamming enemies at lvl 16 bolster etc)

Identifying that most of the players coming in first time are drawn by nostalgia from AoR, warhammer universe fans, or coming in to try a good performance largescale pvp RvR game on a market where such a thing doesnt exsist in any live mmo server to this extend. And then give them a product that will not make them lose interest with a barebone campaign that doesnt make sense any more.

New scenarios & cosmetics lately have been amazing! but the core gameplay loop needs the attention, desperately!
The campaign is the least appealing it has ever been, the Battleobjective situation from last year didnt get any changes so far and while there has been some really good changes to close the gear gab between newplayers, catchup mechanics with gearing on wards overlapping, the players will still burn out when they start treading the replay loop of taking keeps in a campaign which lost its crownprice motivation.

The very skeleton of ror pvp is solid, with pvptanking, morale building, shared ap system instead of mana and rage etc. Build devercity with tactics, and collision pvp gives a pvp experience barely matched. So the pvp portion of RoR is appealing! its the Battlefield and how to use the pvp that seems to be lacking with very onedimensional keepsieges and a campaign that seems to be more about different gamemodes now, than a combined realm vs realm war. LOTD is very much standalone, City has become fully detatched from the campaign.

So bringing in new players or make older players return shouldnt be impossible, but there needs to be improvements implimented worth us remaining players to reach out and say "hey look what they done" and a new scenario with skeleton mobs will not do that, needs to be more groundbreaking on the important replayability.
News articles, hype youtube videos, or reaching out to big mmo content creators can still make big waves in the mmo pound, but right now ill be honest there is nothing new on RoR to talk about despite i want my irl friends and players who quit to come back playing RoR.
(personally been holding off on contacting Josh Strife Hayes for some RoR PR. Simply because I dont believe RoR would retain any new players from a new youtube wave of attention)
Bombling 92BW - Bombthebuilder 82Engi - Bombing 82SL - Bling 81Kobs - Orderling 80WP - Jackinabox 67WH
Gombling 85mSH- Chopling 83Chop - Notbombling 82Sorc - Powerhouse 81Zeal - Goldbag 80Mara - Smurfling 75Sham -Blobling 66BO

Ads
Whyumadbro
Posts: 485

Re: Any ideas to bring back players?

Post#219 » Tue Jun 28, 2022 1:26 pm

Make the timed city a event for its self and make a forcable city lake! both citys are big enough for a solid rvr zone with the palace of karl or chaos chicken as end objective - missed a zone? too bad, go to timed stuff. this would provide a solid 24 vs 24 experiance on top of a goal why u fight. I think this game is in its best state ever - but this zone would make the campange make sense. Give way more xp and crests for this zone per player.

Dajciekrwi
Posts: 700

Re: Any ideas to bring back players?

Post#220 » Tue Jun 28, 2022 1:36 pm

mogt wrote: Sat Jun 25, 2022 1:02 pm
Grobbok wrote: Mon Jun 13, 2022 7:01 pm from Da fat squigs:
- remove hero from keeps, make it as it was on live, 6 ppl can sneak and take keep, it will bring more action,
- make city sieges as on live, so ppl can enter it regardless of the number of players on the other side
- let low and high level players play and train together, so high level players can help leveling new ones
- remove the cost of flying, changing skills, price for mounts
why you want all easy way???, that is the biggest problem all new mmo, fgoing this way, all for free, no tactical and so many things easy mode.

this game is old school, tactical gameplay,, that is the rason why i like this game, if you want anything, you must work for it and you need knowdledge. the new generation of the players dont know ho important is that.. yo dont need easy way.
If You want some old school , tactical game, with lot, lot of work and knowledge , i honestly recommend chess.
And RoR start by very similiar to chess, closed, eltitistic, niche game, SOON WITH TWO PLAYERS MAX AT ONE GAME. The "new generation" must be really stupid to choose a funny and simply game, when they have chance to suffer through blood and pain level 80th. I cant understand this Youth, really !!!!!
BTW, in actual stage of RoR is only one knowledge needed - minless follow the wb leader, and that all fols

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 37 guests