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[Rejected] IB m3 Gromril Plating

Proposals which did not pass the two week review, were rejected internally, or were not able to be implemented.
pojoman61
Posts: 20

[Rejected] IB m3 Gromril Plating

Post#1 » Sat Oct 29, 2016 3:58 pm

Issue 1 : Ironbreaker's role of being a buff/guard bot for a single ally is under performing and is needing a few QoL and small buffs to help it better fill this role. I will only propose 1 issue at this time to try and get the ball rolling.

Currently there are very few reason to use GP(gromril plating)the m3. It was changed to be a selfish buff that is only better in small scale fighting but even then the m1s and m2s have more reasons to be used.

Solution 1 : Allow Gromril plating's bubble to be placed on oath friend if within range. So both IB and oathfriend receive bubble of 7200 @ lvl 40. IE: You and your oathfriend will be protected by a bubble (7200) for up to 20 seconds.

Solution 2: Allow Gromril plating to only buff oathfriend and not himself. Add new effect to bubble to defensively buff oath friend by giving oath friend Resolute Defense for 4 to 5 seconds. (if this is not possible then we can discuss other buffs to add to GP for oath friend. IE: Your oathfriend will be protected by a bubble (7200) for up to 20 seconds and will also receive 5 seconds of Resolute Defense.


Either solution needs discussion about size of bubble, and in solution 2 the added buff needs to be discussed(if it is even possible to add another buff)

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Penril
Posts: 4441

Re: IB m3 Gromril Plating

Post#2 » Tue Dec 06, 2016 8:59 pm

Moving to discussions.

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Karast
Posts: 554

Re: IB m3 Gromril Plating

Post#3 » Tue Dec 06, 2016 10:17 pm

I don't think the idea around buff IB and gromril plating is bad, but I do not think this change would be all that useful from a bigger picture perspective, it also lends itself to a bit of cross faction balancing since the destro version of this morale is on chosen, and not black guard if I remember correctly.

As it stands at the moment IB already has an absorb shield that they can share with their oath-friend. Changing gromril plating is a bit odd because it still would not be an ability that would be used. If you are in a group you'd still want to use the super detaunt at M3 or wait till M4, if you want to use a defensive morale for yourself, you'd use shield-wall, or ironskin at M2.

Even with gromril sharing the absorb with my oathfriend I still wouldn't use it since there are better options.

I could see it being made for the entire group, but with a reduced absorb, which basically turns it into the healer M3 absorb, which isn't a bad idea.

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Telen
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Re: IB m3 Gromril Plating

Post#4 » Tue Dec 06, 2016 10:40 pm

Well no tank has a party damage absorb. Thats a healer morale. I dont think tanks should have a clutch ability to deal with their guardie being pull/kb out of guard range. Thats where the healers role is.

Though IB and Chosen who has the mirror of the morale lack aoe cc morales Id look more into that as kotbs have a root sm have a snare on leap BO have silence and BG have knockback. Maybe even rework all the aoe cc morales while doing it as some are far better than others.
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blakokami
Posts: 137

Re: IB m3 Gromril Plating

Post#5 » Tue Dec 06, 2016 11:34 pm

Telen wrote:I dont think tanks should have a clutch ability to deal with their guardie being pull/kb out of guard range.
Immaculate defense already does this job (distracting below too in small scale), and better than some low value absorb shield would probably.
Last edited by blakokami on Tue Dec 06, 2016 11:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Eathisword
Posts: 808

Re: IB m3 Gromril Plating

Post#6 » Tue Dec 06, 2016 11:35 pm

pojoman61 wrote: Solution 1 : Allow Gromril plating's bubble to be placed on oath friend if within range. So both IB and oathfriend receive bubble of 7200 @ lvl 40. IE: You and your oathfriend will be protected by a bubble (7200) for up to 20 seconds.

Solution 2: Allow Gromril plating to only buff oathfriend and not himself. Add new effect to bubble to defensively buff oath friend by giving oath friend Resolute Defense for 4 to 5 seconds. (if this is not possible then we can discuss other buffs to add to GP for oath friend. IE: Your oathfriend will be protected by a bubble (7200) for up to 20 seconds and will also receive 5 seconds of Resolute Defense.
I am not against the change. But I think its useless use of coding time.

The issue pointed out feels definitely real. Although the solutions, as Karast mentioned, would not help to resolve said issue. GP absorbing 7200 damage over 20s is pretty much always bad compared to Distracting Below. In the full 10s, 50% damage reduction from pretty much everybody (the more the merrier as they'd say) will ''absorb'' a lot more than 7200.

As pointed though, IB already has an absorb that he can use on oathfriend : Runic shield. Currently it underperforms vs melee. Fixing that could be a sweet buff. Reverting it to its live status where it absorbed all magic damage (melee, proc or casted; currently only absorb casted magic) would help make it shine again vs Mara/dok/BO/WE/chosen. Being able to absorb an xtra 1k/10s of corp/spirit damage from all these classes would definitely bring a good chunk of relief to healers and be enough of an improvement to take an IB in group, even it being a single target buffer.
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blaqwar
Posts: 471

Re: IB m3 Gromril Plating

Post#7 » Wed Dec 07, 2016 3:40 am

Realistically speaking, does any tank (besides KotBS, cause OP) use any other M3 than Distracting Shout in group play? No. Why not? Because it's amazing. You can't change Gromril Plating into something that beats DS without major repercussions.

Other tank M3s are mostly used for solo play/really small-scale (2s and 3s) where they aren't even used most of the time due to the amount of time it takes to reach them.

I honestly believe this is a pointless discussion and any miniscule changes that are available within the scope of balance are negligible even to IBs.

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footpatrol2
Posts: 1093

Re: IB m3 Gromril Plating

Post#8 » Wed Dec 07, 2016 4:17 am

I think the defensive morale cycle nerf of patch 1.3.5 was a horrible design decision made by mythic. A different design approach could have been taken without smashing down the effectiveness of these morale's.

Below is a link to the patch notes of 1.3.5.
http://warhammeronline.wikia.com/wiki/Game_Update_1.3.5

Gromril plating was caught up in these changes. I think gromril plating should be restored to what it was previously, a group 20 sec absorb at a value of 7200.

The absorb value can be tweaked with to find the sweet spot if 7200 is considered too much.

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roadkillrobin
Posts: 2773

Re: IB m3 Gromril Plating

Post#9 » Wed Dec 07, 2016 5:31 am

GP is currently mirrored on Chosen for destro. The history of the Morale change is very complexed and involve. DoK, IB, Zealot, RP, WP, and Chosen. GP used to be a M3 and affected whole group. Chosen had a mirror of it as a M4 in path of Corruption. Spout Carapace used to be a m3 and lasted 30 seconds. It also stacked with 1001 Dark Blessings. Zealots didn't use to have their version of RP's Mauntain Spirit. And MS used to last 30 seconds. WP was given the nerfed version of 1001 DB. All these current durations and vallues are ballanced of each other. So if changea are to be made on GP. Then the other ones probobly needs to be tweaked aswell. Personally i prefer the original Morales, but I agree that the stacking with SC and 1001 was a bit much.
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Tesq
Posts: 5704

Re: IB m3 Gromril Plating

Post#10 » Wed Dec 07, 2016 10:12 am

issue 1: the role to be a buffer for 1 person is not underperforming:

-10%crit buff
-25%parry
-x magic damages absorb
-armor buff (tank value which is 2x of potion if you correctly rank up the path)

special:
-you have a toughness tactic which stack (or should) with kobs toughness aura for all party member
- passive ap regen for all group on tactic

all in 1 build:
http://waronlinebuilder.org/#career=ib; ... :;;0:0:0:0:

issue 2: moral are moral they are not linked to meccanic, unless you have some kind of moral boost.

issue 3: the abosrb is quite usefull depend from the situation (aka orvr x vs more) as the core m3 debuff only 9 ppl and you may take more damages than other if you have a kiting group which with an IB is totally possible due IB have a tactic which halv any snare duration and have an aoe snare.
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