[Suggestion] how to fix a broken system

[Panodil]

Give me reward from SC as healer and i will join, otherwise i dont enjoy playing solo as a healer. But can do it for good enough reward.

[Hardkoar]

Spoiler:

Right, because everyone that does not agree with your ignorant behavior and low self esteem attitude must be a special kid. Not only people will play how they choose so, but if the game does not cater to them, they will also leave. I'm sure you are probably one of those, ''If you don't like it then gtfo kind of folks'', but with an empty server we all lose.Larger, mightier games have fallen and this very one died due to poor balance decisions and lack of options. I understand that this basic concept is alien to a basement dweller such as yourself, but in the real world this is just another Monday.

The hypocrisy on your last statement is mind boggling to say the least:

'' you are not trying to find solutions...you want to modify the system to fit your own gameplay. ''

My entire post is based on the concept of providing MORE OPTIONS FOR EVERYONE TO ENJOY THEIR GAME TIME THE WAY THEY DESIRE.
Your dull and self centered concept is : ''if you play like a solo pugger you will face the same problems: bad balanced teams, Pug VS premades, etc..''.

So your solution is what? Go premade, go 2-2-2, roll a meta class or gtfo? Now that sounds exactly like a game everyone wants to play.

The issue with your statement is that this is a MMORPG, no matter what other MMORPG you choose to play you will need to interact with people.
Other games have died? Yes sure, though the most successful to date is still WoW where you won't progress further than Raid finder/Heroic/battlegrounds gear if you do not group up with other players.
You cannot solo queue Mythic, you cannot solo queue raids and you cannot solo queue arena.
AFAIK there's no guarantee that you get healers in WoW BGs, and tanks are useless in WoW PvP unless Blizzard manages to make them immortal, DPS gods (Yes I'm looking at you Guardian/Protection Pala/Demon Hunter and Death Knight).
I ended up in healer-less BGs that popped after 20 mins of wait time because I didn't want to queue IoC and AV, WoW is based around PvE where PvP is a minigame, sure we meme about SCs being a mini-game here but it actually yields decent rewards for a lot of careers and it gives Renown.
The core of most MMORPG's is the social interaction where you need to play together.
There's games that have better mechanics than any MMORPG out there but they are made for a smaller amount of concurrent players interacting.
You as a "solo player" will not be able to experience everything in ANY MMORPG, no matter what game you decide to play.

What meta career? You have no idea what you're talking about, there's meta speccs for all careers and if you decide to play rift engie in SCs then that's your issue, it's not impossible to respec into Rifleman or Grenadier.
Meta shows up in proper 6vs6 games, not in the event SC or anything like that, people do them to have fun with their friends.

But sure I'll suggest a solution, make a weekly quest where you get something like a renown pot or extra emblems given that you play with a group, just like the guild quests, but you don't need to be a in a guild group to complete it, making people more inclined to group up.

Spoiler:

No one is claiming to not interact/play with people. The issue is the put up or gtfo mentality running rampant around here.
It's a big difference between being a competitive minmaxer and not being able to play at all because you get stomped, since you mention wow and you seem to have an understanding of how other mmorpg work, lets run that down.

the most successful to date is still WoW where you won't progress further than Raid finder/Heroic/battlegrounds gear
Althoughthis is incorrect as in fact you will get better and better gear through weekly chests rewards from both dungeons and pvp based on your progression (solo and group queues), let's assume for a moment that your statement is correct:

You can still play the game and have fun... Will you be running Mythic 12/12?
No, ofc not, but can you play the game and enjoy the content in LFR with gear tuned for your effort? **** yea!
Can you do BG's without them being Rated?
Yes. Are they balanced? Bout 10000% times more than they are here. As you will end up with enough DPS/Heals/Tanks to make it class even.

Here you can't. There simply is no option for that, it's either u play premade or u get stomped by one, there is no middle ground. How is that promoted/supported by anyone that is not a die hard 24/7 player is beyond me. In fact you can clearly see how this subject been brought up many times, by people that currently have already left together with their friends and guilds go figure and what was the reply? Put up or gtfo. Well here we are with NA struggling to have 2 wb's on destro side. Remind me again what retention we had from the streamer promoted influx of players?
Yea... And no, it's not because the game is bad, sure it has it's bugs, but the issue is obviously balance and accessibility related.
It's the little things, they add up and ppl can't be arsed to put up with it and move on to other games with their friends.

As you said, wow is a pvE game now sadly and that is why most PVP players do not play it. Once the highest raid is put on farm it's hiatus till next Xpansion. Everyone is waiting for the next PVP focused game.
The reason why I used it as a comparison is because their Queue system is by far the most balanced one achieveable. If your argument is that We don't have enough people playing the game to afford a balanced system then the problem is obviously even deeper and it shines a light on the state of the game and how interesting is for the gaming community. This IS the only RVR / Open world pvp game worth playing in 2020 and if people are not attracted / leave, there's a reason.

''You as a "solo player" will not be able to experience everything in ANY MMORPG, no matter what game you decide to play.''
Again, false and debatable in many mmos. From the get go this game gives you access to RVR and Scenarios.
Can you play RVR solo effectively at max level? Ofc you can!
Can you play SC solo effectively at max level? No, you will have a terrible experience and get farmed a lot.

Add gear achievable only through SC (like the weapon) and you have created a perfect **** storm where people are forced to get farmed or ONLY PLAY when their friends are available. Not everyone is 15, many of us are older and have families/jobs and can't afford always being online. Therefor premades are NOT always available. So we don't play when they are not? Get real.
It's the same issue with Royals being 1:1 with Invaders, healing only gear from invader but if DPS AM/Shamans want the fortress weapon they will have to go through a stupid amount of grind for an entire set they couldn't care less just to purchase a weapon...
There's too many of these things that once they add up make people say **** this. Again, sure, you might be one of those good riddance people. But again, an empty server helps no one. Just like a bunch of tryhards in full sove farming fresh 40s for a week or two before they leave helps no one.


What meta career? You have no idea what you're talking about

Oh really there's no meta 2-2-2 and there's no specific classes people only want in their parties? I can understand now why you have no idea of what's going on around you from inside your bubble. Do you even read chat and see what ppl look for/pug/kick from warbands or PVE groups?
No you don't, because most likely the last time you pugged it was in a different game. Good for you, this is obviously an issue that does not concern you, so why are you cockblocking those who are being affected by it?

Solutions have been prompted from many people, there is just no interest from the Devs to implement them, here's a couple to name them so you can see how easy things would be:

Fix WE/WH to make them welcome in wb's (hundreds of suggestions on the sub forum). Currently they are irrelevant in group play as they are outshined by every other AOE melee class / RDPS. A wb will only pick one of these two if they are either friends, or no one else in the entire game is available lol.

Make sure DPS and Heal and Tank set counterparts are available for EVERY activity. RVR/SC/PVE . This way people will choose what's their best approach on further progressing their gear.
ADD an RVR weapon counterpart to the SC one OR fix SC imbalance between Pugs vs Premades.

Allow people that queue solo to play against other people that have queued solo and grouped vs grouped. If the issue is that there aren't enough ppl queuing as a group and therefor premades will get 2-3 max pops a day, then you NEED to fix the queue by adding a spec choice before signup. This will avoid 12 dps vs 2-2-2's situations and give atleast a slight chance at a fair fight.

These, and many others, are quality of life improvements and suggestions that are put towards making everyone's life better and not to benefit one or the other party. Premades need pugs to join Sc's. Guilds need randoms to show up at forts sieges, Solo gankers need guilds to pick off from. We ALL need other people to play the game, an empty server serves no one. If you can't understand this concept and keep your biased belief that Solo players are not needed then there's no point continuing this conversation.

[emiliorv]

Allow people that queue solo to play against other people that have queued solo and grouped vs grouped => done. Just join the PUG scenario.

This will avoid 12 dps vs 2-2-2's situations and give atleast a slight chance at a fair fight.=> this will never happen. matchmaking system only launch the SC when the 3 roles are filled, so that means that at least you have 1 tank/1heal/1DPS. So you never will have a 12 dps sc.

[Hardkoar]

matchmaking system only launch the SC when the 3 roles are filled, so that means that at least you have 1 tank/1heal/1DPS. So you never will have a 12 dps sc.

Not the case at all, 12 dps is still very much the common on a daily basis. We are obviously playing two very different games and experiences.

[emiliorv]

matchmaking system only launch the SC when the 3 roles are filled, so that means that at least you have 1 tank/1heal/1DPS. So you never will have a 12 dps sc.

Not the case at all, 12 dps is still very much the common on a daily basis. We are obviously playing two very different games and experiences.

Dunno from where you got that SS, but when you talk about 12 dps i assumed you talking in a 12Vs12 sc....if that sc is a 18 vs 18 there can be 12 dps....not if its a 12 vs 12.

Anyways, a random SS of a supossed SC finished (order reached 500 points) where anyone made dmg/heal/absorb...what you trying to argue??

[Akalukz]

Just need to add one more 18x18 scenario for PUG only and fill those first 2 first, then fill group vs group. with groups and left over pugs.

[Rapzel]

Spoiler:

Right, because everyone that does not agree with your ignorant behavior and low self esteem attitude must be a special kid. Not only people will play how they choose so, but if the game does not cater to them, they will also leave. I'm sure you are probably one of those, ''If you don't like it then gtfo kind of folks'', but with an empty server we all lose.Larger, mightier games have fallen and this very one died due to poor balance decisions and lack of options. I understand that this basic concept is alien to a basement dweller such as yourself, but in the real world this is just another Monday.

The hypocrisy on your last statement is mind boggling to say the least:

'' you are not trying to find solutions...you want to modify the system to fit your own gameplay. ''

My entire post is based on the concept of providing MORE OPTIONS FOR EVERYONE TO ENJOY THEIR GAME TIME THE WAY THEY DESIRE.
Your dull and self centered concept is : ''if you play like a solo pugger you will face the same problems: bad balanced teams, Pug VS premades, etc..''.

So your solution is what? Go premade, go 2-2-2, roll a meta class or gtfo? Now that sounds exactly like a game everyone wants to play.

The issue with your statement is that this is a MMORPG, no matter what other MMORPG you choose to play you will need to interact with people.
Other games have died? Yes sure, though the most successful to date is still WoW where you won't progress further than Raid finder/Heroic/battlegrounds gear if you do not group up with other players.
You cannot solo queue Mythic, you cannot solo queue raids and you cannot solo queue arena.
AFAIK there's no guarantee that you get healers in WoW BGs, and tanks are useless in WoW PvP unless Blizzard manages to make them immortal, DPS gods (Yes I'm looking at you Guardian/Protection Pala/Demon Hunter and Death Knight).
I ended up in healer-less BGs that popped after 20 mins of wait time because I didn't want to queue IoC and AV, WoW is based around PvE where PvP is a minigame, sure we meme about SCs being a mini-game here but it actually yields decent rewards for a lot of careers and it gives Renown.
The core of most MMORPG's is the social interaction where you need to play together.
There's games that have better mechanics than any MMORPG out there but they are made for a smaller amount of concurrent players interacting.
You as a "solo player" will not be able to experience everything in ANY MMORPG, no matter what game you decide to play.

What meta career? You have no idea what you're talking about, there's meta speccs for all careers and if you decide to play rift engie in SCs then that's your issue, it's not impossible to respec into Rifleman or Grenadier.
Meta shows up in proper 6vs6 games, not in the event SC or anything like that, people do them to have fun with their friends.

But sure I'll suggest a solution, make a weekly quest where you get something like a renown pot or extra emblems given that you play with a group, just like the guild quests, but you don't need to be a in a guild group to complete it, making people more inclined to group up.

Spoiler:

No one is claiming to not interact/play with people. The issue is the put up or gtfo mentality running rampant around here.
It's a big difference between being a competitive minmaxer and not being able to play at all because you get stomped, since you mention wow and you seem to have an understanding of how other mmorpg work, lets run that down.

the most successful to date is still WoW where you won't progress further than Raid finder/Heroic/battlegrounds gear
Althoughthis is incorrect as in fact you will get better and better gear through weekly chests rewards from both dungeons and pvp based on your progression (solo and group queues), let's assume for a moment that your statement is correct:

You can still play the game and have fun... Will you be running Mythic 12/12?
No, ofc not, but can you play the game and enjoy the content in LFR with gear tuned for your effort? **** yea!
Can you do BG's without them being Rated?
Yes. Are they balanced? Bout 10000% times more than they are here. As you will end up with enough DPS/Heals/Tanks to make it class even.

Here you can't. There simply is no option for that, it's either u play premade or u get stomped by one, there is no middle ground. How is that promoted/supported by anyone that is not a die hard 24/7 player is beyond me. In fact you can clearly see how this subject been brought up many times, by people that currently have already left together with their friends and guilds go figure and what was the reply? Put up or gtfo. Well here we are with NA struggling to have 2 wb's on destro side. Remind me again what retention we had from the streamer promoted influx of players?
Yea... And no, it's not because the game is bad, sure it has it's bugs, but the issue is obviously balance and accessibility related.
It's the little things, they add up and ppl can't be arsed to put up with it and move on to other games with their friends.

As you said, wow is a pvE game now sadly and that is why most PVP players do not play it. Once the highest raid is put on farm it's hiatus till next Xpansion. Everyone is waiting for the next PVP focused game.
The reason why I used it as a comparison is because their Queue system is by far the most balanced one achieveable. If your argument is that We don't have enough people playing the game to afford a balanced system then the problem is obviously even deeper and it shines a light on the state of the game and how interesting is for the gaming community. This IS the only RVR / Open world pvp game worth playing in 2020 and if people are not attracted / leave, there's a reason.

''You as a "solo player" will not be able to experience everything in ANY MMORPG, no matter what game you decide to play.''
Again, false and debatable in many mmos. From the get go this game gives you access to RVR and Scenarios.
Can you play RVR solo effectively at max level? Ofc you can!
Can you play SC solo effectively at max level? No, you will have a terrible experience and get farmed a lot.

Add gear achievable only through SC (like the weapon) and you have created a perfect **** storm where people are forced to get farmed or ONLY PLAY when their friends are available. Not everyone is 15, many of us are older and have families/jobs and can't afford always being online. Therefor premades are NOT always available. So we don't play when they are not? Get real.
It's the same issue with Royals being 1:1 with Invaders, healing only gear from invader but if DPS AM/Shamans want the fortress weapon they will have to go through a stupid amount of grind for an entire set they couldn't care less just to purchase a weapon...
There's too many of these things that once they add up make people say **** this. Again, sure, you might be one of those good riddance people. But again, an empty server helps no one. Just like a bunch of tryhards in full sove farming fresh 40s for a week or two before they leave helps no one.


What meta career? You have no idea what you're talking about

Oh really there's no meta 2-2-2 and there's no specific classes people only want in their parties? I can understand now why you have no idea of what's going on around you from inside your bubble. Do you even read chat and see what ppl look for/pug/kick from warbands or PVE groups?
No you don't, because most likely the last time you pugged it was in a different game. Good for you, this is obviously an issue that does not concern you, so why are you cockblocking those who are being affected by it?

Solutions have been prompted from many people, there is just no interest from the Devs to implement them, here's a couple to name them so you can see how easy things would be:

Fix WE/WH to make them welcome in wb's (hundreds of suggestions on the sub forum). Currently they are irrelevant in group play as they are outshined by every other AOE melee class / RDPS. A wb will only pick one of these two if they are either friends, or no one else in the entire game is available lol.

Make sure DPS and Heal and Tank set counterparts are available for EVERY activity. RVR/SC/PVE . This way people will choose what's their best approach on further progressing their gear.
ADD an RVR weapon counterpart to the SC one OR fix SC imbalance between Pugs vs Premades.

Allow people that queue solo to play against other people that have queued solo and grouped vs grouped. If the issue is that there aren't enough ppl queuing as a group and therefor premades will get 2-3 max pops a day, then you NEED to fix the queue by adding a spec choice before signup. This will avoid 12 dps vs 2-2-2's situations and give atleast a slight chance at a fair fight.

These, and many others, are quality of life improvements and suggestions that are put towards making everyone's life better and not to benefit one or the other party. Premades need pugs to join Sc's. Guilds need randoms to show up at forts sieges, Solo gankers need guilds to pick off from. We ALL need other people to play the game, an empty server serves no one. If you can't understand this concept and keep your biased belief that Solo players are not needed then there's no point continuing this conversation.

I'm biased? Okay.

I pugged this morning to finish my kills on the sc event, no issues there. Joined a pug 6 man even for the last 18 kills I think it was, got a full annihilator magi with melee spec, was it frustrating having to guard someone with 0 dmg output? A bit, I also asked him to go range because our healers struggled, but it just ended up with us not caring about him and trying to play as 5 instead, did I rage and call him names or blame him for losing? No because pugs are pugs.

Idc if solo players exist or not, I play solo I play in groups, I don't put the same expectations on pugs as I do on premade groups.

Yes in event SC people clown around a lot, I've ran in groups with one tank 3 sorcs, we still ran over disorganized order pugs because we had communication, I've ran scs where we took off one gear piece each SC we won to see how far we could push it, we were down to weapon and jewellery before we started to struggle.

You are blaming your losses on the system when the truth is that the issue is you, you need to scrutinize yourself and think about what you can do to get better.

I'm not a good player, I'm mediocre at best, but I understand the core concepts of the game which 90% of the player base doesn't seem to understand.

We and wh have viable specs for wbs, you just can't stack them like you can with e.g. Slayer.

I run into these magical premades on a daily basis, and the majority of them are almost as rare as unicorns.
Yes there are a few premades, but there's rarely more than 3 during prime time EU (there's literally a DISCORD CHANNEL where people post that they are queuing to get any real opposition), I can't even remember the last time I ran into any of the really good ones like zerg/phalanx or LoB, I queued on order yesterday kept getting FMJ premade in MT we had probably around 50/50 win rate because of who had the better pugs, chances are about equal for both sides to get a premade.

2/2/2 is meta (btt and iconic probably wants to have a talk with you)? Is having a 24 man WB also meta then? I said there's no meta careers, there's meta specs, any top tier guild knows that player > career. Slayers are the best DPS in the game, no one with any sense will dispute this, but there's just as many bad slayers if not more than there's good Slayers. Amount of good AMs you can count on your hand, the majority of them are bad that's why people don't want them in their pug WBs, yet I think both tup and vii are looking for one for their wbs, weird huh?

SC 2/2/2 was tried like 2-3 years ago when people played way more scs than they do today (SC weapon was BiS for everyone, no fort weapon or bloodlord existed) and it was a complete and utter failure, and people whined after a week that pops where terrible.
The solution to create balanced and good groups is to start them yourself, always has been, always will be.

I've been farmed because I've had bad pugs, I've been a part of that pug and I admitted defeat, but I've also found the pugs that where good in that scenario whispered them and asked them if they want to group and through that built a 6 man that eventually beat the other factions premade.

If you want a fair 2/2/2 group Vs a 2/2/2 group play solo ranked, gives oppressors and ranked tokens. It's pug as well
Or you could queue the .pug SC

But sure allow for people to queue as pure pug. But only give them conq emblems as drops, that's fair right?
Because this is not just another one of those threads about how you just want your bis gear without putting any effort into it right?

[Zymer]

Give me reward from SC as healer and i will join, otherwise i dont enjoy playing solo as a healer. But can do it for good enough reward.

People on this thread going crazy and insulting each other, but ignoring this post.

I think this is the best way to incentivize people to play healers and tanks without making the queues longer. Give them better rewards for doing this. Great idea! Something meaningful like RvR currency, talismans, and maybe a chance at tokens for trophies (or getting a token after a certain amount played per week/day in SCs). FFXIV does something similar for dungeons, and people specifically play tanks and healers for those rewards.

[Hardkoar]

Spoiler:

The issue with your statement is that this is a MMORPG, no matter what other MMORPG you choose to play you will need to interact with people.
Other games have died? Yes sure, though the most successful to date is still WoW where you won't progress further than Raid finder/Heroic/battlegrounds gear if you do not group up with other players.
You cannot solo queue Mythic, you cannot solo queue raids and you cannot solo queue arena.
AFAIK there's no guarantee that you get healers in WoW BGs, and tanks are useless in WoW PvP unless Blizzard manages to make them immortal, DPS gods (Yes I'm looking at you Guardian/Protection Pala/Demon Hunter and Death Knight).
I ended up in healer-less BGs that popped after 20 mins of wait time because I didn't want to queue IoC and AV, WoW is based around PvE where PvP is a minigame, sure we meme about SCs being a mini-game here but it actually yields decent rewards for a lot of careers and it gives Renown.
The core of most MMORPG's is the social interaction where you need to play together.
There's games that have better mechanics than any MMORPG out there but they are made for a smaller amount of concurrent players interacting.
You as a "solo player" will not be able to experience everything in ANY MMORPG, no matter what game you decide to play.

What meta career? You have no idea what you're talking about, there's meta speccs for all careers and if you decide to play rift engie in SCs then that's your issue, it's not impossible to respec into Rifleman or Grenadier.
Meta shows up in proper 6vs6 games, not in the event SC or anything like that, people do them to have fun with their friends.

But sure I'll suggest a solution, make a weekly quest where you get something like a renown pot or extra emblems given that you play with a group, just like the guild quests, but you don't need to be a in a guild group to complete it, making people more inclined to group up.

Spoiler:

No one is claiming to not interact/play with people. The issue is the put up or gtfo mentality running rampant around here.
It's a big difference between being a competitive minmaxer and not being able to play at all because you get stomped, since you mention wow and you seem to have an understanding of how other mmorpg work, lets run that down.

the most successful to date is still WoW where you won't progress further than Raid finder/Heroic/battlegrounds gear
Althoughthis is incorrect as in fact you will get better and better gear through weekly chests rewards from both dungeons and pvp based on your progression (solo and group queues), let's assume for a moment that your statement is correct:

You can still play the game and have fun... Will you be running Mythic 12/12?
No, ofc not, but can you play the game and enjoy the content in LFR with gear tuned for your effort? **** yea!
Can you do BG's without them being Rated?
Yes. Are they balanced? Bout 10000% times more than they are here. As you will end up with enough DPS/Heals/Tanks to make it class even.

Here you can't. There simply is no option for that, it's either u play premade or u get stomped by one, there is no middle ground. How is that promoted/supported by anyone that is not a die hard 24/7 player is beyond me. In fact you can clearly see how this subject been brought up many times, by people that currently have already left together with their friends and guilds go figure and what was the reply? Put up or gtfo. Well here we are with NA struggling to have 2 wb's on destro side. Remind me again what retention we had from the streamer promoted influx of players?
Yea... And no, it's not because the game is bad, sure it has it's bugs, but the issue is obviously balance and accessibility related.
It's the little things, they add up and ppl can't be arsed to put up with it and move on to other games with their friends.

As you said, wow is a pvE game now sadly and that is why most PVP players do not play it. Once the highest raid is put on farm it's hiatus till next Xpansion. Everyone is waiting for the next PVP focused game.
The reason why I used it as a comparison is because their Queue system is by far the most balanced one achieveable. If your argument is that We don't have enough people playing the game to afford a balanced system then the problem is obviously even deeper and it shines a light on the state of the game and how interesting is for the gaming community. This IS the only RVR / Open world pvp game worth playing in 2020 and if people are not attracted / leave, there's a reason.

''You as a "solo player" will not be able to experience everything in ANY MMORPG, no matter what game you decide to play.''
Again, false and debatable in many mmos. From the get go this game gives you access to RVR and Scenarios.
Can you play RVR solo effectively at max level? Ofc you can!
Can you play SC solo effectively at max level? No, you will have a terrible experience and get farmed a lot.

Add gear achievable only through SC (like the weapon) and you have created a perfect **** storm where people are forced to get farmed or ONLY PLAY when their friends are available. Not everyone is 15, many of us are older and have families/jobs and can't afford always being online. Therefor premades are NOT always available. So we don't play when they are not? Get real.
It's the same issue with Royals being 1:1 with Invaders, healing only gear from invader but if DPS AM/Shamans want the fortress weapon they will have to go through a stupid amount of grind for an entire set they couldn't care less just to purchase a weapon...
There's too many of these things that once they add up make people say **** this. Again, sure, you might be one of those good riddance people. But again, an empty server helps no one. Just like a bunch of tryhards in full sove farming fresh 40s for a week or two before they leave helps no one.


What meta career? You have no idea what you're talking about

Oh really there's no meta 2-2-2 and there's no specific classes people only want in their parties? I can understand now why you have no idea of what's going on around you from inside your bubble. Do you even read chat and see what ppl look for/pug/kick from warbands or PVE groups?
No you don't, because most likely the last time you pugged it was in a different game. Good for you, this is obviously an issue that does not concern you, so why are you cockblocking those who are being affected by it?

Solutions have been prompted from many people, there is just no interest from the Devs to implement them, here's a couple to name them so you can see how easy things would be:

Fix WE/WH to make them welcome in wb's (hundreds of suggestions on the sub forum). Currently they are irrelevant in group play as they are outshined by every other AOE melee class / RDPS. A wb will only pick one of these two if they are either friends, or no one else in the entire game is available lol.

Make sure DPS and Heal and Tank set counterparts are available for EVERY activity. RVR/SC/PVE . This way people will choose what's their best approach on further progressing their gear.
ADD an RVR weapon counterpart to the SC one OR fix SC imbalance between Pugs vs Premades.

Allow people that queue solo to play against other people that have queued solo and grouped vs grouped. If the issue is that there aren't enough ppl queuing as a group and therefor premades will get 2-3 max pops a day, then you NEED to fix the queue by adding a spec choice before signup. This will avoid 12 dps vs 2-2-2's situations and give atleast a slight chance at a fair fight.

These, and many others, are quality of life improvements and suggestions that are put towards making everyone's life better and not to benefit one or the other party. Premades need pugs to join Sc's. Guilds need randoms to show up at forts sieges, Solo gankers need guilds to pick off from. We ALL need other people to play the game, an empty server serves no one. If you can't understand this concept and keep your biased belief that Solo players are not needed then there's no point continuing this conversation.

Because this is not just another one of those threads about how you just want your bis gear without putting any effort into it right?

How is it not putting in effort when you go PUGS vs EzMode premade? If anything, it takes 10x more effort and struggle. Any premade that loses Vs a Pug in this game queue conditions should just consider doing something better with their life.
You have an incredible biased way of thinking....

''I choose the best players to team up and go win the scenario vs the pugs that didn't carry me in my previous one''
I want to be rewarded for my effort.

Seriously? I'm kinda done...

[Sponn]

Zappytap on their stream suggested that maybe a light matchmaking be introduced to where the game just tries to match each side with the same amount of healers.



I dunno. SC's are what they are. A lot of the issues on this server are due to low population. If you want a lot of "issues" gone then be an awesome community and attract/keep ppl here. We gotta do our part too instead of asking the moon and stars from 3 dudes doing a hobby.