Please 'fix' City instances. Enough is enough.

[SuperStar]

I have to write here.

Imo nothing wrong with city maybe we can handle more at cet 6,7,8 pm iam an old man ia need my sleep schedule.

But imo if you dont have a group at least just dont q. Or accept it it will be a big s.k with a very big chance. And you can leave it. Nothing important in city expect fun. If you dont like to be farmed dont join solo. Its not a solo experience.and it should not be.

[Kpi]

City post... my favorites

This was beyond insulting. This was evidential of how bad an instance can be. Oh, don't worry, Order came royally dashing in with a premade zerg as they always do.

Yesterday, in city time Destro has 54% of server population, this will always negatively affect groups of pugs on the side with more players, this time to destruction.

If you see the citys yesterdy in killboard, u can see
https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... _type=city

City 1: 24 HoB vs 12 Oath +12 Smash https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... 354c3b1efd
City 2: 12 Brutallity + 12 Dissolution vs 4x6 man (IJ, CNTK, Seventh and B Team) https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... 35c9f8fa55
City 3: Pugs* (Not 8-8-8) vs Pugs* (Not 8-8-8) https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... d03130f81b
City 4: Pugs* (Not 8-8-8) vs Pugs* (Not 8-8-8) https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... 952649debc
City 5: Pugs* (Not 8-8-8) vs Pugs* (Not 8-8-8) https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... 638739e82b
City 6: 12 FMJ + 6 Daydream vs 6 Man Tercio (4+2 allies) and pugs https://killboard.returnofreckoning.com ... c8292f55a9
*I was not in this cities, but i can't see 5-6 members of the same guild in the killboard, so i assume they are pugs or 6 man did on /5 or alliance.

24 man: 1 Destro; 0 order
12 man: 3 destro; 3 destros
6 man: 0 destro; 5 orders

Making premade groups isn't bad, it's good. But don't confuse your personal situation in your game with the reality of last night's sieges. This is a game based on groups, so if you are not able to do a simple 6 man group, is not fault of the devs or the order.

The city sieges was ruined with the new unique Currency System.

It is true that the scheduled city system is disgusting and that the matchups don't work out as they should, but if you don't build at least 6 man groups, you risk a city without any healer.

EDIT: Destros won 4/6

[Garamore]

If you make a 24 pug wb for city you will get instance 1 and get farmed - this is the reason people have stopped taking in a 24 man and the reason no one would join to make one.

Only way to encourage people to group in pug wbs would be to fully randomise the queues so that there is a chance a pug semi-org premade gets un-org pugs. That however would frustrate those looking for balanced fights.

At this point id revert city back triggering off locks and fully randomise the queues to reward those who organise.

[dysfori]

I spent as of today, the last hour and a half watching my Warband leader on Destro, try to form a warband for the last 30 minutes before City defense. We had everything, except tanks. No one was asking to join, everyone bluntly stated they either wanted a 12 man or to go solo. We barely reached 13 players. And even so, no tanks were asking for invites in the chat.

Then, after disbanding the warband because we couldn't meet our quota, me and some people who were left over ended up Solo Queing, and the result?

>10 tanks.
>14 dps
>0 healers

This was beyond insulting. This was evidential of how bad an instance can be. Oh, don't worry, Order came royally dashing in with a premade zerg as they always do. It wasn't even a slaughter, it was just sad and pathetic. That other players would rather just solo que and screw over the decent, hardworking players who want to cooperate and coordinate for success. And you ask how is that the conclusion I come to? Because not a single one of these tanks, except my Warband leader's alt, wasn't grouped with anyone. There was NO coordination. There was NO communication. Just a gaggle of laughing heads remarking on how bad things could be. The worst part? Half of the groupless rejects who joined left right after taking a single look at the roster. Like somehow, this was supposed to be a surprise for them. Like "no one could see that one coming".
So I propose this. It's time the dev's recognized the importance and severity of City Instances. And recognize, honestly admit, that they were supposed to primarily Endgame Content. Which means that it's a highroller's stakes match, that not just anyone can waltz in without any semblance of knowing what to do. Because that's all is happening with Destro. The last time I saw an order pug, was 3 months ago. And it was a latenight city, at that. So that means literally...nothing.

So frankly, this is what I am asking of the dev's, to review this thread and respectfully consider the following. Though I would be lying if I said I am not making a demand; This game needs the City's 'gatekeeped'. Full warbands, half warbands, or sixmans allowed in. ONLY. No one else. No more solo queing. This would fix Cities in the entirety. It would no longer be reasonable to accuse failure on the system of RNG, but skill. Coordination, competence and strategizing. Cities aren't some FFA battlearena for everyone to go smash their heads in out of boredom, of which many people I've spoken to have openly admit they view City for that specific activity. It's for literally AN ARMY VERSUS AN ARMY. That was what it was designed for.

Why should Destruction deserve to partake in ANYTHING if they are unwilling to work for it? And if Destruction can't organize proper warbands and groups to partake in the activity...how is that Order's fault? Or the dev's fault? No. The evidence is obvious who.

PS: Renul, Santiago. You did good, boys. Sadly, it wasn't enough.

I was on order side and I assure you we were no premade if you would have had 4 healers we would probably have been stomped.
The topic you are lifting is complex and it doesn't get easier with the number of players and distribution of classes.
I for one don't think city should be locked behind a "premade or bust" filter, since I think everyone should be able to participate in what a game has to offer and the treasure it brings.

I hope next one will be better for you and that you will get a full warband going kudos for trying! It's always needed.

[Kpi]

At this point id revert city back triggering off locks and fully randomise the queues to reward those who organise.

Also, it would make sense of the RVR campaign

[Fenris78]

Yes, sadly there is no satisfiying solution to this issue.

Either you lock cities to 6/12/24 premades, and you make all solo unhappy because they could never join any city, and forcing groups to form with such a small population mean there will always be more dps leftovers than other support classes (tanks/heals) due to unbalanced archetype distribution (6/12/6 by game design).

Or you allow solo players to queue, and you get random matchups, but at least :
- everyone can earn rewards
- even losing side is getting bags + base tokens (about 80 + possible bags are not bad for less than one hour stomping).

You just need to endure, and try your best to at least qualify for a bag, even if being stomped without any chance to do anything meaningful is horrible, at least the compensation prize is still worth it for some...


Also, 8 instances over 10 were won by Destru last city. Guess you were unlucky to be the 20%... Probably better for you next time

[Shogun4138]

Turn the cities into an open zone when unlocked.

Put them back on zone locks.

Trigger lotd off city locks

[Morradin]

To OP
Hate to break the news to you, the majority of players just want to have fun, and not be responsible for YOU to have a good city experience. Also, 99% of the time pugs will always be matched against premades. It is like that is sc's as well.
Getting rid of solo Q will not help anything at all. Not for you anyway, since you are the type to demand others to play your way and insure that you have a good time.

Lastly ... neither you will never stop a huge part of the population from playing solo or joining only pug overflow wb. And your attitude is the main reason. YOU are to blame for people not playing organized wb.
Who wants to play with a demanding player like you? I quote you. "Coordination, competence and strategizing".
And then we have this prize of a statement, "Why should Destruction deserve to partake in ANYTHING if they are unwilling to work for it? And if Destruction can't organize proper warbands and groups to partake in the activity...how is that Order's fault? Or the dev's fault? No. The evidence is obvious who."
YOU, the evidence is obvious, you and people like you demanding perfection from other players, is the big problem. IT IS A GAME!!! You think other players owe you or anyone obedience? Get over yourself. Your entire post is nothing but toxicity.

I play for ME. Not for you, or anyone else. And a lot of other players feel as I do, and always will.

[Aluviya]

You can't fix population issues and class preferences.... Create your own group/wb and join city - there is no issue here that needs to be fixed from my POV

[nebelwerfer]

I think a interesting way to approach this problem is to look at city as a 24 - 36(god i hope you bring this back at some point) man raid where the main enemy is the opposite faction and their leader.

You cannot and should not be able to pug this. I've had great pugs where i win gold bags etc, but the truth is that i have har far more awful ones. So i think the reward of having a low treshold experience of city is not worth the riskof turning players off in frustration.

So my solution would be this:

Bring up the rewards for organizing. As you bring 24 people, there are guarenteed gold bags even if you lose.

The PQ in stage 1 should be more interactive and dynamic, meaning BO and kills should matter more than they currently do to make time, "plays" and coordination a more important aspect instead of who has the most impressive deathball which should and will be the deciding factor in stage 3 regardless. This will also reduce the frustration of losing stage 1 for the attackers, as standing around and waiting for it to end on time is just boring.

For the wining team, they should get sov loot in the stage 3 gold bags as before, and perhaps fort weapons in purple bags. Losers get warlord gear.

People who refuse to join warbands should be allowed only in the city siege related scenario, which would be available to them for the duration of the siege. They will fight for shards of royal emblems as the reward for winning this scenario, and drop from players.

I think this would go a long way to incentivize the correct way to conduct a city siege, but leave an option for those not willing/able to commit to it.

My 2c