Sw gear

Swordmaster, Shadow Warrior, White Lion, Archmage
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Avernus
Posts: 337

Re: Sw gear

Post#11 » Thu Jan 26, 2023 1:35 pm

chookette wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 12:33 pm I'm aiming for 5 wl 3 trium 2 lotd and last spot ring with stats to maximize ranger power with a crit rate around 54% under bulleys
It looks more like Festering arrow build.

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kryss
Posts: 456

Re: Sw gear

Post#12 » Thu Jan 26, 2023 1:52 pm

I have a SW that I play casually, rr84 atm with access to all current Bis gear.
This is what I learned during the way, and what I like, might not what you are looking for but maybe can help in some way:

Festering ((siege) build: I like 7 sov 2 triump with fervor liniment + crit tali on the triumph jewel. Bloodlord bow, Fortress sword. Tactics: bullseye, instinctive, enchanted arrows, no quarter. Renown: 4 fs, full deft, crit

Solo melee build: 3 offsov (chest, head, gloves), 3 triumph (boots, waist, jewel), 3 warlord (jewel, shoulders, cape), bloodlord sword, fort bow. Tactics: wrist slash, instinctive, bullseye, no respite. Renown: 4 fs, full deft, parry, last 5 points up to you (I prefer crit reduction dmg). Talis: bal, wounds, but most focus on WS. Decent Hps (8200 or smth, bal almost capped - 1042- , excellent WS (i think it's in the 800 smth, around 970-980 with wrist slash buff and swift tergiversation liniment). You can switch swift lini for eternal hunt to get more range crit and almost cap ballistic, so you can mix melee and kite/range playstyles. Can also work if you go 3 sov, 3 triumph, 3 wl.

Aoe WB setup: I almost always solo with SW so I didn't play it a lot, BUT i think that 5 sov 4 triumph with 2x fort weaps is alright (i prefer 2x procs instead of a BL weapon, since u'll be spamming aoe stuff)

For soloing I didn't like 5 warlord 4 triumph, nor melee power build (5 wl, 2 lotd, 3 triumph) very much. Did many tests on players/dummies and I believe melee/range power setups are a bit overvalued. Maybe I'm wrong, don't know :) Hope it helps

Avernus
Posts: 337

Re: Sw gear

Post#13 » Thu Jan 26, 2023 2:19 pm

kryss wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 1:52 pm 1. Festering ((siege) build: I like 7 sov 2 triump with fervor liniment + crit tali on the triumph jewel. Bloodlord bow, Fortress sword. Tactics: bullseye, instinctive, enchanted arrows, no quarter. Renown: 4 fs, full deft, crit

2. Solo melee build: 3 offsov (chest, head, gloves), 3 triumph (boots, waist, jewel), 3 warlord (jewel, shoulders, cape), bloodlord sword, fort bow. Tactics: wrist slash, instinctive, bullseye, no respite. Renown: 4 fs, full deft, parry, last 5 points up to you (I prefer crit reduction dmg). Talis: bal, wounds, but most focus on WS. Decent Hps (8200 or smth, bal almost capped - 1042- , excellent WS (i think it's in the 800 smth, around 970-980 with wrist slash buff and swift tergiversation liniment). You can switch swift lini for eternal hunt to get more range crit and almost cap ballistic, so you can mix melee and kite/range playstyles. Can also work if you go 3 sov, 3 triumph, 3 wl.

3. Aoe WB setup: I almost always solo with SW so I didn't play it a lot, BUT i think that 5 sov 4 triumph with 2x fort weaps is alright (i prefer 2x procs instead of a BL weapon, since u'll be spamming aoe stuff)
1. Why not bs sword+fort bow? The dps your weapon has does affect your skills, but dps from your second weapon (like sword for ranged skills) contribute only 25% or something.
2. Same as 1 - why not fort sword+bs bow?
3. BS weapon can add something like 50-100+ damage to your aoe, i'm not sure that 5% proc is worth it compared to that.

kryss
Posts: 456

Re: Sw gear

Post#14 » Thu Jan 26, 2023 3:15 pm

Avernus wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 2:19 pm
kryss wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 1:52 pm 1. Festering ((siege) build: I like 7 sov 2 triump with fervor liniment + crit tali on the triumph jewel. Bloodlord bow, Fortress sword. Tactics: bullseye, instinctive, enchanted arrows, no quarter. Renown: 4 fs, full deft, crit

2. Solo melee build: 3 offsov (chest, head, gloves), 3 triumph (boots, waist, jewel), 3 warlord (jewel, shoulders, cape), bloodlord sword, fort bow. Tactics: wrist slash, instinctive, bullseye, no respite. Renown: 4 fs, full deft, parry, last 5 points up to you (I prefer crit reduction dmg). Talis: bal, wounds, but most focus on WS. Decent Hps (8200 or smth, bal almost capped - 1042- , excellent WS (i think it's in the 800 smth, around 970-980 with wrist slash buff and swift tergiversation liniment). You can switch swift lini for eternal hunt to get more range crit and almost cap ballistic, so you can mix melee and kite/range playstyles. Can also work if you go 3 sov, 3 triumph, 3 wl.

3. Aoe WB setup: I almost always solo with SW so I didn't play it a lot, BUT i think that 5 sov 4 triumph with 2x fort weaps is alright (i prefer 2x procs instead of a BL weapon, since u'll be spamming aoe stuff)
1. Why not bs sword+fort bow? The dps your weapon has does affect your skills, but dps from your second weapon (like sword for ranged skills) contribute only 25% or something.
2. Same as 1 - why not fort sword+bs bow?
3. BS weapon can add something like 50-100+ damage to your aoe, i'm not sure that 5% proc is worth it compared to that.
I may be wrong but this is my reasoning
1. Because bloodlord bow has a way slower spd, therefore heavier hits. In a festering crit build I tend to prefer that
2. Same as before: heavier hits, but with a +attk spd equipment and +attk spd ASW stance, you get fatter hits still at a very fast spd
3. I think that when u spam aoe BHA, SFA, barrage, flame, lileath etc, the chances to get procs on lots of targets may compensate the 5%

Ofc "technical" players, more oriented to math/number chewing, are definitely welcome to validate (or kill) this reasoning

Avernus
Posts: 337

Re: Sw gear

Post#15 » Thu Jan 26, 2023 3:55 pm

kryss wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 3:15 pm I may be wrong but this is my reasoning
1. Because bloodlord bow has a way slower spd, therefore heavier hits. In a festering crit build I tend to prefer that
2. Same as before: heavier hits, but with a +attk spd equipment and +attk spd ASW stance, you get fatter hits still at a very fast spd
3. I think that when u spam aoe BHA, SFA, barrage, flame, lileath etc, the chances to get procs on lots of targets may compensate the 5%

Ofc "technical" players, more oriented to math/number chewing, are definitely welcome to validate (or kill) this reasoning
1. True
2. I wish to test that but can't. No gear yet.
3. 5% to deal arount 250-280- damage or even less or a guaranteed +50-100 damage? Can't say that this is good trade.

chookette
Posts: 175

Re: Sw gear

Post#16 » Thu Jan 26, 2023 6:21 pm

my orientation is exclusively for the aoe spec. 5% applies to normal hits but especially to criticals which are increased by default and even more with our steady aim technique. so I much prefer a 5% to a low proc of a small damage. I play in 12 man minimum and in wb. the auto attack is more interesting with a slow weapon than a fast weapon because I base my dps on the burst. but still interesting to have your vision.

Avernus
Posts: 337

Re: Sw gear

Post#17 » Thu Jan 26, 2023 6:29 pm

chookette wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 6:21 pm 5% applies to normal hits but especially to criticals which are increased by default and even more with our steady aim technique. so I much prefer a 5% to a low proc of a small damage.
Exactly

rejndjer
Suspended
Posts: 431

Re: Sw gear

Post#18 » Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:33 am

chookette wrote: Thu Jan 26, 2023 6:21 pm my orientation is exclusively for the aoe spec. 5% applies to normal hits but especially to criticals which are increased by default and even more with our steady aim technique. so I much prefer a 5% to a low proc of a small damage. I play in 12 man minimum and in wb. the auto attack is more interesting with a slow weapon than a fast weapon because I base my dps on the burst. but still interesting to have your vision.
if you have 5% chance to tick exrta damage, wouldnt it be better to have wep that hits more often, than the slow one that hits "harder"? because outgoing dps is more or less same, but you get more chances to trigger 5% extra dmg

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Fenris78
Posts: 803

Re: Sw gear

Post#19 » Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:09 am

rejndjer wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:33 am if you have 5% chance to tick extra damage, wouldnt it be better to have wep that hits more often, than the slow one that hits "harder"? because outgoing dps is more or less same, but you get more chances to trigger 5% extra dmg
Weapon speed is making a very small difference overall, especially when you hope proccing a 5% chance damaging proc.

5% Is about once every 20 hits, accounting autoattack indeed, but overall it means less than one proc in the 16-18s average time you need to down a construct.
In a real combat, you can hope doing about 30s of fight in 1v1, before fight end, and you probably wont just will attack during all this time (detaunt, backdash, stance change, etc.).
Realistically speaking, you will get 1.5 procs, on average, for about 10 autoattacks + 20 attack skills used, over the course of 30s. Wich is about 540 more damage, maybe 720 if you got proc twice = 400 to 533 effective damage dealt against a standard 35% spirit resistance.

While during this time, you will deal about 24k to 32k "effective" damage, depending on your crit rate, wich is about 1.2k to 1.6k more damage dealt with the Bastion Stair 5% bonus.

I'm counting in both cases about the time need to down 1.5 to 2 constructs, based on personnal stats of 16-22s average time (assault or skirmish).


About weapon speed increase, general consensus is it's better to get the higher base damage from it (hence, using slow weapons), because both attack speed increase effects (warlord, assault stance, or any other AA speed bonus) and +% damage increases are maximized.


So best setup could be Bastion Stair Falcata + Fortress warbow, where you can benefit from both bonuses, no matter your game style (assault or scout/skirm).

rejndjer
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Posts: 431

Re: Sw gear

Post#20 » Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:43 am

Fenris78 wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 10:09 am
rejndjer wrote: Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:33 am if you have 5% chance to tick extra damage, wouldnt it be better to have wep that hits more often, than the slow one that hits "harder"? because outgoing dps is more or less same, but you get more chances to trigger 5% extra dmg
Weapon speed is making a very small difference overall, especially when you hope proccing a 5% chance damaging proc.

5% Is about once every 20 hits, accounting autoattack indeed, but overall it means less than one proc in the 16-18s average time you need to down a construct.
In a real combat, you can hope doing about 30s of fight in 1v1, before fight end, and you probably wont just will attack during all this time (detaunt, backdash, stance change, etc.).
Realistically speaking, you will get 1.5 procs, on average, for about 10 autoattacks + 20 attack skills used, over the course of 30s. Wich is about 540 more damage, maybe 720 if you got proc twice = 400 to 533 effective damage dealt against a standard 35% spirit resistance.

While during this time, you will deal about 24k to 32k "effective" damage, depending on your crit rate, wich is about 1.2k to 1.6k more damage dealt with the Bastion Stair 5% bonus.

I'm counting in both cases about the time need to down 1.5 to 2 constructs, based on personnal stats of 16-22s average time (assault or skirmish).


About weapon speed increase, general consensus is it's better to get the higher base damage from it (hence, using slow weapons), because both attack speed increase effects (warlord, assault stance, or any other AA speed bonus) and +% damage increases are maximized.


So best setup could be Bastion Stair Falcata + Fortress warbow, where you can benefit from both bonuses, no matter your game style (assault or scout/skirm).
thanks for doing the math :)

how much runs do i need for BL falcata? never done BS

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