Return of Reckoning

Because wl burst is reliant on a pet that good players will dispose of in a heartbeat, rendering said burst null. Wh doesn't have such an achilles heel.

Had you done competitive pvp instead of moaning from a solo pov you'd know this. No healer should die to a wl if they're skilled/geared.

peterthepan3 wrote:Because wl burst is reliant on a pet that good players will dispose of in a heartbeat, rendering said burst null. Wh doesn't have such an achilles heel.

Had you done competitive pvp instead of moaning from a solo pov you'd know this. No healer should die to a wl if they're skilled/geared.

competitive pvp? does such a thing even exist? I thought most boisbands specialize in farming soloers and pugs these days
and when things get "competitive", it is time to kite to nearest WC

WH has an achilles heel, that would be mobility (no charge, no pounce and snare only if you Snapshot someone who doesnt strafe, backleap 30 sec CD and mostly reserved for saving your own life) - not to mention having to face similar frontline conditions as WL or slayer but doing it without medium armour.

Aurandilaz wrote:

peterthepan3 wrote:Because wl burst is reliant on a pet that good players will dispose of in a heartbeat, rendering said burst null. Wh doesn't have such an achilles heel.

Had you done competitive pvp instead of moaning from a solo pov you'd know this. No healer should die to a wl if they're skilled/geared.

competitive pvp? does such a thing even exist? I thought most boisbands specialize in farming soloers and pugs these days
and when things get "competitive", it is time to kite to nearest WC

WH has an achilles heel, that would be mobility (no charge, no pounce and snare only if you Snapshot someone who doesnt strafe, backleap 30 sec CD and mostly reserved for saving your own life) - not to mention having to face similar frontline conditions as WL or slayer but doing it without medium armour.

can the wh mechanic be nullified in under 2/3 seconds?

Wl needs the burst otherwise it offers nothing to a group. Wh has much better sustained and group utility too.

it does exist but wouldn't expect you to know

can the wh mechanic be nullified in under 2/3 seconds?

yea, lol, one single superpunt totally nullifies wh mechanic, ant the wh himself xd

Nullifies anyone - except the wl who relies on his mobility to stay relevant. The damage of a wh does not experience as many setbacks as a wl against competent players.

peterthepan3 wrote:Nullifies anyone - except the wl who relies on his mobility to stay relevant. The damage of a wh does not experience as many setbacks as a wl against competent players.

let me tell you how it works on a wl side.

You have an off-cd kd, + pounce so you can knock down any outstanding to 50-60 ft away from you light-armored enemy, and kill himm in a 3 gcd almost all the time, thanks to:
- Off-cd mechanic - you will always place 3 gcd damage on knocked enemy, while other mdps dont have more then 2.
- You have coordinated with your own pet abilities, like coordinated strike, that will always do around 2k dmg in summary even if you dont have crit tjis time
- you have 2h+aa hahte tactic
- and as a final cherry on a pie - 1.5k armor debuff, that thing leaves zeals ans sorcs zero mitigation against you, for all the time and not only 10 sec a min on 1 ability like wh does.
- Fetch?
-Pounce?

There is no whine, but as a fact, wl can totaly shot down any destro light armored class in 3 gcd all the time on a 50-60ft range, while order classes have nothing to fear outside melee range.

Another issue, - following your "competetive" 12 men cries, Aza reworked and significantly buffed wl pet stats, so now it is a bit more stronger then lvl 35 newcommer choppa, who has just leveled his first toon and has no idea whats going on, and who is that poggy guy, killing him with a blow.

Another issue - pet has +25% ms now, so with 100% ms tactic and sprint turned on it can reach you on 60 mount and knock you down, sounds fcn amazing. Ive been told, that is to compensate pathfinding issues, well, have to say it works.

Thats all about pug live, that is how it going 24/7 in rvr lakes, and not only in 6/6 CW once a week +0gmt.

@Atropik The reality is different. If it is 1v1 and the enemy has a classcannon spec, than the WL can shine. If a class has more defence, guard or detaunt than WL can have a lot of problems.

The reality is, even in a pug scenario, the WL pet gets mostly focused and get killed in 2 seconds.
That means the WL has to wait 15 seconds (very bad dps) still he can summon his pet again. Than pet gets killed again in 2 second. And so on...
It is mostly a SH or Sorc who is doing this. So they kill pet in 2 seconds. Than have 15 seconds to do damage on others. With just 2 seconds every 15 seconds they can turn off the whole class aka WL in a SC or orvr.

With Loner your damage is really bad and the WL is than the worst mdps class.

peterthepan3 wrote:

Aurandilaz wrote:

peterthepan3 wrote:Because wl burst is reliant on a pet that good players will dispose of in a heartbeat, rendering said burst null. Wh doesn't have such an achilles heel.

Had you done competitive pvp instead of moaning from a solo pov you'd know this. No healer should die to a wl if they're skilled/geared.

competitive pvp? does such a thing even exist? I thought most boisbands specialize in farming soloers and pugs these days
and when things get "competitive", it is time to kite to nearest WC

WH has an achilles heel, that would be mobility (no charge, no pounce and snare only if you Snapshot someone who doesnt strafe, backleap 30 sec CD and mostly reserved for saving your own life) - not to mention having to face similar frontline conditions as WL or slayer but doing it without medium armour.

can the wh mechanic be nullified in under 2/3 seconds?

Wl needs the burst otherwise it offers nothing to a group. Wh has much better sustained and group utility too.

it does exist but wouldn't expect you to know

If you didn't yet realize, WH has a burst that happens twice a minute, if not once, due to ability CDs. WL meanwhile keeps constant pressure and when snared simply pounces to target anyway; leaving the WH behind with a bunch of snares slowing it down.
Also if you haven't noticed, every fotm-order team seems to run either with at least one WL, or in many cases 2 WLs, simply because that is current state of game "balance".

Atropik posted above a long list of why WL is the current king of DPS (and if you bring forth mara argument, yes they need to get hit by nerfbat too - the current armour debuffs are game wrecking)

If the poor WLs have it so "hard" with their 15 second pet CD, ask yourself why still every "pro-boisband" premade consists of a WL that pounces from one lowbie target to the next, hitting them with pet KD and arm debuff and pack hunt killing people left and right...

(hint, it's the same shitty game "balance" that caused live servers to lose players who kept trying on non-fotm classes until most of them quit, resulting in servers dying one by one)

as for your claims of competitive pvp, 1-2 Caledor Wood scenarios against less-fotm enemy groups per week hardly count, most of time all the boisbands just farm pugs (as is tradition in Warhammer)

Yep best thing to say when it comes to why not nerv Wl is but marauder. Honestly marauders are a smaller threat to most setups than Wl is. The only case where marauder is slightly better is in cases where both sites run the same meele Setup. In every setup however which run range dds wl will just outshine marauder by far cause wl is a mobility beast. You 6v6 players always compare balance between your perfect setup but other setups should have been brought in line long ago cause it's just bad for a game to allow the same classes in the meta for years.
+Can we talk about the ridiculls pull on wl utilized as second cc just plain annoying. Flying time should should be adjusted on both + an minimal range added.

@Aurandilaz Saying that a WL can make constant pressure just shows me that you dont know the Class. Because that is simply wrong.
Two WLs are for sure good in oRVR to farm pugs (Like 2 SH or 2 dps SHM are). You want to make balance changes because of bad players?

But in an competitive environment they are not. They use one WL rather because of the Armor Debuff. If WL would not have it. The Class probably would not get a spot in an competitve group.