Return of Reckoning

Waaghtastic wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2023 2:15 pm
- instead of answering to my message t.

Ah, you need some attention too. Okay, you got it, now you can go.

If only there were more than one exit out of the spawn in Cairn

Akalukz wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2023 3:01 pm

lemao wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2023 2:44 pm

Akalukz wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2023 2:32 pm Scenarios with King of the Hill are fail for the most part and only highlight the disparity in the poo match making system. Thunder Valley and Blood used to be good pug vs premade scenarios because you had to watch all the points, they changed that sometime and made it premade win only basically. They did a similar thing with Riekland hills game, used to be fairly good scenario until they changed the mechanic to favor premades.

If would say they did the exact opposite, they made them better.
Instead of purely people capping flags and running away from fights, they forced them to PVP instead of PVE. Sounds way more fun to me.

Depends on the perspective of premade vs non premade players. If by farming people who have no chance at winning is what you call fun, they yeah i guess it is.

EDIT; i disliek both being in a premade and pugging scenarios, they are predictable and stale. 99% of the time the match winner is decided in first minute. There is very little chance or tactics that change it. ORvR is full of chance. About only time i do scenarios is when required to do so for live Events. Win or Lose in scenarios they suck overall.

Premade vs premade is often decided right at the start too, as there groups with various level of coordination and gear.
In the end the stronger team wins, even if you match pugs only with pugs.

Order premade just goes straight to destro spawn and camp they dont even bother with objectives.

Thunder valley used to be one of the best SC's and now it reeks.
Same with this one.
Zerging the middle is so boring it just ends up in a never ending pillow fight, ive seen players surrendering even when winning simply to finish the yawn fest.
And yes it also favours premades.

Any well made scenario needs to have options for the winning side and the losing side, if you're team is losing you need an alternative option, that's what the original thunder valley / BOTBC provided.
Because if you don't then the losing side will simply stop leaving the spawn point and surrender and i don't blame them.
Push it further and they will stop joining SC's entirely which is something we have seen plenty of already.

I have a feeling the original Khaines embrace SC used to have 3 flags, and i bet it was BETTER when it did, now its stalemate hell.
This is why skirmish maps are WAY superior in design to most SC maps, thank the gods that exists and pray they don't change.

Sulorie wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2023 4:33 pm

Akalukz wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2023 3:01 pm

lemao wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2023 2:44 pm

If would say they did the exact opposite, they made them better.
Instead of purely people capping flags and running away from fights, they forced them to PVP instead of PVE. Sounds way more fun to me.

Depends on the perspective of premade vs non premade players. If by farming people who have no chance at winning is what you call fun, they yeah i guess it is.

EDIT; i disliek both being in a premade and pugging scenarios, they are predictable and stale. 99% of the time the match winner is decided in first minute. There is very little chance or tactics that change it. ORvR is full of chance. About only time i do scenarios is when required to do so for live Events. Win or Lose in scenarios they suck overall.

Premade vs premade is often decided right at the start too, as there groups with various level of coordination and gear.
In the end the stronger team wins, even if you match pugs only with pugs.

100% agree, that's probably why i dislike scenarios especially those that only have 1 avenue to win. IE King of the Hill

Objectives only matter when one side can't simply kill the other and camp spawn.

So objectives barely matter in this game since like 90% + of scens end in surrender.

CountTalabecland wrote: Sat Feb 18, 2023 7:14 pm Objectives only matter when one side can't simply kill the other and camp spawn.

So objectives barely matter in this game since like 90% + of scens end in surrender.

Well atleast there used to be a possibility to punt and fight from safety when you were pushed back to spawn. Barriers kinda destroy all of that. Got a tryhard meele premade facing you? Alright time to not even try. I still don't understand the benefit of this. Just leads to an 100% immediate snore fest if one side is at an advantage.

Even happens if a pug vs pug gets killed the first time. I say rarely but it happened often enough where you used to be able to turn the sc around if you had an unlucky start. No way you can turn the sc around if some start to stay behind the barrier. I mean as a ranged dd that requires kiting to not evaporate why would you excit the barrier into a meele train...just plain bad design and opposite of the original devs that also added cannons to give a further advantage when pushed to spawn.

But, but the barriers will make them better with the time, isnt it?

Let's face it, there were never valid reasons for the barriers besides certain areas like Altdorf throne room order spawn during city siege or in general areas where npc guards can't be used as spawn protection.