Return of Reckoning

Neznan wrote: Fri Oct 24, 2025 3:37 pm The guy, who play WL and make a decisions as "Ballance Team member" - have done all that WL's pull was always WIN-WIN situation.

No matter what your opponent do - speeding up, hiding behind objects, increase distance, use "jupm off" abilities or any other possible abilities - IT DOES NOT MATTER. Pull will always works!!!

I've seen you. Let's just say that your positioning and decision making, while still good compared to the most of SHs on this server, still not good enough compared to top SHs.

Avernus wrote: Fri Oct 24, 2025 4:56 pm

Neznan wrote: Fri Oct 24, 2025 3:37 pm The guy, who play WL and make a decisions as "Ballance Team member" - have done all that WL's pull was always WIN-WIN situation.

No matter what your opponent do - speeding up, hiding behind objects, increase distance, use "jupm off" abilities or any other possible abilities - IT DOES NOT MATTER. Pull will always works!!!

I've seen you. Let's just say that your positioning and decision making, while still good compared to the most of SHs on this server, still not good enough compared to top SHs.

I agree with you and that is the point - need skill to play other classes, while need nothing to be WL.
No matter if you skilled or dumb - if play WL, you can be very good anyway.

Neznan wrote: Fri Oct 24, 2025 5:22 pm I agree with you and that is the point - need skill to play other classes, while need nothing to be WL.
No matter if you skilled or dumb - if play WL, you can be very good anyway.

There is indeed no skill needed as AoE wb WL. As for solo - it's not that easy, sadly. Still, i do agree that, while not the best solo class, is quite good at this.

There are clearly benefits to both Marauder pulls and White Lion pulls. The White Lion pull is very effective in small-scale fights, while the Marauder pull excels in large-scale (blob) engagements. The WL pull can be parried and isn’t spammable, which makes it especially good against ranged DPS and healers. The Mara pull, on the other hand, can be disrupted, is spammable, and works best against melee DPS.
I understand that latency can sometimes make the pulls feel inconsistent.
I have a RR 90 White Lion and a RR 50 Marauder. From what I see, 90% of players in RvR act like pulls don’t exist—they complain about them but don’t offer any counterplay. If you pay attention and use your crowd control properly, you can avoid most pulls.
Classes are not mirrors. Stop comparing isolated abilities between classes and calling it “unbalanced.” It makes no sense and doesn’t help the discussion at all.

WL is so 'mediocre' that destro simply stopped playing healers because you will be killed by WL as soon as you are within range of pull\pounce.
However, there will always be someone who says that it is not strong enough.
A few days ago, I created a trolling thread, posted a screenshot of wp dps with rvr wc buff, and dozens of people who didn't know about wc buff said it was normal and fair. Although this thread was not intended for trolling, we got the same result.

DiMakss wrote: Fri Oct 24, 2025 5:48 pm WL is so 'mediocre' that destro simply stopped playing healers because you will be killed by WL as soon as you are within range of pull\pounce.
However, there will always be someone who says that it is not strong enough.
A few days ago, I created a trolling thread, posted a screenshot of wp dps with rvr wc buff, and dozens of people who didn't know about wc buff said it was normal and fair. Although this thread was not intended for trolling, we got the same result.

Most of destro healers are just not good enough. To be fair, the same is true for most of the order healers.

Those guys a dying not just from pulls but from anything that looks funny at them.

Good pvp healers can't be killed by 1 dps. Ever.

Avernus wrote: Fri Oct 24, 2025 5:53 pm Good pvp healers can't be killed by 1 dps. Ever.

In an imaginary world, where you create a character rr80 with the best equipment, of course. But in the real world, you create a destro healer, you get pulled and killed. And after 100 iterations, you switch to a tank.

DiMakss wrote: Fri Oct 24, 2025 6:01 pm

Avernus wrote: Fri Oct 24, 2025 5:53 pm Good pvp healers can't be killed by 1 dps. Ever.

In an imaginary world, where you create a character rr80 with the best equipment, of course. But in the real world, you create a destro healer, you get pulled and killed. And after 100 iterations, you switch to a tank.

While you're right to some extent

DevanShell wrote: Fri Oct 24, 2025 5:43 pm From what I see, 90% of players in RvR act like pulls don’t exist—they complain about them but don’t offer any counterplay. If you pay attention and use your crowd control properly, you can avoid most pulls.

The guy already said everything (and more, but there is no reason to quote the rest).

The problem with a BiS single-target White Lion (high crit chance, high strength, medium weapon skill) is that it performs extremely well against lower-geared players (anything below Sovereign) who have low armor and low anti-crit.
As a BiS WL, I can’t kill a BiS DoK. Sometimes I get lucky against a BiS Shaman or Zealot, but that usually requires lucky crits and using M3 — and even then, they often have to make mistakes, like missing their detaunt.
When I say “BiS healer,” I mean one with proper BiS gear and full defensive talismans.

DevanShell wrote: Fri Oct 24, 2025 6:04 pm The problem with a BiS single-target White Lion (high crit chance, high strength, medium weapon skill) is that it performs extremely well against lower-geared players (anything below Sovereign) who have low armor and low anti-crit.
As a BiS WL, I can’t kill a BiS DoK. Sometimes I get lucky against a BiS Shaman or Zealot, but that usually requires lucky crits and using M3 — and even then, they often have to make mistakes, like missing their detaunt.
When I say “BiS healer,” I mean one with proper BiS gear and full defensive talismans.

Yeah, more or less the same. And missing your detaunt is a critical fail for a healer, you can't be called a good healer if you do that. (assuming you are the only viable target).