Return of Reckoning

Ysaran wrote: Tue May 07, 2019 12:01 pm
How have you applied toughness mitigation to you calculation? It's not clear to me

Sulorie wrote: Tue May 07, 2019 12:43 pm Try to add armor debuff like any phys. DD is meant to use and then see how much less efficient your armor penetration becomes, as debuff is applied first.

jasonX wrote: Tue May 07, 2019 1:47 pm

Sulorie wrote: Tue May 07, 2019 12:43 pm Try to add armor debuff like any phys. DD is meant to use and then see how much less efficient your armor penetration becomes, as debuff is applied first.

SW armor debuff goes max at -900 armor (at max scout skill tree, which never is the case but anyway lets go by that)

So
Case 1 with ballistics capped. same calculations till armor
2800-900=1900 1900*(1-42,4%)= 1094 armor which is around 25% damage mitigation
660*(1-25%)= 495 dmg (with 500 toughness its 660-100=560 560*(1-25%)= 420 dmg)

Case2 with weaponskill stack. same calculations till armor
1900*(1-51.4%)=923 armor which is around 21% damage mitigation
626*(1-21%)= 495 dmg (with 500 toughness its 626-100=526*(1-21%)= 415 dmg)

So if the target has 500 toughness and 2800 armor as cloth then stacking ballistics and taking into account toughness mitigation you get to deal 5 damage more.......... which can very easily be within the margin of error rounding up numbers plus no SW really goes all the way up the Scout tree to get that full 900 armor debuff. Making an estimation as usually engineers do i consider the damage to be equal in both cases
a) IF the target has no more than 2800 armor (which is rarely the case since the most light armored ones stacking armor gems can easily get to that number)
b) IF the target has >500 toughness (which, lets face it, is not a usual amount of toughness, most people have around 200-300)
c) IF the SW has a full scout tree spec up to the top (which is almost never the case)

Damn i love maths!!!

Aurandilaz wrote: Tue May 07, 2019 2:27 pm 350dmg on a highly defensive toughness stacking target is pretty much normal. Which is why you bring variety of tools like armor debuff, toughness debuff into the play and "assist" with other dps to burst someone down.
Other dps also face same defensive calculations. They stack similar high 900-1000mainstats.

Your SW has the benefit of being able to pewpew from range. Melee do not have said benefit. SW benefit over Engi is being able to be more mobile and not tied to a fast exploding pet.

BW/Sorc pay for more dmg via crit/suicide mechanic. SW does not have suicide mechanic.
WH/WE pay by going as light armor into melee range with limited defences where they can stab enemies with Torment/AW. You do not need to go close range to finish enemies as SW.
SL/Choppa pay for their Berserk mechanic by having even less defences than light armored targets, and exploding like freenown pinatas if not properly carried by team in most fights, they pay high cost for high dmg returns.
Mara/WL sure can be an anomaly with decent risk when engaging as medium armor mdps, but also risk death at frontlines, and if excluding WL burst from calculations, have generally mediocre dmg output but also mediocre risk.

I am not sure where you expect your SW to stand, when taking into account 1) no pet handicap 2) not forced into melee range 3) can switch stances to gain benefits from Assault armor which can make you tankier than most melee can dream of 4) generally able to pick fight from range and kite so much enemy never catches you 5) access to ranged CC

Maybe in your ideal world SW gets bonus from Berserk without handicap, Stealth without handicap, Pounce without handicap (oh wait...nvm), massive armor without handicap (wait a sec...nvm)

Ysaran wrote: Tue May 07, 2019 2:17 pm
Maths is surely great, but... You have to use the right formula to make it work properly!
The damage you RECEIVE from enemies attack is calculated as:
Damage + offstatmod * (offstat - yourtoughness) + weapondps * dpsmod. Now game check for crit and then armor mitigation happen.
So you calculations are too approximate to be considered worthy since you don't consider the variables "offstatmod", "weapondps" and "dpsmod". The reality is that only devs can calculate damage accurately.
Note1: I stole the formula from RoR FB official page, if you want the source I can edit this post later, now I'm not at pc.
Note2: I'm not sure what "Damage", maybe it's skill damage? I'm not sure about it