Conversely, if you don't play a given class or part of the game, and then modify it, you are accused of tinkering in ignorance. I do what I feel needs doing, as I feel it needs doing. If SM or any class that I might main at any given time becomes a part of that (and I might add that I often main a class specifically because it is or was underpowered), then that's going to happen and I will simply ignore suggestions of bias outright as cheap attempts to get an easy revert.
Re: Close Combat
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 8:57 am
by Telen
Problem I have with alot of the changes recently is they seem designed around a certain blob playstyle. Turning SH into a melee train god, giving choppa a blob pull. All you see destro do in the lakes now is blob around hoovering up the smaller side. Instead of inventing new abilities that encourage zerging, favour greater numbers and make kiting the blob around harder, you just cant when all the tanks and mdps are sucked into the blob never to return or pounced and the aoe kb into the mincer, maybe take a more big picture design philosophy. I get they were theorycrafted around smallscale but it was obvious how it would benefit melee train zerging.
Re: Close Combat
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 9:40 am
by Bozzax
Close combat is not the issue I even doubt anyone use it.
E: Yeah I know get guards, detaunt, drop rage and heals plus kill the pet.
E2: it really is pathetic
Re: Close Combat
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 9:51 am
by Valfaros
Spoiler:
Azarael wrote: ↑Sat Aug 18, 2018 8:47 am
Conversely, if you don't play a given class or part of the game, and then modify it, you are accused of tinkering in ignorance. I do what I feel needs doing, as I feel it needs doing. If SM or any class that I might main at any given time becomes a part of that (and I might add that I often main a class specifically because it is or was underpowered), then that's going to happen and I will simply ignore suggestions of bias outright as cheap attempts to get an easy revert.
I certainly didn't want to accuse anybody of bias with some exceptions I think you do pretty good. Maining most/all classes is a way to reduce unaware bias aswell in which case you are already doing the best you can to have an unbiased opinion. I don't know how things work on your side but I guess you already discuss the balance changes as a team. If the people responsible for balance in that team cover all classes/most specs I would expect a pretty unbiased balance if classes/specs are lacking I would advise a double thought on those cases.
We also have seen in another post that opinions differ from where you should balance which is why my view on for example guardian wl might be shifted from the view of others (I think balance should happen with everything in mind from 1v1 to warband).
So back to topic.
I think the close combat tactic is a good attempt to reduce the importance of guard which is something I like. Making group combinations lacking tanks (2/4 or 2/3/1) possible. Ideally I would like to have a similar possibility for a range dps to play without guard in a premade but their strengh in pug play makes this quite difficult to introduce. Classes like guardian wl that overperform with this tactic should be looked at (as you already confirmed) seperatly.
Re: Close Combat
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 9:52 am
by Bozzax
It is not the tactic it is 6-9k burst + mobility in def build
WLs currently can 2-3 gcd butst most anything within 65”
Re: Close Combat
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 10:25 am
by Danord
Bozzax wrote: ↑Sat Aug 18, 2018 9:52 am
It is not the tactic it is 6-9k burst + mobility in def build
WLs currently can 2-3 gcd butst anything within 65”
Im certain its 1 gcd.
Re: Close Combat
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 11:12 am
by peterthepan3
Telen wrote: ↑Sat Aug 18, 2018 8:57 am
Problem I have with alot of the changes recently is they seem designed around a certain blob playstyle. Turning SH into a melee train god, giving choppa a blob pull. All you see destro do in the lakes now is blob around hoovering up the smaller side. Instead of inventing new abilities that encourage zerging, favour greater numbers and make kiting the blob around harder, you just cant when all the tanks and mdps are sucked into the blob never to return or pounced and the aoe kb into the mincer, maybe take a more big picture design philosophy. I get they were theorycrafted around smallscale but it was obvious how it would benefit melee train zerging.
MeleeSH and choppa changes are warbandcentric; it is people's choice to blob up. The changes aren't made around blobbing, and to assert otherwise is, frankly, ridiculous - especially from someone who is familiar with how balance in RoR has been conducted thus far.
Re: Close Combat
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 11:35 am
by hammerhead
You declare that this is where you're making your stand, and nothing will make you change your mind. You are almost guaranteed to block up to the next 4 attacks made against you within 10 seconds, and you will deal xx damage back to the attacker each time you block. In additional 6 group members within 100 feet become Unshakable for given time granting immunity to all pull effect.
very warband centric change for 13pt IB skill i think
Re: Close Combat
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2018 11:39 am
by peterthepan3
hammerhead wrote: ↑Sat Aug 18, 2018 11:35 am
You declare that this is where you're making your stand, and nothing will make you change your mind. You are almost guaranteed to block up to the next 4 attacks made against you within 10 seconds, and you will deal xx damage back to the attacker each time you block. In additional 6 group members within 100 feet become Unshakable for given time granting immunity to all pull effect.
very warband centric change for 13pt IB skill i think
Not bad at all for Oathstone, but belongs in proposals section!
Close combat is not the issue I even doubt anyone use it.
E: Yeah I know get guards, detaunt, drop rage and heals plus kill the pet.
E2: it really is pathetic
11:36:32 8hits 5k ish damage from the pet only, immune to all cc's, while the owner getting hit for 120-150ish. i see x3 1k+ hit from the pet lol
hunter/axeman have a good burst too, but can be bursted down since hes squishy. the pet hit for 150 at best and hes easily counterable by cc's.
Guardian on the other hand is a tank, with a dps next to him w/o ap nor gcd that dish 5k in 1 sec, plus a better version of resolute def. since it remove all cc's like a trinket on 30 sec cd.
