Return of Reckoning

pvprangergod wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 9:37 am Solution:
1. Delete ranked

Do not delete ranked but any reward u can get from it.

BluIzLucky wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 8:37 am
snip

Good post. I agree on pretty much all points.

From what I've seen replied by the devs/gms though, I fear the worst. They seem reluctant both to acknowledge that Ranked is dealing with some major issues, and that there are solutions for those issues. There's an entire community of Ranked players who desperately want Ranked to live and have been extremely vocal and constructive.


The arguments we've seen from the devs/gms almost make me wonder if they are playing the same game. They boil down to:

> Do not expect rewards for losing.

No one is asking for rewards for losing. And it is not just players who lose that voice their concerns; it's virtually everyone, including those who are 1k mmr+ and are actually working towards or have already gotten their Triumphant accessory.


> Every class can reach 1k mmr+.

By playing the system, sure. Even a rr60 could reach 1000 mmr if they played the system hard enough. However, that type of behavior is contrary to what many players believe a Ranked game mode should be about and it is one of the things that pushes people away. This type of argument leads me to believe that the devs/gms do not understand the nature of playing the system (aka, queue-stacking, cherry-picking, assassinating, etc.), or they are fine with it. They will not acknowledge this is a problem, and that is very worrying.

I sincerely doubt whether any of the devs/gms have attempted Ranked with a non-meta class and without playing the system.


> If you do not like Ranked, it is not meant for you.

Essentially what shines through much of their arguments, is that the devs believe that if you are not enjoying Ranked it is not because Ranked has some serious issues, but because you are not good enough to deserve the rewards, unwilling to "do what it takes" (ergo. playing the system) and simply looking for a handout. All of this conveniently ignores that much of the worries that have been expressed come from experienced and successful players.


The sad thing is, players want Ranked to succeed and many (including myself) have been waiting for a game mode like this for a long time. Now the issues are being ignored in a head-in-sand kind of way, and the group of players who were interested in Ranked is rapidly shrinking. If, Khorne forbid, Ranked were to die, I am sure it would be blamed on the lack of a community or players not being up to the challenge. I've said it before and I'll say it again: if that were to happen, it is because serious issues were ignored. The interest is and has been there, it is just being extinguished by stubbornness.

Lets hope that I am wrong, and that the replies that this thread has garnered from the devs are not representative of their actual views on Ranked. Maybe they are working on solutions in the background, but their response to this thread hasn't been indicative of that.

I think we're already seeing some of the initial enthusiasm waning in the low mmr bracket. I was waiting 30-45 min for a ranked pop between 7-9 pm server time this weekend as SM. There were queuers and active games, but I guess not enough 0 mmr. So I only ended up play 2 games, one went ok and one we lost because of a WH who dropped like a sack of bricks and went afk.

The opportunity cost is you can't do anything else except craft maybe while you wait. Other sc's? Go to the end of the ranked line again when you get out. Orvr or pve? Sure ditch your group when you pop, I guess possible if you are in a pug they may not care.

I want it to be good and want to improve myself, but it's not jiving right now.

Simple fix, make it so only groups can do it because there is little point in doing it solo as the only thing I find I get pitted against is the order prefab 2 Knights, 2 Slayers and lo and behold 2 warrior priests. It's time to just put hands up and say there needs to be a change, we're not going to say I told you so but an acknowledgement that things could be better would certainly be a step to improving dev - player relationships.

Strakar wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 2:17 pm I think we're already seeing some of the initial enthusiasm waning in the low mmr bracket. I was waiting 30-45 min for a ranked pop between 7-9 pm server time this weekend as SM. There were queuers and active games, but I guess not enough 0 mmr. So I only ended up play 2 games, one went ok and one we lost because of a WH who dropped like a sack of bricks and went afk.

The opportunity cost is you can't do anything else except craft maybe while you wait. Other sc's? Go to the end of the ranked line again when you get out. Orvr or pve? Sure ditch your group when you pop, I guess possible if you are in a pug they may not care.

I want it to be good and want to improve myself, but it's not jiving right now.

Yea current MMR system is bad. Most of the time, it promotes people with luck, not with skill. There is RP with almost 1k mmr that just use instant heal. I want just ranked alive 24/7 not only on evening. We have many ppl with 100+games and still rating 0, when i see win ratio there is no way they go above 0. So remove mmr req to drop insignia and fix MMR system.

Most of us were waiting for season 2 and there is no difference with the preseason.

About class balance, for me every class is viable for ranked. There is only a problem with the players. For example, we only have 2 good WH, and this class have acces to win button.

pvprangergod wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 9:37 am Solution:
1. Delete ranked

Best solution right there. Nobody wants ranked but 30-40 people. Give all the rewards from ranked and put it is solo q sc's only. This way it is balanced and people can all join solo.

Or just remove ranked current setup and put something different. Remove the dumb 2,2,2 system and put in 6 randoms in an SC duel to the death. No MMR, no 2,2,2 just 6 people vs 6 people.

Bring back old Thunder Valley while you are at it.

sogeou wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 3:32 pm

pvprangergod wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 9:37 am Solution:
1. Delete ranked

Best solution right there. Nobody wants ranked but 30-40 people. Give all the rewards from ranked and put it is solo q sc's only. This way it is balanced and people can all join solo.

Or just remove ranked current setup and put something different. Remove the dumb 2,2,2 system and put in 6 randoms in an SC duel to the death. No MMR, no 2,2,2 just 6 people vs 6 people.

Bring back old Thunder Valley while you are at it.

This is only your opinion. Ranked for me the only thing i enjoy now. And when i see amount of ppl trying it for sure its not 30-40, system is just bad.

ranked is fine. the problem are the players itself. in rvr many players do brainless zerg, and in ranked the players, must learn to play their char and many forget what teamplay means, that is the problem.

the main problem are the players and not the system. what i see many players have no patience. if you want the gear from ranked, then players please learn to play your char, that is not hard that is very easy,if the players ise their brains.

i know is hard but it is truth.

Mergrim wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 3:38 pm

sogeou wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 3:32 pm

pvprangergod wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 9:37 am Solution:
1. Delete ranked

Best solution right there. Nobody wants ranked but 30-40 people. Give all the rewards from ranked and put it is solo q sc's only. This way it is balanced and people can all join solo.

Or just remove ranked current setup and put something different. Remove the dumb 2,2,2 system and put in 6 randoms in an SC duel to the death. No MMR, no 2,2,2 just 6 people vs 6 people.

Bring back old Thunder Valley while you are at it.

This is only your opinion. Ranked for me the only thing i enjoy now. And when i see amount of ppl trying it for sure its not 30-40, system is just bad.

No there is not more than that small amount of players listed. Less than 1% of the users play ranked. It is a very small amount of users. You add in the MMR it is lucky to have 20 people who can get matches to fill.

mogt wrote: ↑Mon Jul 19, 2021 4:21 pm ranked is fine. the problem are the players itself. in rvr many players do brainless zerg, and in ranked the players, must learn to play their char and many forget what teamplay means, that is the problem.

the main problem are the players and not the system. what i see many players have no patience. if you want the gear from ranked, then players please learn to play your char, that is not hard that is very easy,if the players ise their brains.

i know is hard but it is truth.

Your typical ORvR player going ranked...


You can always blame the player/user but generally it's the lazy approach.
And there's clearly some issues with RoR's ranked system that are partly promoted by the user and partly promoted by the system, and so far thankfully devs have taken steps to reduce them, this thread (and others) is trying to help them iron out the last bits.

Short history of ranked and where some of us are trying to go:
Preseason 2 : No incentives -> No/few players
Season 2 : Strong incentives for winning -> lots of players, lots of complaining
Season 3 : Strong incentives for doing your best -> lots of players, reduced complaining (hopefully)

and let's not call people lazy when it takes between 300-800 games to complete a single set..