Return of Reckoning

Vigfuss wrote:

Genisaurus wrote: [*]Zone locks prevent any objectives from being attacked for (15 * tier) minutes.

I think this is too long. Especially if we will have only one T3 zone. I'd suggest 10 mins max for any tier.

1 zone on t3 wil have no lock i bet 100% just like 1 zone of t2 didn't have it at the start.

Whit this sytem th rvr will be zerged and locked by order allways time all unbeattable premade BW and Slayers in scen and all warband order on lake. This system is just what is missing for zerg order side.

So, the above changes in question seem very reasonable. If I may add, would it be possible to include zone announcements just like when door / keep / lord is being hit?

Something to let us know how many VPs have been accumulated?
It would coordinate the factions in a way where priorities are addressed accordingly.

I don't think you should get a reward for just being in the zone, you should have to be flagged for RVR and out of the warcamp to get the points at least.

I don't think mailbox guarders should be punished because there are lots of reasons people might need to afk for a few mins in a safe spot, but they shouldn't get the rewards from RVR then.

I really hated having SCs count towards Victory points on live, and I'm going to hate it again. You and your warband could have won everything in RVR but the zone still doesn't flip because the aware players on the other side says screw it we aren't going to que up. The unaware players still que thought and end up hurting their sides war effort.

Also what's to stop the xrealmers from jumping from one side to the other to stop zones from flipping? One side stacks the other with AFK people to make it impossible to get the kills to beat the delay timer. People will farm empty keeps for hours for the best gear, what makes you think they won't engage in these tactics if you make it possible?

Although I like the scaling mechanic (more glory for the underdog) and restricting rewards to those actually in the fight, w/specific respect to xrealmers, was the idea of a lockout timer linked to RvR status floated ? I seem to recall hearing it was considered internally.

In AoC, you had a "10 min of non-combat status" lockout on feat spec swapping, and it definitely gave you pause to think on your choices regarding present build; seems like a similar mechanic could discourage opportunist xrealming. Admittedly, ppl would create second accts; but if IP-linked lock on faction was possible, such might not be a circumvention.

Seems like a faction lockout timer (say 30 mins?) based on leaving RvR status (w/tweaks to make sure ppl were not unflagged in RvR areas) would discourage mailboxers (if wc squat was nto valid for rewards) and xrealmers alike, w/o resorting to witch hunts on "is he a mailbox guard or not?" when someone was just organizing storage space due to being too new to realize there is a warehouse in the IC, or not wanting to spend the money and time to go there. The GM judgement calls on mailboxers alone would be neverending and, most likely, often completely ad hoc. What if someone had to use the restroom or respond to phone calls? Or had weird lag issues or his USB bus decided to suddenly ignore his game controller (tho enough times and I just trashed it )? Or was just reorganizing their UI profiles and hotbar assignments for the umpteeenth time because how I set it for toon X did not work quite right for toon Z. . .

If hard pressed to get the RvR flag to work right for this (I have been unflagged w/o realizing it, when standing right next to a BO), also adding combat as a preventative for timer release would solidify it, tho IMO that would encourage ppl to log off entirely, which might make them just quit; thus, not a recommended rules option.

I disagree w/all those QQing that ppl playing more than one faction in non-abusive moderation is inherently wrong. "Know thy enemy" is a golden rule for victory IRL as well as in MMOs, and sometimes you just want to explore all the game has to offer. WAR/RoR has a distinct advantage of having character classes that do not always mirror other classes, and are relatively easy to lvl, resulting in a colorful change of scenery which inherently adds "replay value" to the game. A lockout timer would disallow the opportunistic aspect of xrealming, while still leaving open the overall value fo the game for those who want to explore it. Assuming, ofc, that IP lockout on faction swap were possible, otherwise ppl would just take a bit more effort and make second accts.

Again, tho scaling and restricting rewards to ppl in the lake are good ideas, in and of themselves, tho IDK if they would actually prevent xrealming. An unstoppable zerg is attractive, scaled VP or not. Personally, I have only ever xrealmed on the rvr side of things once, when the guys on my side refused grps and KSd constantly. Sort of an "Oh, REALLY?" countermeasure.

Bignusty wrote:Whit this sytem th rvr will be zerged and locked by order allways time all unbeattable premade BW and Slayers in scen and all warband order on lake. This system is just what is missing for zerg order side.

Be quiet. Destro zergs just as much. You are biased.

Bignusty wrote:Whit this sytem th rvr will be zerged and locked by order allways time all unbeattable premade BW and Slayers in scen and all warband order on lake. This system is just what is missing for zerg order side.

What I often see is random destro players simply feeding the bomb groups at the keep, respawn and feed again. Why is RVR only a linear movement between the keep and the WC? VPs will not require anyone to attack a keep, so no need to feed. But people will probably still do it.

Vigfuss wrote:What I often see is random destro players simply feeding the bomb groups at the keep, respawn and feed again. Why is RVR only a linear movement between the keep and the WC? VPs will not require anyone to attack a keep, so no need to feed. But people will probably still do it.

IMO, w/o keeps as a major component, you have just random pvp. You can get that in any pvp game. In fact, non-rvr, totally open pvp games technically allow it even more, tho rvr tends to encourage ppl to pvp more than open pvp, as you don't have to watch your back vs your own ppl.

Wars have objectives, pretty much as a rule. Often, territory is the goal. This encourages TEAMWORK in achieving that goal. Random pvp may or may not reward such. All too often, it does not, instead encouraging KSing of individuals or competing grps.

Roaming is pointless if the bulk of the pop decides to relog out of the lake, in order to unflag because the totally random pvp is becoming annoying as all hell, or is crushing them. Then they can just laugh and wave their unmentionables at you whilst you slash in impotent rage because you cannot target them, while they lvl up via pve. Objectives give that slim hope that, despite odds, you can win vs a larger force by using good tactics to secure the goal, even if you drop heroically in the effort. They also focus pvp in a specific area, and make it so pvp (esp organized pvp, as such was the core of WAR, given that it was based upon a minis game where unit placement and cohesion was a big part of success) seems to have an actual reward/point.

As to the randoms feeding, they need to learn to not do that. Unless they are intentionally being gits and feeding friends, ofc. If I see AoE that can 2 shot me, I very pointedly hang the @#$% back, even as melee. But that's me.

I like some of the rvr ideas but with a few changes.
1. 2/3 zones should be open, what's the point of having 3 zones when only one is open, if the game only had 2 zones would make sense. If one faction is zerging or camping keep for defense, gives the other faction a chance to take other keeps. If your worried about not enough people, or they would be too spread out, it mabye only takes 1 wb to take a keep. If you've played last week in orvr Ostland, there's atleast 2 wb of order defending and 1-2 wb of destro.
2. Scs shouldn't affect realm flip
3. Only ppl in the bo area should receive the bonus.
4. When a keep or zone flips, if you participated in the battle, you receive full reward. If your in rvr lakes you only get half

SpikyBitz wrote:

Vigfuss wrote:What I often see is random destro players simply feeding the bomb groups at the keep, respawn and feed again. Why is RVR only a linear movement between the keep and the WC? VPs will not require anyone to attack a keep, so no need to feed. But people will probably still do it.

IMO, w/o keeps as a major component, you have just random pvp. You can get that in any pvp game. In fact, non-rvr, totally open pvp games technically allow it even more, tho rvr tends to encourage ppl to pvp more than open pvp, as you don't have to watch your back vs your own ppl.

Wars have objectives, pretty much as a rule. Often, territory is the goal. This encourages TEAMWORK in achieving that goal. Random pvp may or may not reward such. All too often, it does not, instead encouraging KSing of individuals or competing grps.

Roaming is pointless if the bulk of the pop decides to relog out of the lake, in order to unflag because the totally random pvp is becoming annoying as all hell, or is crushing them. Then they can just laugh and wave their unmentionables at you whilst you slash in impotent rage because you cannot target them, while they lvl up via pve. Objectives give that slim hope that, despite odds, you can win vs a larger force by using good tactics to secure the goal, even if you drop heroically in the effort. They also focus pvp in a specific area, and make it so pvp (esp organized pvp, as such was the core of WAR, given that it was based upon a minis game where unit placement and cohesion was a big part of success) seems to have an actual reward/point.

As to the randoms feeding, they need to learn to not do that. Unless they are intentionally being gits and feeding friends, ofc. If I see AoE that can 2 shot me, I very pointedly hang the @#$% back, even as melee. But that's me.

The other objectives will matter more with this idea. If you're outnumbered you don't need to feed them at the keep, and I hope to see more roaming groups instead of a zerg sitting in only one place. I'm probably being too optimistic, but you never know.