Return of Reckoning

With T4 approaching, getting renown ranks will be important again since you don't want to be the last one to get the new armor sets. With that being said, I think there is a huge discrepancy between Renown gain in Scenarios and Renown gained in oRvR. This might not be as apparent now since getting to rank 40 is easy regardless, but with Rank 80 that is going to change a lot.

I am running in a premade regularly. Even with us winning the majority of Scenarios we are miles behind oRvR RP gain. Even Scenarios with 30+ kills only give ~3000 Renown. A decent keep defense is about 60k renown, more if you run in a bombgroup.

I do realize that Scenarios are easier to join and there needs to be an incentive to do oRvR, but similar to how some people hate Scenarios, some people hate oRvR. All I ask for is to bring Scenarios more in line with oRvR

Yes, running bomb groups automatically gives you at least 50% more in bonus, because bombing.

Seriously though, to be fair, a keep defense can take a freaking long time, compared to a 15 mins SC. You're comparing apples and oranges. There might very well be something to it, but you need to compare an average renown / hour if you want to compare anything.

Also, Orvr is very random. Depends on so many factors, and I think that's why it's should be better when it's finally rolling. SCs are a pretty solid renown gain, if you have a premade going. Might not be that high / hour, but it's steady.

Scenario renown gain is very low. There is nothing to compare, it just is.

Razid1987 wrote: Seriously though, to be fair, a keep defense can take a freaking long time, compared to a 15 mins SC. You're comparing apples and oranges. There might very well be something to it, but you need to compare an average renown / hour if you want to compare anything.

The average renown gain in a scenario is probably around ~1000 renown. given that an average win is 1500 and a lose is ~500. With 10 minutes per Scenario, ignoring queue time, that means we get 6k renown per hour. If you run in a premade you can probably double that but we are still looking at 12k renown/hour. 60k renown for a keep defense means it's like 40 min of back and forth. I conceded the point that oRvR needs to give more Renown because it's less steady. It's also the main draw of Warhammer, I get that. But we are not talking about Scenarios giving slightly less, it's significantly less.

to be honest i don't understand how spamming aoe behind 300 other players warrants more renown/influence than a competitive 6v6 caledor woods but what do I know.
a lot of people don't like doing scenarios, and that's cool. a lot of us don't like orvr too, but i guess we have to frequent both paths sometimes to get to the final destination. what you do from then on is up to you!

Scenarios have their rewards, and so does ORvR, some would argue scenarios give too much, some that ORvR gives too much. However one thing is that in t4 the rewards for scenarios do increase due to the weapons, and now possibly the new rvr sets, so increasing the renown gain seems a bit overkill imo.

As Razzid says ORvR is random, its not instanced/controlled like scenarios are, so you cant get an average of renown gain, its always different every time you enter a lake and you could go hours with a very small amount of renown gain, or 30 minutes with a great gain. ORvR was always intended to give more renown and was supposed to always give greater rewards than any other aspect of the game, just how the game was designed and intended to be played, so I think equalizing the gains seems to take away from that imo.

The game is intended to be played in a plethora of different ways which is why there are different types of PvP encouraged via the game's mechanics, and why certain classes excel in specific types of combat and don't in others. I don't understand why ORVR should give greater rewards, but I am open to hearing you out.

The reason I state it should give more rewards is because it was always the main focus and attraction of the game, by all means I understand that people enjoy scenarios and not ORvR, but ORvR is really what Warhammer is all about, from the tabletop to the game, its all about the big fights, true war, the city sieges, keep takes etc, it's the entire point of the warhammer world, and as such is what keeps the game alive, whether from the giant zerg fights to the BO skirmishes ( I'm not saying scenarios should not reward people, they should, just that too much reward detracts from the heart of Warhammer )

As far is it was in the games design, here is a direct quote from MJ

"Finally, I want to close this out with a brief explanation about the role that we believe that oRvR should play in WAR. It’s really as simple as this, oRvR should be a major focus for leveling, item gain, etc. in WAR. Some of the systems are already in place and in Tier 4, oRvR is alive and well. On other Tiers, however, oRvR is not being engaged in as often as we had hoped when we launched WAR. Our goal is to ensure that oRvR is the place where players can level the fastest, get the best items and overall, have a great time while doing it. It is supposed to be riskier, more challenging but ultimately, more rewarding than any other place within WAR."

I feel that ORvR is already consistent with that design philosophy due to:
-City Sieges
-Absurd renown gain in ORvR
And now the devs are locking BiS RvR gear to ORvR in the lakes.

Its more about scenarios give disproportionately less renown than a few wipes in open and a keep flip. Not even counting the renown gain from kills(which usually come en masse), a keep flip with heavy fighting can reach 30-40k no problem. And this is a perfectly reasonable estimate for 2-3 hours during primetime.

peterthepan3 wrote:The game is intended to be played in a plethora of different ways which is why there are different types of PvP encouraged via the game's mechanics, and why certain classes excel in specific types of combat and don't in others. I don't understand why ORVR should give greater rewards, but I am open to hearing you out.

Pretty sure MJ stated this game's main focus was orvr (just like DAOC).

Edit: Ade beat me to it.