Return of Reckoning

Hello all fellow RoR players.
It has been some time that i was thinking about that proposal, especially after the new armor sets and weapons appeared. I would liek to say that i will write for DoK but the same applies to WP too, so feel free to edit DoK with WP.

1. Identify the issue.
With the dmg increase it is harder for DoK/WP to keep up the healing just like other healing classes can do. The issue here is that DoK/WP has small regeneration for SE/RF on his offhand. I am not saying it is not good. It worked fine when the only viable set was Annihilator. But now with conqueror and beastlord on table i believe it needs a little more attention.

2. Explain why it's an issue.
Now lets see why this is an issue. DoK/WP are the only classes that have the fastest group heals and because of that the cost is high (60 SE/RF). When fighting into RvR especially in a warband there are times that your group takes spike dmg and it is then when you are running out of heals. Let see it more analytical. With a regeneration rate of 8per second and with maximum pool of 250 you can cast 4 aoe heals in 4*1.5=6 secs and getting back 6*8=48 recource back.
That means that you need to w8 either 2 more second for another cast, or use Essence lash/Smite or cast Blood Offering/ Suplicaton to regain some or all of your resources. During this time is when you are useless for healing. As i said before that wasn't an issue when we had Anihhilator and SC weapons as end game items. But now the situation is more complex dmg is bigger than before while the healing per second a DoK/WP can provide is limited to his recources, no SE/RF no heals.


3. Propose a viable solution to the problem.
I can think 3 solution to this issue.

a) Increase the passive regenaration on offhand from 8 to 10 to all items from SC for renown 39 and above plus the purple subjugator.

b) Make blood offering/ suplication increase the passive regenaration for 4 more per second for 5 secs with 10 secs cooldown instead of channeling.

c) Both DoD/WP have a great tactic that increase the SE/RF by 35 when the hit. That has a 3 secs cooldown and 25% chanse to activate. Just remove the cooldown from this tactic and make it give 25 instead 35 per hit.

Now my personal opinion is that the most affective change will be option "C" because that will make DoK/Wp behave more like front line healer. It gives a risk to play more carefull because you need to be hitted in order to heal so it is a kind of melee healer, and i can be combined more easily with 2 swords or 2handed forthose that need to play pure lifetap spec on warbands.

Thx and w8ing for you opinion about that.

I'm not saying i disagree but let me make some points to consider:

1.) it's my recollection that the chalice regen here is actually better than it was on live. Please correct me if i've got that wrong. I think it will be a hard sell to get it increased even more.

2.) dok/wp were never meant to be a purely backline healtard. part of our mechanic is that in order to be the most efficient with SE management you really need to at least be somewhat melee hybrid. Essence lash is your friend and in order for it to be useful you need good positioning and you can't hide in the back lines. that's just one example. Take a look at your melee skills and see which ones will restore your SE best while still in a heal spec, i bet you'll find a couple that you can work into your rotation. Try being more of a midline healer, assist off your mdps a bit, you should find that you can heal and manage your SE much better. If you're relying purely on your offering to regain SE, imo you're doing it wrong.

Just my 2 cents.

Moving to Discussions.

CegeePegee wrote:I'm not saying i disagree but let me make some points to consider:

1.) it's my recollection that the chalice regen here is actually better than it was on live. Please correct me if i've got that wrong. I think it will be a hard sell to get it increased even more.

2.) dok/wp were never meant to be a purely backline healtard. part of our mechanic is that in order to be the most efficient with SE management you really need to at least be somewhat melee hybrid. Essence lash is your friend and in order for it to be useful you need good positioning and you can't hide in the back lines. that's just one example. Take a look at your melee skills and see which ones will restore your SE best while still in a heal spec, i bet you'll find a couple that you can work into your rotation. Try being more of a midline healer, assist off your mdps a bit, you should find that you can heal and manage your SE much better. If you're relying purely on your offering to regain SE, imo you're doing it wrong.

Just my 2 cents.

First of all thanks for moving it to discussions.

1) I remember they where better chalice reg than 8 on live i think 16one's where the top.

2) I agree about that, my play style is somewhere to middle lines so i can use essence lash to get some SE back. That's why i believe that option 3 is better for both DoK/WP.

Thanks

1) Best chalices had 10 on live. 8 in RoR.

2) Being in melee is pretty risky since group cleanse/AoE detaunt got nerfed.

This will be the only non-moderation-related post I make in this thread.

vouzou wrote: 3. Propose a viable solution to the problem.
I can think 3 solution to this issue.

a) Increase the passive regenaration on offhand from 8 to 10 to all items from SC for renown 39 and above plus the purple subjugator.

b) Make blood offering/ suplication increase the passive regenaration for 4 more per second for 5 secs with 10 secs cooldown instead of channeling.

c) Both DoD/WP have a great tactic that increase the SE/RF by 35 when the hit. That has a 3 secs cooldown and 25% chanse to activate. Just remove the cooldown from this tactic and make it give 25 instead 35 per hit.

Now my personal opinion is that the most affective change will be option "C" because that will make DoK/Wp behave more like front line healer. It gives a risk to play more carefull because you need to be hitted in order to heal so it is a kind of melee healer, and i can be combined more easily with 2 swords or 2handed forthose that need to play pure lifetap spec on warbands.

Thx and w8ing for you opinion about that.

First of all, having played my fair share of dok in warbands, and then testing other healclasses, I have to say that this is a valid issue. With the current cost/regen and super low healing numbers it is impossible to keep up a party through anything but fluffdamage.

In my opinion both change A and B are needed to get dok to a spot where it is viable again. Some may think this would be a bit out of line, but consider that doks have next to no ability to kite, no spikeheal and with the current ICD on Fueled Actions makes it pretty subpar considering the risk of positions yourself in range of for example a moraledump.

And I apologize if my formatting etc. is way off, never posted in a balance thread before.

Penril wrote:1) Best chalices had 10 on live. 8 in RoR.

2) Being in melee is pretty risky since group cleanse/AoE detaunt got nerfed.

This will be the only non-moderation-related post I make in this thread.

2) Thats a price Dok's /Wp's have to pay for balancing.

Don't whine in the Balance forums. Post something constructive following the rules - Penril.

Well that was my 2c about CM problem. If we could stay at melee then theres no much need for workarounds, especially with the new CM proc sets on the way.


To the OP - i like the 3rd option, but with no O-S**T button it just never will be worth the risk to get nuked. Also you will have outgoing healbebuff all the time.

Option C in combo with sigmars shield and or MB could create some Rofl moments...

Option B would make them both highly mobile... as well as increase casts per minute(not channeling).

Both would provide the DPS Builds with a significant Buff. Which I dont believe is intended.

Option A is Meh. Book/chalice regen from SC medallions is already raised from Live.

I disagree entirely with the OPs premise the RF regen is too low. These classes use both AP and their mechanic to heal. Increasing regen would simply lead to far more backline tank healers. Adding Option B would lead to this as well.

Making a tactic "mandatory" as a fix is flawed imo.